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Philosophy/religion

Join our Philosophy forum to discuss religion and spirituality.

The Muslim Tearoom

999 replies

HardlyEverHoovers · 20/03/2013 15:25

Salaams/peace to all! I'm already missing our old thread, so taking the bull by the horns and opening our very own Muslim Tearoom, all welcome (non-Muslims too of course), to chat, share, ask questions etc etc. Imagine a cosy cafe with floor cushions, tea and coffee of all kinds, and lovely cakes! Please join me!

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crescentmoon · 03/06/2013 07:52

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crescentmoon · 03/06/2013 08:27

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rosiedays · 03/06/2013 09:00

Hi sisters. May I pop in for advice? I married a wonderful Muslim man 5 years ago and we are expecting our miracle baby girl in July inshalla. I am very keen to insure she is brought up with a good knowledge of her religion and I follow the teachings of Islam with regards to bringing her up. Dh does not go to mosque and I have no Muslim friends here to ask advice. Mil is wonderful but communication is difficult as my Arabic is rubbish
So my first question. .. is there anything at or after birth that I should do?
Can anyone recommend a good book I could read?
We live in Bristol does anybody know of a Muslim mums group here?
Looking forward to your replys. Salam

peacefuloptimist · 03/06/2013 11:48

Salams Rosie

Congratulations on the news of your baby girl. I pray Allah gives you a safe and easy delivery, as well as a gorgeous, healthy, peaceful baby at the end of it.

My little boy was born last summer and I remember researching Islamic etiquettes and customs with regards to newborn babies.

First thing you are supposed to do when the baby is born is recite the call to prayer (Arabic word for it is adhan) in the ear of the infant.

"I saw the Prophet peace be upon him (PBUH) give the adhân for prayer in the ear of al-Husayn ibn Alî (the Prophet's grandson) when his mother Fâtimah (the daughter of the Prophet Muhammed PBUH) gave birth to him," (Tirmidhî)

It doesnt have to be a specific person who does this. It can be you, your dh or any relative who knows the call to prayer. This is done so that one of the first things the baby hears is the name of Allah.

This should be done in a voice that is audible to the baby but not too loud so as to startle the baby (like my uncle did when he recited the adhan in a loud voice in the middle of the hospital ward when his granddaughter was born. Imagine when you walk past a mosque in a muslim country at prayer time - that's how loudly he did it Grin ).

The next step is of course to let your nearest and dearest know so that they are not left worrying and also so that they can make supplications (duas) for the baby. Something like saying I pray that God protects your baby, gives baby good health, intellect, strength, piety etc.

Another thing that you do soon after the baby is born is the tahnik. This is where you soften a date and then rub the palate of the new-born with it just after the birth or soon after. This is done by putting a piece of the softened date on your finger and rubbing it from left to right in the mouth of the baby. Don't allow any piece of the date to remain in the babies mouth. Its just to get let the baby get the taste of it rather then to eat it. I read somewhere that the sweetness of the date encourages the baby to suckle but not sure if that's the reason behind it.

The next step is naming the baby. The baby may be named on the day of it's birth or later on the seventh day or past the seventh day. For the first three days we just called our ds baby boy because we couldn't agree on a name. We had chosen one beforehand but at the time of birth we both didn't feel like it suited him. Some people make a big deal about hiding the name that they have chosen for the baby from all except their closest relatives until they officially announce it to everyone
on the seventh day but this is not really something from the religion but more like a cultural practice in some countries.

The next step is the fun part. On the seventh day you throw a party for the baby which we call the aqiqah. You don't actually have to have a party. Its just on that day you must arrange for a sheep to be sacrificed to thank God for blessing you with the child and as a welcome for it. The meat of the sacrifice may be distributed cooked or uncooked. If people cook the meat they tend to throw a party and feed their guests it or if they distribute it uncooked it is normally given to family, friends, neighbours or now more commonly people arrange for it to be distributed to the poor. By distributing the meat (rather than keeping it all for yourself) you are sharing the blessings that your family have received with the wider community if that makes sense because they are also sharing in your joy and also supplicate for your baby.

On the seventh day after the birth the head of the baby normally should be shaved and the hair is then weighed and the value of the baby's weight of hair in silver is given to charity. When the Prophet Muhammed PBUH grandson was born he instructed his daughter Fatima to:

?shave his head and give the weight of his hair in silver to the poor" (Ahmad)

The right side of the head should be shaved first, then the left. The shaving should be done after the sacrifice, and it was the custom of muslims in the past to rub some perfume over the baby's head after the shaving though this is not necessary. In the case of baby girls there is a bit of difference of opinion whether you have to shave their hair or not. My mum swears that its not obligatory to shave the baby girls hair and I know people who have shaved their baby girls hair and some who haven't. I think I will leave it to other sisters here to elaborate on this point. I had a boy so it was pretty clear cut.

