To not want to be a Muslim

[Lostagain]

Ok so I am a Muslim, have 2 dd and married dh is a convert to Islam....
Anyway from a young age I have had a strong pull towards Christianity or aspects of it. I don't believe Jesus is the son of god, but do believe he will return again etc.
Is it a cultural thing? I was born and brought up in the uk, went to a cofe school for a few years then we went to a inner city which was full of Asians- I am Asian but it was horrible, I hated it. Despite this I still sang on the school choir, certain people were horrified at the time, but my mum supported me. In my teens i went a bit religion mad and started wearing a headscarf etc- didn't last long,
i love Christmas and Easter, I sing hymms when I'm washing up i've been to a few church's in my time, funerals weddings etc and to be honest it's so peaceful there.
I have been to mosques it was ok,actually I couldn't wait to get out of there....Maybe it's a language barrier
I haven't spoken to anyone about this as it is such a big thing -changed my name on mn but sometimes I just don't want to be a Muslim. I want to bring up my children with faith and I struggle to explain the Muslim faith.

I'm sure there is the odd sentence in the above which makes sense :)

Sorry - my opening sounded weird! I know someone born + bred muslim in uk with family 'home' who decided to stir and say that he had converted and was lkivinmg with a girl. It caused a real stink and got nasty.

If you believe, you believe. Somertimes we just have to take 'the whole package' so there may be bits we aren't happy with but, that's religion!

Good luck with yopr search. I hope you find the peace and happiness you are looking for.

Assalamo alaikum and peace to all,

There is so much anti moozlem propaganda out there which is why OP I am urging you to seek knowledge from reliable people and/or books. Many muslims are very cultured and sadly think that these practices are islamic when in fact they are far from it. Look at the life of the Prophet Muhammed (peace be upon him) as a reference, not someone down the road who thinks eating pakora is a pillar of islam, lol.

I'm sorry that you didn't have a good experience as a child regarding mosques etc, but you will find things may have changed now so do not let it put you off and try some of the bigger mosques. There will be many british borners like yourself, so they know your position and hopefully you can relate to them. The fact that you don't believe that Jesus is the son of God IMHO indicates that christianity isn't what you are looking for!

Definately feel free to PM x

who has been pressuring her? or tried to get her to change her mind?

how can we change a mind that is not even made up?

How are we coming accross intolerant?
OP do you feel pressured? I am sorry if it comes accross that way.

Being a Muslim is not just a religion it?s a way of life. You can give up a religion but not a way of life that has been ingrained into you since birth.

really? so how do all us reverts manage it then?

are no Muslims born to non practising Muslim parents? Maybe Muslim ideals are not something that has been ingrained in to the OP from birth. This is not uncommon. In a lot of Muslim families cultural ideals are ingrained over religious ideals.

Ways of life can be changed, and it is her choice if she wishes to do so. Why are you pressuring her to PM you. If OP does come back on this thread i suggest she talks to the people closest to her, who will be able to support her whatever she chooses to do.If someone chooses not to be a muslim anymore that does not mean it isbecause of any anti-muslim propanda. Believe or not the populaton in this country has the ability to see tht for what it is.

You can decide for yourself whichever religion (or none at all) that you wish to follow.

I would say though before you make such a change to educate yourself further about both Islam and Christianity so that you can truly make an informed choice.

This site has a good breakdown of basic Christian doctrines.

Also become clearer about what it is you like about Christmas and Easter. If what you like about Christmas is Father Christmas/Santa Claus, presents, Christmas trees etc... then that is not really what Christmas is meant to be about. The 25th December is originally a pagan festival to do with sun worship and the winter solstice (as day became lighter after this point).

Christian scholars are undecided as to when Jesus was actually born so to make Christianity more acceptable to the pagan masses the pagan date was overlain with the Christian celebration of the birth of Christ.

Again Easter is the same, named after Eostre a fertility goddess (eggs and bunnies are part of this too). The story of Jesus's death and resurrection was moved to coincide with Easter, but actually occured closer to passover which varies year to year.

Thunderbirdago it's ok for you to suggest Christian activities for her, yet we are pressuring her. No we have made suggestions too even if you disagree with them. Bijou3 a lot of people give up a way of life ingrained from birth thats why we have converts in any religion. There are many different degress of being Muslim and believe me I have come across all of them. Listen as far as I am concerned what OP decides to do is up to her, Allah is not going to ask mine, yours or anyone elses opinion of OP come judgement day so therefore I am not interested in judging or pressuring her, rather she asked for opinions and it they were given.

