genuine question from atheist - view on Christanity and personal responsibility

[kentishgirl]

Hi - promise this isn't just Christian-baiting.

I've come to the conclusion that Christianity is a substitute for having a personal conscience or taking personal responsibility. Being a Christian is like having a 'get out of jail free card' in that you are taught God will forgive you anything. So you can do anything, as bad as you like, go and pray for forgiveness and move on, slate wiped clean, feeling great about yourself. So it doesn't matter if you do wrong. As an atheist, if I do something wrong, it's always with me, it's always on my conscience, so that makes me always try to do the right thing.
I didn't always think this way. It's the only way I can make any sense of something that happened to me at the hands of a couple of serious, committed Christians. One of them even works full time for a church. They did something terrible to me but have shown no remorse, no guilt, and made no attempt to make things right with me. I'm positive they prayed for guidance at the time and then forgiveness afterwards, and now all's good in their world, while I'm still dealing with the fall-out.
Am I really wrong in interpreting Christianity in this way? Isn't it true that it enables horrible behaviour by teaching you that if you do wrong, all you've got to do is pray for forgiveness afterwards, and you are ok, never mind the effect of what you did? Basically if God is your only judge, and forgiveness is guaranteed, it gives you permission to act like a right bastard as long as you say sorry to God afterwards? there's no personal responsibility for what you have done.

God is allowed to kill. He owns everything and everyone. There is no escape. Resistance is futile. Utterly pointless and ultimately worse.
Hell exists. About 1/3 of the population are going there.

That's beautiful Bluepen. Maybe Hillsong would be interested in using those as lyrics for their next big worship song? You'd get a cut of the royalties of course.

atthestroke added to this I know only too well the brutality if treatment of people with mental illnesses over the years, within the health service as well.
I know someone who underwent ECT and years of lithium treatment. Thankfully now he is well.

You don't have to look very far into history to find lobotomies, experimentation, forced sterilisation and forced late abortions though.

^of treatment. Typo.

Cobra have not shirked the responsibility for that recent tragedy. They are looking into dysfunctions within their whole society for answers.

^omitted Sweden at the beginning of that sentence. Typo.

Capsium: "Re interference: I was rather thinking the opposite way on. The interference preaches the stuff to do with death, murder, violence."

Whichever way round it is, and however the RF is delivered, you have two messages being delivered. One says, "God is allowed to kill. He owns everybody and everyone. there is no escape. Resistance is futile."; the other says "God is benevolent, full of love and wants you to be happy and healthy. By the way, love your enemies."

Cobra yep. 2 messages. One choice. Choose life!

You did the same thing on Friday when you appeared to believe that Christians never commit suicide

I apologise if it came across that I was disbelieving you.
I did think that at the time I made everything clear, both before and afterwards.

Would you like to talk about what has happened in your life as regards this?
Has something happened to someone you care about?
If it has, that is very tough.

Capsium: Re viruses: like the song, "... tomato, tomato, tomato, tomato, let's call the whole thing off..."

Except that the treatment for someone for a viral infection is administering antivirals. The treatment for someone with demons is what?

And, of course, there is no evidence for demons.

Depends on your definition of demons, Cobra.

CasualCobra. This sort of post comes up often.

I do think that people in general somewhat have a wrong view of God. Then rant and vent when He doesnt seem to fit the actual picture.

And in this, I blame christians and the church in general.

Christians and the church and general, over about the last 60 years, has chosen to very much sugar coat things.

The true picture, is that God is indeed loving, but peoples' part in it is the obeying.
Throughout the bible and beyond, obeying is crucial.

Capsium: "Re miracles: if you do not recognise the spiritual component all you see is the physical result / manifestation and declare it spontaneous, coincidence, unexplained"

I am sorry, I don't know to what this is a response. In general, having something unexplained means that further research and investigation is needed, not "God did it".

And antivirals are not offered for every virus. We do not have them for every virus. We also have an immune system to combat viruses. Stress is said to be bad for the immune system. Reassurance, rest and kindness, good (Godly) things, are said to be good for stress

Cobra showing your own cognitive biases there.

Capsium: "Re talking therapies: Jesus did not need many words to heal. No vain repetitions there. He spoke with absolute authority. The evil spirits entering the pigs meant death for them, they couldn't tolerate it, as evil is connected with death, corruption, despair."

So it was magic rather than talking therapy? Talking therapy, to my mind, is not an instantaneous cure.

But sorry cobra I have re read and realise now it was head who asked a questions about miracles.

good (Godly) things

You mean good things. Kindness and understanding are not the preserve of the religious.

Capsium: "Re scaffolding: the ancients possessed knowledge (Adam and Eve ate from the Tree of Knowledge) but not full appreciation of God. It was more difficult to be close to God before The Redemption Christ made available to us. They did not have the Comforter (Holy Spirit) live in the through Faith in Christ. In the OT The Holy Spirit is described as being kept in the Ark of the Covenant and put in the Temple. The priests were the ones to interact with the Holy Spirit, generally, and then they communicated God's messages back to the people."

Word salad. The ancients were able to envisage an invisible deity enough to commit genocide. Why would they not understand invisible microbes that a 4 year can comprehend?

Cobra Magic? The correct term is generally thought of as miracle.

I was just making connection with Talking Therapies and the power of the words we speak, as written about in the Bible.

Cobra Word salad? Well if you had exactly the same understanding and knowledge as me, we would think the same....?

Reassurance and rest only works with self limiting illness. For the bad boys humans had to develop real working stuff like medicines and operations. I don't think the bible is referred to much in A & E.

head Good things are not the preserve of the religious but they are Godly.

head you'd be surprised, I bet many people pray in A & E. Though I am thankful for A&E, they do good work

You'd have to establish that there even was a god before I could examine it's character.

head your own personal choice.