I think that's all of it. If I have missed anything out someone please correct me. I don't know of any books but there are some good sites online that can offer you more information.

Hope everything goes well for you. X

nailak · 03/06/2013 19:23

crescent I am confused what do you mean by honour and shame? loike of their bodies?

crescentmoon · 03/06/2013 20:13

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crescentmoon · 03/06/2013 20:29

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rosiedays · 04/06/2013 10:33

thank you so much peaceful
I knew about the sheep Confused this is going to be done in DH home city by his mother thankfully!! as i don't think my nieghbours would understand us bringing a live sheep into the garden and killing it!!! Confused I've seen it meany times in Egypt and still have to leave the house when it's being done!
If heartburn = hair (as my MIL says it does) then we will be giving great Alms!
The date thing makes sence and i will take one with me to the hospital (now added to hospital bag list. Grin )
DH will recite Adhan to her Smile he is so excited. i also have a CD of The Holy Quarn to play for her to help her sleep. DH says he listened to this every night as a child and even now will put it on if he has trouble sleeping and always falls asleep very quickly once it is on.
Thank you again. I will keep poping in for Tea and advice if thats ok. xx

LostAndNeverFound · 04/06/2013 19:12

Thank you Thanks

Congratulations rosie. A little girl, how lovely. Have you thought of any names yet? I'm not sure if it's on this thread or our last thread, but crescent kindly listed certain surahs that can be read at different times in the pregnancy. Have a dig around, I'm on my phone all the time and it's too slow, otherwise I'd look for you!

The CD of the Quran sounds like good idea, which CD did you get? I'd like one for the car as I get too distracted by music on the radio!

crescent I don't know the answer to your question! I'm trying to work it out myself at the moment as DD1 is having a few problems at school with behaviour. And I just can't seem to get through to her the whole honour shame of bad behaviour. She knows Allah swt is All Seeing and All Hearing, but that doesn't stop her, she lies something chronic at the moment. I'm hoping it's a phase and will pass. I'd love to know if anyone else has any tips!

HardlyEverHoovers · 04/06/2013 19:34

Congratulations on your little girl Rosie, may Allah protect and guide her and make her one of those who knows Him.
Crescent, I wasn't too sure what you meant by the honour/shame thing, at first I thought that you meant modesty/shame but do you mean behaviour in general?
I've noticed in my husbands family something I like, which is like a pride that doesn't have any arrogance in it, often based on 'doing the right thing' or doing something well etc. I think this is part of it, to teach them there is dignity in doing the right thing. Personally I'm also keen to distinguish modesty from shame, for example so that my children know that they can always talk about certain topics if necessary, as long as in the right context etc. We use 'proper names' for private parts in our house and I feel that's quite an important part of it, no giggling behing corners etc.

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crescentmoon · 05/06/2013 09:25

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LostAndNeverFound · 05/06/2013 21:16

You're right about them being at the stage in their life where they need to be taught, and the way to teach I believe, is by example. I work really hard to be a good example to my children, unfortunately it's not that easy when you have a DH like mine. And yes, I don't think she should be branded a liar, she's only 8 and it would live with her forever if I called her that. It's hard work and infuriating at times though!

I don't know about anyone else but I'm really struggling with time at the moment. I'd love to be able to sit down with my eldest and read about and discuss our religion so we can learn together. But I just feel like time is against us. She reads arabic twice a week, does athletics one day, ballet another day and then she does homework on the fifth day! Weekends we spend either at my in laws or with my family. She also goes to bed before 7 most days on her own accord. I think I'm hoping once the baby is in more of a routine I can set aside some time with her. Maybe keep her up on a Friday night for a bit longer and have that as our time.

How do you all fit everything in?!

HardlyEverHoovers · 07/06/2013 19:46

Can't help you with that lost as my DS as just little so not really at the stage of specifically trying to teach him, though of course they learn all the time from their parents as you said.
Really I think that is the most important thing, to set an example and teach them to act like Muslims, knowledge is great, but only if it translates into action.

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fuzzywuzzy · 07/06/2013 20:03

Yeay found the thread again.

Lost, can you not talk to your DD on your way to & from school?

The way I teach my girls is telling them to consider how it would feel to be in that position, how it feels to suffer the fall out when friends find out.

Also for me lying is a deal breaker, I've told my girls that telling me the truth won't get them in as much trouble as telling fibs, & that if they lie to me, I won't be able to believe anything they say because they've lied to me already so how will I know.

