Returning dog to the breeder

[peetieswie]

I bought a dog for £1000 from a breeder. They'd kept him to show and stud and told me he was well socalised, crate trained, house trained, good with kids.

I really tried for two months. From the beginning he couldn't walk past a dog without lunging and if he ever met one closely he'd attack the neck. I tried walking him in dog parks and with friends dogs. He managed to walk short distances with my elderly dog when walked by two separate people and kept seperate but as soon as we'd stop or sit for a drink or something he'd be lunging again.

He would be let out to toilet and come back in and wee on the sofa or pile of washing. If I went out with him he'd be more reliable so this wasn't a huge issue but was harder than I expected. If I put him in a crate and go into the room next door he'd immediately start to howl.

My guess is he'd been in a kennel environment and not ever socalised in a home environment or with other dogs other than at the kennel. I also wonder why they wanted to sell him. I'm giving him back having not been neutered, not been given a haircut, and I've taught him to sit, stay, turn around, give paw (he knew no commands which surprised me if he's used for shows)

Should I expect any money back? They seem to think I'm just naive and couldn't cope but I'm an experienced dog owner, I just don't have the time and energy to put into a reactive dog when I wasn't made aware that's what I was getting. I feel sad for him as we had some lovely times but it has put me off an adult dog now and we will be looking to get a puppy in a year or two instead.

Did you have any kind of contract ?
also how old is he , a month is really no time at all in a strange environment, he hasn’t decompressed , I’m
sad for the poor dog tbh

You’d like to think so but when I had this situation years ago breeder didn’t even take the dog back. And this was a crufts winning breeder who was meant to be the best in the country for the breed.

That’s so sad for him poor boy 😑

don’t you want to look into training at all?

i really don’t want to criticise but really confused why you think he’d be perfect and you wouldn’t have to put any effort in ? Everyone does !

on your question you might get something back worth contacting them

He's 18 months old and it's been two months. He's guarding and snapping at my children so I am hesitant to give it another month. I'm home all day and he gets lots of exercise. I also don't want to be left with a dog they won't take back because I've had it so long.

I don't know why you think I've put no effort in. I've run my life round him, cancelled all plans, walked him every day with training treats. I've got him every kind of chew. Planned my days round him. Taken him out with my dog walker and elderly dog to get them used to each other. But I was told I was getting a child friendly, crate trained, well socialised dog. Yet I'm two months in and having conversations about behavioursts and having to keep the dog seperate from my children 24/7.

I bought a puppy ( he’s now 4 ) and my
contract states that if ever I’m unable
to keep him for any reason , at any age ,
breeder has first refusal to take him back ,
im confident that they would too .
So , do you have a contract ?

He's going back to the breeder tomorrow. I'm asking should I expect any money back?

It seems they lied from the beginning.
I’d be surprised if you get a penny back.

I would guess not , I can imagine a serious health issue may result in a refund , but breeder could argue that he’s just not suited to your home environment .
How much time did you spend with him and interact with him before taking him home ? If he’s behaving totally different in your home and breeders, then I’m stumped .
Assuming he hasn’t been around children in breeders home , sad situation all round really ,
Personally , I Wouldn’t be expecting any money back, but you can ask , they can only say no 🤷‍♀️

No dog of any age is going to settle in a month. Never mind one that’s been a stud dog. You mention treats a lot , could this be a contributing factor. Also what training have you done in house, so he knows your expectations.
Given the circumstances, return the poor dog as soon as possible so it hopefully has a chance of a more suitable home. And no you should not get your money back.

We got a dog under similar circumstances. She is also reactive but we have been working on that and she is finally settling ( now 3 months in) she doesn’t/didn’t know sit, paw etc as they are not used in the show ring. However she is not biting or guarding. I wouldn’t expect any money back you can ask but if we had to return her I wouldn’t expect money back.

Also If they kept him to stud ,but rehomed him at 16 months , I would ask myself why , surely he can’t have sired many , if any litters at such a young age .
it hardly matters now but how did you come by getting this dog ? All sounds a bit of a mess tbh

I've had him two months, not one. I've taken him out with friends dogs and they've all told me they're shocked by how aggressive he's been towards their dog, unprovoked. It's quite scary how he goes for the throat with any dog that comes near him. My mum had refused to dog sit him as she had a dog who he attacked and that's a big complicating factor as she was going to help have him. I don't see why everyone is being so negative when I've really tried to work with him. Should I just wait till he bites my kid in the face and then make a decision?

