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Philosophy/religion

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Original poster

YEC 2

999 replies

Januarymadness · 24/04/2013 21:05

Right I am going to bite. I shouldnt have looked at the facebook but I did.

Mr Ruggles you have made some horrible accusations. You have claimed everyone who disagreed with you was an atheist who lacked logic and reasoning. You were wrong on ALL counts. Many people told you they were Christian or Theists, they just didn't agree with you. The thread was also full of valid scientific arguments which were well worded and full of logic and reasoning.

You have also accused us all of being bullies. Something I saw no evidence of. Not agreeing with someone is not bullying.

So please do feel free to justify your off board comments here as speaking behind peoples backs is really not on.

Please could someone link to the old thread. Thanks

OP posts:

PedroYoniLikesCrisps · 10/05/2013 20:23

How crass.

I'm sorry should be giving more consideration to someone?

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:25

The trouble is that where gods are believed to exist, mere mortals can then claim to have a special relationship with the god(s) - and abuse their positions of trust.

Blair & Bush claimed to have a 'special relationship' and they abused their positions of trust. Are we to believe, then, that they are gods? Or can we agree that even where gods do not exist this abuse of relationships can also happen?

PedroYoniLikesCrisps · 10/05/2013 20:26

You implied it

No I didn't

PedroYoniLikesCrisps · 10/05/2013 20:27

Jewcy, why do you insist on suggesting that because someone says something exists in religion that it must not exist outside it? You have a real problem with understanding.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 10/05/2013 20:29

Btw, a scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of knowledge that has been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment.

It is very different from the 'non-scientific' definition of the word.

So what pedro wrote is really not a paradox.

LizzyDay · 10/05/2013 20:30

"Blair & Bush claimed to have a 'special relationship' and they abused their positions of trust. Are we to believe, then, that they are gods? Or can we agree that even where gods do not exist this abuse of relationships can also happen?"

Of course - it's about power, and possibly a big old dose of delusion. Just like religion.

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:31

Show me a religion which gives women more power than men

Why should women have more power than men?

..or even equal would do

Jesus appeared to Mary Magdalene after His resurrection before he chose to appear to His disciples. He loved women. He respected women. He chose Mary, His right-hand woman. Mary was bestowed massive kudos by Jesus.

FWIW I despair at 'power'. I'm not a feminist, though. I feel no special allegiance to other women, sorry.

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:32

...but I don't think that will surprise anyone here

PedroYoniLikesCrisps · 10/05/2013 20:32

Incidentally, Bush and Blair, both Christians. Just sayin'

PedroYoniLikesCrisps · 10/05/2013 20:33

Great...... How many female popes have there been again?

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:35

And then people end up having a special relationship with their priests instead.

..or, in the case of Monica Lewinsky, Bill Clinton.

What's your point again?

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:37

I'm not. I'm never satisfied if I don't understand something.

...but you will accept some things that don't necessarily make sense. If not, how the hell do you cope with matters of the heart?

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:41

[re the Trinity]: You can see why I'm confused I hope!

Absolutely, infamous. It is mind-boggling and I do not claim to have the answers to this mystery. It is beautiful and complex and I believe it to be true.

daftdame · 10/05/2013 20:43

Pedro and Sabrina - do not confuse scientific theory with fact, do not be this deceived. If you are deceived in this way it is the most dangerous type of science.

At least admit the assumptions. In good, rigorous, science assumptions are listed. A framework is not a 'thing' (unless you are talking about something which is physically built here.) If you are talking about a framework in thought, it is non-physical, it does not exist in the physical world. A shared thought could be compared with something spiritual in fact (Zeitgeist).

At least Christians admit faith is a crucial element.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 10/05/2013 20:43

And how many women bishops with unelected seats in the House of Lords...?

PedroYoniLikesCrisps · 10/05/2013 20:47

...but you will accept some things that don't necessarily make sense. If not, how the hell do you cope with matters of the heart?

You make a lot of assumptions about me. What, prey tell, might I have not thought made sense?

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 10/05/2013 20:47

'Faith' has no role in scientific theory though.

Have a read if you're interested.

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:49

Jewcy, that's the best I've ever heard it explained actually. Thank you.

Jewcy · 10/05/2013 20:50

Pedro, I will get back to you on the 'Jesus as honey'. I'm just trying to get my cat out of the attic.

PedroYoniLikesCrisps · 10/05/2013 20:50

Pedro and Sabrina - do not confuse scientific theory with fact, do not be this deceived. If you are deceived in this way it is the most dangerous type of science.

I'm not, you don't understand. The theory definitely exists. It's written down, it's as real as the paper itself. I'm not claiming that what the theory says is fact.

infamouspoo · 10/05/2013 20:52

I'm always slightly sad when a woman says she isnt a feminist
Without feminism you'd not have the vote, rape in marriage would be legal, you'd not be able to sign a cheque, own property, have equal rights in employment, maternity leave....the list goes on. History shows us what life was like for women under the Christian Church in this country.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 10/05/2013 20:53

Of course, not to be confused with Pseudoscience.

Of course, the original subject of this thread was young earth creationism, which is a very good example.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 10/05/2013 20:58

As Best has shown with his 3 assumptions - way, way back - none of which are scientifically testable, and thus shouldn't form the basis of a scientific argument.

daftdame · 10/05/2013 20:58

Sabrina Theories are improved as more evidence is gathered thus they are not fact. Based on what has been observed they extrapolate what might happen in the future (one prior is that the pattern has been fully observed and has been predicted correctly).

The Bible defines faith as 'the substance of that which is believed but not seen'. Since the scientific theory is incomplete, it is subject to change, it involves an unseen element and so involves faith in this way.

daftdame · 10/05/2013 21:01

Pedro - God is written about in The Bible He exists.

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