Is the Christian God's love unconditional?

[Woolmark]

Ok, some questions which have been playing on my mind, I am genuinely interested.

Surely his love is on the condition that you are a) a Christian and b) follow his rules?

Also, if God loves everyone as much as he does, why can't he save everyone by simply appearing to them? If I could save my children by doing this then I would in an instant, rather than turning up at the end and destroying the ones who weren't Christian.

you spread the gospel (if necessary, use words) but you spread what you believe. you can't do anything else. i might say 'this book is right' when it might not be right for you but reading it could bring peace to someone else. so, speak from what you believe and leave the rest to God.

i didn't know, when i had my nde, that it would become my mission to 'spread it'! i thought of it only as comfort for me as i found myself close to death and almost ready to go. but i share it as often as i can in case it comforts someone else, too.

I am a great one for leaving an awful lot of things to God.
Sometimes I feel like I am playing a great big game of pass the parcel.
Anything I cant do? Pray. Pass the problem/parcel. Now it is Gods problem to deal with it, or help me deal with it.

headinhands yes, you are right we are called to spread the gospel and I hope I do try and do it, but that is not by challenging people about their beliefs all the time. The two things are not the same. I hope to share God's love and I am always up for a theological discussion but that is not the same as always telling people what they believe is wrong.

pS I agree with capsicum!

Headinhands you said you were a Christian, was it a long time ago.

Few years now. Was a long process, still trying to get my head round it. I guess talking to Christians is a bit like trying to talk to my former self but you're all so darn different I've yet to have the 'oh that's how I thought' moment.

We are different parts of Christ's body, head

www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+12
[second part of this in particular]

headinhands we are all so different, you are right about that. are you dreading or looking forward to meeting 'your-former-self' on line?!

Can I ask why you chose to leave faith behind, if I can put it it that way? Feel free not to reply, to PM me or to spin me a total yarn! I'd never know.

Thanks for being open, but don't feel you have to be! I'm a nosy old !&$£!

Just trawling through the thread & loving it, some very thought provoking stuff!
You've got to be in it to win it Rolling on the floor laughing at this!

Sorry, Capsium, I mean laughing with you, not at you!

I don't mind talking about it at all, it's really nothing exciting. I went to church on and off since a child, the last time I attended as a believer was probably about 7 years ago. I was attending a few different churches in my town on and off.

I think over the next few years I was asking more logical questions, and I know as I say that you'll be thinking 'but I'm logical' and I'm sure you are but it's how I see it.

I was also exposed to very good critical thinking through an online acquaintance. I guess I started to use that on my own beliefs but not out and out. It still felt a bit naughty/scary to let myself think very critically.

Oh and the stargazing thing too. Thinking about cosmology led me to dig out Sagan's 'Cosmos' and other works, including The Pale Blue Dot which led me to think about religion. I've probably got some of that out of order but you get the gist of it. It was more like a tide coming in and out gradually as I felt ready to explore.

Do you feel happier headinhands? (thanks for sharing).

I don't know, if I am it's probably down to my thinking being straighter. Not much of an advert am I!

Thanks for being so open and honest headinhands. I just wondered if you felt drawn to these 'religion' boards. It is certainly nice to get to know people more! So often I find we are all madly posting away and it can be easy to forget we are all real people with our own thoughts and ideas. I often find it more of a miracle/ more of a surprise when people actually agree on something than when they disagree!

Woolmark I don't know if these musings are helping you at all! Not even sure if I have given you my musings on this topic as you posted it. I guess for me I do often wonder why God does things as he does and often feel that I could plan it all better! Huge pride there!

Of course, I can't!

I'm looking at the Organix advert as I type this... it says 'No junk promise', always organic, nothing unnecessary, setting standards! I kind of feel God is a bit like the opposite of this. There is lots of junk in this world and I never know how he tolerates it all. I mean real junk, stuff that makes you cry and I never know why the world is as screwed up as it is. It's not always perfect, loads of things are unnecessary, there are standards but I know I fail them all the time! But for me Woolmark I don't feel his judgement all the time, or wrath or fear, I feel his presence in the people who are loving and kind, and also in the stillness, and in the worship. I have found him in the church, even though I know the church has done lots of things wrong, and continues to make mistakes. And at times I feel it is confusing, yet in that confusion there are times of bliss and peace, and the fruit of that is that it makes me want to go out and do better, be better. Not because he wouldn't let me in, not because there is a no junk policy, but because there is a reclaiming and transforming policy. One of my favourite stories is the story of the Transiguration, talked about in 2 Peter 1:16-18, The Message (MSG)

16-18 We weren’t, you know, just wishing on a star when we laid the facts out before you regarding the powerful return of our Master, Jesus Christ. We were there for the preview! We saw it with our own eyes: Jesus resplendent with light from God the Father as the voice of Majestic Glory spoke: “This is my Son, marked by my love, focus of all my delight.” We were there on the holy mountain with him. We heard the voice out of heaven with our very own ears.

Even more than this I have heard such amazing stories of people's lives transformed. It is this power to transform that is so amaizing. Anyway, not sure I am making sense....

Off to be now!

Off to bed now!

If god's love is unconditional, why does it matter if we believe or not?

Quite msmiggins.

Quite gold. And if it is conditional how does god dish it out fairly?

He dishes it out by his book of rules.
If we dont think it is fair, we have to think or bend to Him, not the other way round.
I am not going to argue with Him in a hurry!

God loves us all, unconditionally. However for us to receive His love we have to believe.

In Heaven you are at one with God. How can you be at one with God if you don't believe in Him?

Or if your own love is unrequited, would/could you force someone to love you/be with you?

msmiggins how can you experience something if you do not believe in it?

Golddigger what do you mean he dishes it out by a book of rules? The Bible? The Bible is full of stories of people who are unworthy, not doing things well, including some of the 'top' people like King David who royally screwed up.

Yet the overall message is one of forgiveness and love. That is how I read it. I know there are lots of negative passages and bits that are hard to understand and I do not believe it is a rule book.

The Bible contains rules yet God shows that those rules do bend. The punishment for sin is death (in that we are all born into a fallen world and will die) yet the story of Jesus, if you choose to believe it, tells of a God who came to die in others place. Of course you or others may not believe it at all. Which I totally understand.

If you don't believe in the person or entity offering love how can you feel that love?

King David. He only did one thing wrong, acording to the bible and to God, about a woman.

But yes, if you are a Christian and if you say sorry and mean it, you are forgiven. Your sins are wiped out. You are not expected to make the same mistake again. But if you do and say sorry, and mean it, you are forgiven.

I think being a Christian is about recognising human fallibility and that we are be Redeemed through accepting Christ. This fallibility is the 'sin' aspect of us. By confessing it (fallibility) and believing that Christ can change us, Redeem us, we are Saved.

Even though I am Saved I still have a mortal flesh, that is fallible. I have to learn to rely on God, Christ's work, communicated to me through The Holy Spirit (which is with me and in The Bible), not my own thoughts, feelings and experiences.

I might not even be conscious of all my sins, but have Faith in the Redemption Christ bought us /me.