Returning dog to the breeder

[peetieswie]

I bought a dog for £1000 from a breeder. They'd kept him to show and stud and told me he was well socalised, crate trained, house trained, good with kids.

I really tried for two months. From the beginning he couldn't walk past a dog without lunging and if he ever met one closely he'd attack the neck. I tried walking him in dog parks and with friends dogs. He managed to walk short distances with my elderly dog when walked by two separate people and kept seperate but as soon as we'd stop or sit for a drink or something he'd be lunging again.

He would be let out to toilet and come back in and wee on the sofa or pile of washing. If I went out with him he'd be more reliable so this wasn't a huge issue but was harder than I expected. If I put him in a crate and go into the room next door he'd immediately start to howl.

My guess is he'd been in a kennel environment and not ever socalised in a home environment or with other dogs other than at the kennel. I also wonder why they wanted to sell him. I'm giving him back having not been neutered, not been given a haircut, and I've taught him to sit, stay, turn around, give paw (he knew no commands which surprised me if he's used for shows)

Should I expect any money back? They seem to think I'm just naive and couldn't cope but I'm an experienced dog owner, I just don't have the time and energy to put into a reactive dog when I wasn't made aware that's what I was getting. I feel sad for him as we had some lovely times but it has put me off an adult dog now and we will be looking to get a puppy in a year or two instead.

No unfortunately 85% of breeders are unethical, the show world who are actually trying to improve breeds are low numbers compared to unethical breeding for money or zero clue what they are doing. As I said a show breeder would not sell on a dog like that, the sell puppy’s to homes but not strangers , often home they have been recommended by friends etc or other show breeders. Or people who have done there research and reached out the the breed club so they acquire a fully health tested puppy which has been bred for the right reasons. I would contact the breed clubs next time you would like a dog you most likely will need to wait a while but at least you will get a dog brought into this world for the correct reasons and charged a nonminal fee that’s standard across the breeds £1500 roughly for a puppy. Or if it’s an older dog then gifted to you.

I would demand your money babk
or if be reporting to HMRC to make sure they are registering these sales.

I strongly disagree that show breeders do not sell adult ex show or breeding dogs. A great breeder who is producing dogs with fantastic health, temperament, and good type, usually cannot keep all their adult dogs and give them enough attention. Good breeders are usually extra discerning about who they sell adult dogs to, though.

All the best dogs I've ever had were sold to me as adults.

Selling them is what I’m on about, I’ve never known a breeder to take money off them, they all just rehome to good homes… asking for money is a red flag to me, unfortunately.. no decent show breeder asks for money I’m afraid to tell you.

Oh OP, they saw you coming a mile away.

But I agree with others, no decent breeder sells or a 'used' dog. Personally, I don't think any good breeder gets rid of a dog regardless. I certainly don't - my dogs give me their entire world, and I owe it to them to keep them with me.

Honestly, the thought of selling my 3 year old, show dog (who has had quite a bit of success) fills me with horror. He's my entire world and as great as another home might be, it's not my home and therefore it's not good enough for him. Ditto to my ex breeding girls, I despise people who sell their 'used' dogs.

The breeders absolutely are awful people. They're the worst of the worst - breeding a defective, unhappy, dog, and selling it to someone without checking that person had the right home environment for said dog. Don't defend them.

I’d just cut my losses, OP and be glad of no further stress.

Well I gave him back today. The man completely ignored him when I gave him back and the dog didn't really react either. The woman was calling his name acting happy to see him and he pulled back the other way to try and not go to her. So I do feel awful now as obviously he didn't have a happy life. No mention of money but a lot of comments like ' something has obviously upset him. It'll take some work to get him back to how he was.' so definitely attempts to make it seem my fault. So unfortunately you were right, not good people, and a lot of money and heartache.

Did you ask for a refund?
He'll be advertised for sale again already.

Don't beat yourself up. It's done now what ever will be will be. In future if you decide to re-home another dog for whatever reason put them up on pets 4 homes and then you can decide where they are homed. All dogs require a chip with the owners details you will have to remove that from the system.

The breeder has 'quite a lot of dogs'. They don't socialise them. And @peetieswie you think that the breeder will put this 18 month old to stud again after he was returned for behavioural issues?
Please report these breeders to the RSPCA and any breed specific organisations.
Rehome the poor dog with a rescue charity. Do not send him back into a modern slavery situation.
Here are tips on what a good breeder would be like: https://www.dogstrust.org.uk/dog-advice/getting-dog/choosing-dog/finding-a-breeder

Just saw the update.
Can you take him back, take him to a rescue, and report them?
He is a sensitive being and he seems to have learnt to fear these people.
You can stop him being harmed, with very little effort. He could not behave well, but you were the best he knew.

Breeder sounds like they were trying to unload a dud and gave you a lot of lies, and you have massively overpaid - I doubt they will give you any money back.
They will likely just dump him on someone else for another £1k.

Not at my vets. 18 months is better for large dogs (mine is a labrador). They need time to mature.

Well no, you should list the things you have said here that you were told by the breeder - safe with children, socialised, toilet trained. Those are terms of the sale as they induced you to buy the dog. And they turned out not to be true so he has missold the dog.

And you just give this poor dog back to them

Pity you didn't bring him to an animal rescue rather than back to the breeder since they weren't giving you your money back anyway

Agree, our vets wouldn’t do our male dog until he was at least 16 months old, he’s a pointer.

Animal rescues are inundated with waiting lists sadly, returning to a breeder is wha most rescues would advise especially if under contract.
If the OP has concerns about the breeder she can report to the KC if registered with them, the local licensing authorities because they should have a license if breeding multiple bitches and having more than a certain amount of litters and the RSPCA if living accommodation for the dogs is of a concern.
The dog was also snapping and resource guarding, many rescues won’t currently take dogs with a bite history due to the large amount of ‘uncomplicated’ dogs that are also waiting for space.

The OP had little choice, you can’t keep a dog that is trying to bite children and no rescue centre would have space immediately especially for one with those issues.
The OP should never have put herself in this position by going down the path of handing over a vast amount of money for an 18 month old dog but once she had her options when things hadn’t worked out were severely limited.

So, I am going to message the breeder about some money back in the next few days. Also, it's a very small community and I've made a friend who breeds and shows pups and she's going to ask around, and talk to the woman from kennel club. So word will get round about this and the dog having to be returned. I'm hoping at least that will have some impact. I couldn't just take the dog back and rehome him myself, as I'd be doing it privately and I just think it would have been so difficult and worrying making sure he was going to the right home. Returning to the breeder is the usual practice in this situation.

It? What a delightful way to describe your poor dog. £1000 is nothing so i’m guessing a crappy back yard breeder.

Mumsnet is so full of garbage people. I'm done. Thanks for the people who actually were sympathetic or gave some reasonable advice.

Also, it's a very small community and I've made a friend who breeds and shows pups and she's going to ask around, and talk to the woman from kennel club.

With all due respect, it's not going to change anything.The Kennel Club literally chose a known animal abuser to be 'Best In Show' this year. It won't have any impact.

In this instance, the dog would have 100% been better off going to a rescue centre. All you have done is return the dog to a woefully unsuitable environment, I'm afraid.

I beg to differ. My mate got a reacue from.abroad and that dog was a saint fron day 1. My inlaws just got 2 rescue puppies - 15 weeks old. Not toilet trained but well.behaved.

This dog sounds like its only ever been in a kennel, and possibly from a puppy farm.

If you think one person is a dick, they’re probably a dick but if you think everyone is a dick, you’re the problem.