Yes we had to do this. The breeder was great though. We tried everything we could and the breeder even paid for an animal behaviourist (who said to send her back as she was a throwback to being a wild dog, and could never be domesticated - it was a fairly new breed at the time). But we tried everything over several months. We are experienced dog owners and had dealt with difficult dogs before - but she was something else. She couldn’t be left for a second - even any one of us going to the loo would get her howling and scratching on the door despite the others being still there in the room with her. Even our other dog would run away and hide from her in another room and was clearly so unhappy with her.
The breeder took her back and we agreed terms - we got something back but not what we paid for her, because we all wanted to do right by her.
The breeder kept her, she lived in the stable there with the other dogs (including her mum) and later the breeder showed her. She was never able to be housed with a family again - but did win a class at Crufts a few years later.
Our other dog perked up no end once she had gone.

What breed is he?

You’re not painting yourself in best light now OP, nobody is disputing that you’re doing the right thing handing the dog back to breeder , but your post seemed more concerned about whether or not you were getting any kind of refund , his welfare seemed to be less important than the cash .

I think you are getting a hard time OP.

It’s one thing to put in work with a rescue dog when you know what you are getting into but I would not be happy to pay a huge sum of money to a breeder for the privilege of retraining a very difficult untrained adolescent dog. I’d get a rescue for free if that’s what I wanted. What on earth would you pay all that money for to get a very difficult dog?

I have a difficult rescue dog but he was essentially free and they paid to neuter him too so I have money to spend on classes and behaviourists.

They should morally give you the money back but if there’s no contract I expect they won’t and you likely have no redress.

The OP has spent a grand on a dog that is nothing like she was told, I'm not surprised she'd like some money back. It wouldn't surprise me at all if they also lied about keeping him to show and stud and he'd actually been returned by someone else (maybe even more than one person) because of the behaviour issues.

Needing time to settle and decompress is one thing, not being able to be near any dog without going for their neck and also showing other really concerning behaviour is quite another.

I wouldn't think these are good people to return the dog to though so for that reason I wouldn't. I'd be looking for a rescue instead and write the money off as I'd be amazed if they'd give you anything.

100% this, I’m so sad for this dog. One thing if it completely doesn’t work out but quite another to be obsessed with getting every penny back

Sorry - your guess is he was just kept in a kennel and never in a home environment and you’re just going to give him back even though his life there sounds like it’ll be awful? Ffs 🤦🏼‍♀️

I agree.

18 months seems very young for him to have been shown and used for stud- was he actually used for that, or is there a reason he wasn’t?

for example my boy was supposed to be a show dog, but by 6 months it was fairly clear he wasn’t going to meet a certain breed standard. So he was offered out to a pet home and his mum spayed. He’d never showed or been used for breeding.

I asked about the money because it's the only thing I'd lik advice on what seems reasonable. There's no point asking about anything else because I've already agreed to give him back rather than struggle on with him for 14 or so more years. I've been in floods of tears for days about him and I'm really gutted but I have young kids and whilst we've had lovely times with him I can't commit to how much work he needs. I've had a reactive dog for 13 years so I know how difficult it is to retrain behaviours and the vet advised me to return him too. All I was asking is, accepting some responsibility but also believing I've been somewhat misled about his past experiences, is it reasonable to expect SOME money back. If it's not then it's not.

He has had one litter and done some shows. He's a very specific breed not many people know but the size of a toy poodle.

I don't know if his life was awful. He obviously had other dogs around all the time and may feel quite lonely not having a large pack. The breeders are definitely not awful people. I just don't think they walked their dogs in parks and things, just let them in a space at their house and treat their dogs like show dogs or breeding dogs.

So why did they change their minds on showing/stud?

18m is very young to stud as it’s better to wait until adulthood so breed relevant health checks can be done and any problems should have come to light.

has he had his genetic testing and other scoring done? Hip/elbow whatever the breed requires?

is he KC registered?