OP if you feel I have pressured you I apologise.

rogue 'it' in last sentence apologies to the grammar pedants.

'who thinks eating pakora is a pillar of islam'

I snorted coffee out of my nose at that one

ZhenThereWereTwo you say she can decide her self and then complte you post discrediting two of the main events celebrated by Christians.

mauwmauw wht i suggested was an Alpha course where OP could find out more if she CHOSE too, and i did not suggest ant Christian activities. KalSkirata the OP did not say she did not believe in God, so you asking her tht was irrelavant why would she need to tell you that.

well pardon me for not reading the OP properly and picking out where she said she still beleived (she doesnt but it is insinuated) and making a mistake.
I, like others, offered advice. I stopped believing in any deity for years after a personal crisis.

Christianity is a lot wider than accepting Christ as the saviour; there are as many interpretations of what it is to be Christian as there ... grains of sand on a beach? :)

There is a tradition in Islam of being very very very intolerant towards people who leave it, especially women. I am surprised OP hasn't brought that up as an issue for her family, at least.

Yes, that is true, but is there any branch of christ ianity that does not believe that jesus is the son of god? I know there are differences in bits and bobs, but as far as I am aware, all branches of christianity share at least that belief? I'm not an expert though, so if I'm wrong I'll shut up and shuffle off

adventures do you think it is telling that none of the Muslims in this thread are surprised this hasnt been brought up as an issue?

I mean her family may not like it, the same way others families may not like it if they convert too Islam, but there is nothing in our direct experiences to suggest she would be shunned, outcast or in danger.

kal I understand what you were trying to do is help with the thought process, like !) do you believe in God 2) what is the form of that God 3) Do you belive Jesus is son of God 4) Do you believe Muhammad is a messenger etc

I dont think you were pressuring her.
thunderbird I also mentioned Alpha course.

nailak i was speaking to mauwmauw.

As the thread is now going off on a tangent about i'm off.

Thunderbirdago I am not discrediting two of the biggest events in the Christian calendar, I am merely pointing out that Christmas is not about Christmas trees/santa etc... it is about the birth of Christ and Easter is not about eggs and bunnies it is about Christ's death and resurrection so just because you like the Christmas festive spirit or Easter egg hunts it doesn't necessarily mean Christianity is for you.

ZhenThereWereTwo Then why did you relate each event to paganism.Actually dont answer that i am done with this thread

Because Christmas trees, eggs etc are pagan concepts

Ok I have read the thread

I do believe in god, just 1 god that's it. When I pray I just knee down and pray.

I don't pray 5 times a day and never have- actually tried it once and got bored half way through as didn't understand a work being said.

My lovely dad- bless him, once said as long as you believe in god in your heart you don't have to show it. He wasn't impressed when I started wearing a headscarf, come to think of it neither was my mum.

I know Christmas is all about Santa etc, but we also like to celebrate Jesus birthday be it on that day or not- will read up on it. I also do lent, give up something you enjoy. I don't do ramadan anymore as I don't understand the no eating from dawn to dust, I live in the uk, surely during the prophet Mohammed's time it was in Saudi where they sleep during the day as ts too hot, so fasting when your asleep. Which is what they do now? Is much easier?

I also don't understand all this punishment on earth by other people, stonings, burning alive from both aspects of faith, we live in a world that is different from the world that the books come from, however the principles still apply to this day, there is no compromise, surley god should be the one who punishes/rewards/forgives me?

Yes I questioned my faith since my father passed away, bth I think I questioned it along time ago...

I don't go to mosque here as there aren't any, but if they were I still wouldnt go because I think I would not be able to speak freely, and labeled as being difficult, her parents didn't bring her up properly if she was my daughter etc etc

I am rambling so will stop.

Lostagain, you can only do what you feel is best for you.
Feeling a strong pull to Christianity doesn't necessarily mean you should become a Christian (and I say that as a Christian) but maybe just that you want to explore it.
I've been interested in lots of religions (ended up doing a degree in it!) and have explored them deeply, going to services etc. because I wanted to learn.
I'd take this as a chance to explore Christianity, but at the same time explore Islam in more depth too :)

Wild

I intend to look at bth in detail and take t from there

Thanks

Lostagain,

I think that people doing barbaric things like stoning, burning or murdering people have nothing to do with Islam or Christianity. Unfortunately both Islam and Christianity have their share of bad people. I believe the devil is the darker side of human nature. The devil is not a god.