I don't get angry & scream & shout, I try to make sure I'm available to them & when they going on and on about stuffing I consciously try and pay attention and engage with them. Ill let you know how it pans out when they hit their teens!

So far we're pretty tight knit little family Alhumdulillah

LostAndNeverFound · 09/06/2013 21:53

Yes fuzzy I do, it's a 10 min drive and we often recite things together, it's good for my 3yo DD to try and join in as well.

What I'd like to do is put the younger two to bed and sit with my 8yo and read books to learn and discuss things. The only flaw to that plan is a cluster feeding baby and an 8yo who like to be in bed before 7! One day inshallah we'll have the time to be able to do this.

Hardly where you said knowledge is great but only when put into action, reminds me of my H. He knows an awful lot about our religion, but he barely puts any of it into action. Where as I know very little but what I do know I try my best to follow it.

Another question for you all. With Ramadan fast approaching what are your views on fasting whilst exclusively breastfeeding? I've read lots of different opinions online, but have yet to find a Hadith that says anything about it. Can anyone point me in the direction of one? Thanks.

LostAndNeverFound · 09/06/2013 21:59

Fuzzy I've also told my DD1 that lying about something is always worse than the action itself. When she does tell me the truth I say 'thank you for being truthful with me, but please understand that doing xyz is unacceptable' and leave it at that. Depending on what it is, I then punish the action itself with 8 minutes on the step, which she hates! I may need to try another approach as that doesn't seem to be getting through to her yet though!

fuzzywuzzy · 10/06/2013 00:10

Lost what I did when I caught DD lying (& she hadn't confessed I found her out), the next time some thing happened I went and verified it with others who had been there. I told her I didn't feel I could believe her after the last time and I wasn't going to get someone into trouble if she were lying. I hadn't punished her for her lie I had told her I was really disappointed and upset that she let me believe the lie.

I don't remember the details of it as it was a long time ago, but my reaction really impacted on her as we are very close, and she realised how horrible it was not being believed when telling the truth.
We also used the story of the boy who cried wolf. Touch wood it does seem to have sunk in for her Alhumdulillah.

Also at school she's learnt the signs of a hypocrite one being when he speaks he lies!

As for the fasting, I've been taught that nursing mothers are exempt, but need to make the fasts up later (do them in winter, shorter fasts).
I would go with how you feel, if you feel up to it and really want to then check with your GP & try it & see how you feel. But the fasts will be long, you don't want to make yourself ill or upset your milk supply.

fuzzywuzzy · 10/06/2013 00:13

?Allah has lifted fasting and half the prayer from the traveller, and the fast from pregnant and nursing women.? [Tirmidhi, Abu Dawud, and Nasa?i]

sammythemummy · 10/06/2013 08:34

lost I fasted while nursing my dd and eventually stopped nursing her, big mistake as it is the right of your child to bf. So I would not fast and make them up in the winter as fuzzy pointed out.

BTW assalaamu alaykum to everyone. I dont come to this section often as I am mostly in the special needs (my dd is speech delayed). But hope everyone's well :)

HardlyEverHoovers · 10/06/2013 15:14

Asalam u alikum sammythemummy nice to see you here!

My understanding of the pregnancy/breastfeeding and ramadan issue is that you should fast unless you fear for the safety of you and your child. If it's the child you fear for, and not yourself, you need to give food to the poor as well as making up the fasts (that's in Shafi fiqh). I'll try and come back with proper references later when I have more time.

I tried to fast in pregnancy but only managed 10 days, it really affected me. I think I managed to fast while breastfeeding DS when he was about 6 months, can't remember if I missed any days. But I'm sure you're right sammy the right of breastfeeding means that you would need to stop fasting if it was significantly affecting your milk supply.

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sammythemummy · 10/06/2013 15:25

wa alaykumus salaam hardly love the name btw, I too hardly hoover.

Sorry for the confusion but I wasn;t talking about pregnancy and fasting, I also hold the Shafii opinion, although last pg I only managed a few.

But from my understanding you are exempt from fasting whilst nursing your child. Please do double check tho because Iv not checked for sources in years.

fuzzywuzzy · 10/06/2013 15:58

I'm of Hanafi school of thought, consult an Imam or scholar near you inshallah.

I really think you need to put yourself and your childs needs first here. The days look set to be pretty hot, take the exemption as it is there for you.

I was listening to a lecture a while back and the scholar said we should gratefully accept these exemptions and thank Allah as not doing so is being ungrateful. I never looked at it like that before. But now I do.

MumuDeLulu · 10/06/2013 20:56

Kellymom and link and another

HardlyEverHoovers · 11/06/2013 20:28

Another breastfeeding/ramadan link!

spa.qibla.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=318&CATE=6

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crescentmoon · 13/06/2013 12:41

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