I think the most important thing in christianity is that God is love. Jesus summerized the contents of the scriptures as two rules

1. Love God
2. Love your neighbour as yourself.

I think that some people found the lack of rules of christianity quite difficult.

I think its too easy to get hung up on tiny details like whether Jesus was born of a virgin or the physical biology of his conception and actually miss the point why Jesus came in the first place.

To me the important thing is that we are loved and accepted by God for who we are. Jesus shows the light and the way towards having a personal relationship with God. Good works like praying or following particular rules or even being a good person aren't actually that important. Through a personal relationship we are forgiven of our sins and are shaped as people.

I see the trinity as different views of God. I see the holy spirit as God in the here and now. Through prayer the holy spirit helps us in the present.

I think Islam has a lot in common with Christianity. Does Islam believe in the holy spirit or anything similar? Its interesting that Muslims believe that Jesus will come again to judge the living and the dead. If Jesus is not God then why is he going to be the one who judges us at the end of time?

lostagain what country are you in? have you tried asking some of your questions about Islam on Islamic forums? assuming you want to know more about Islam and understand the faith you were born in to that is, if you dont, and you have made up your mind it is not for you, that is also fine.

punishment on earth In Islam there is no burning as a shariah punishment. The concept of stoning is from Islam.
It is firstly a deterrent, the actual shariah stipulations are hard to meet; you need four witnesses to the actual penetration, seeing two people alone naked is not enough to make stoning the punishment.
secondly it is a way of stopping the punishment in the hereafter and cleansing oneself.

In Islam we believe that every hurt we get we are rewarder for, every suffering and every pain. In reference to stoning, if the accused admits freely four times to their crime, the stoning could also be carried out, this is a way of repentance, and wanting the punishment in this life, so they do not have to face the punishment in the hereafter.

Book 017, Number 4206:
'Abdullah b. Buraida reported on the authority of his father that Ma'iz b. Malik al-Aslami came to Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) and said: Allah's Messenger, I have wronged myself; I have committed adultery and I earnestly desire that you should purify me. He turned him away. On the following day, he (Ma'iz) again came to him and said: Allah's Messenger, I have committed adultery. Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) turned him away for the second time, and sent him to his people saying: Do you know if there is anything wrong with his mind. They denied of any such thing in him and said: We do not know him but as a wise good man among us, so far as we can judge. He (Ma'iz) came for the third time, and he (the Holy Prophet) sent him as he had done before. He asked about him and they informed him that there was nothing wrong with him or with his mind. When it was the fourth time, a ditch was dug for him and he (the Holy Prophet) pronounced judg- ment about him and he wis stoned. He (the narrator) said: There came to him (the Holy Prophet) a woman from Ghamid and said: Allah's Messenger, I have committed adultery, so purify me. He (the Holy Prophet) turned her away. On the following day she said: Allah's Messenger, Why do you turn me away? Perhaps, you turn me away as you turned away Ma'iz. By Allah, I have become pregnant. He said: Well, if you insist upon it, then go away until you give birth to (the child). When she was delivered she came with the child (wrapped) in a rag and said: Here is the child whom I have given birth to. He said: Go away and suckle him until you wean him. When she had weaned him, she came to him (the Holy Prophet) with the child who was holding a piece of bread in his hand. She said: Allah's Apostle, here is he as I have weaned him and he eats food. He (the Holy Prophet) entrusted the child to one of the Muslims and then pronounced punishment. And she was put in a ditch up to her chest and he commanded people and they stoned her. Khalid b Walid came forward with a stone which he flung at her head and there spurted blood on the face of Khalid and so he abused her. Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) heard his (Khalid's) curse that he had huried upon her. Thereupon he (the Holy Prophet) said: Khalid, be gentle. By Him in Whose Hand is my life, she has made such a repentance that even if a wrongful tax-collector were to repent, he would have been forgiven. Then giving command regarding her, he prayed over her and she was buried.

Another point is this punishment has to be carried out by a judge under a khalif, and Khalid means successor of Muhammad sas, not King.

sorry to butt in Nailak. Stoning was orginally a Jewish punishment, long long before Islam. And before that it was probably used by all sorts. Stoning is mentioned nowhere in the Quran.