That man showed me his willy....

[handlemecarefully]

My 2.11 yr old dd just casually announced this on our journey home from Nursery. The man she was referring to works there and has been there for 4-5 weeks.

What next? Not sure whether I should say something to the Nursery Manager because this could be complete fabrication on my dd's part (she does say misleading and inaccurate things sometimes)...and if I say something and he is completely blameless?

At the time I said to her "Did he? If he did that's very naughty. If he does it again you must tell him 'no', and go and tell one of the ladies straight away" (she refers to the predominantly female staff at the Nursery as 'ladies')

DD has been showing no sings of 'sexualised behaviour'. She is interested in 'willies' of both genders - but no more so than any other child her age. She did mention the other day that one of the other little girls had shown dd her bottom....

Should I say anything to the Nursery Manager. If yes - that what and how?

just seen this thread. Not been in a similar situation so can?t offer practical advice. just plenty of sympathy. You must be feeling so stressed trying to know how to handle this for the best for all. I think that by phoning the manager up immediately and not pushing and pushing DD about it was really calm, sensible moves.
Personally, (as an ex teacher) I am both surprised and a little concerned about the manager?s handling of it all, but then I was not there. Just feel that there are specific procedures in place for this type of thing, regardless of whether she believes the allegation or not, and she should have put them in motion as soon as you told her- certainly your discussion should have been documented, dated and filed safely and confidentially. If he is to be monitored, is he going to be made aware of this? are the other staff going to be informed so that they can monitor him too? How are they going to feel? How long is he going to be monitored? Is it a casual thing where the manager will "keep and eye" on him until end of term and then a "clean slate" in Sept? How exactly is she going to keep an eye? How practical is it to watch him while he is with a child? Is there any CCTV equip?
Do they have an up to date CRB clearance for him?
Is it really up to her to decide if this should be taken seriously, or should it be an impartial professional such as ss or police with more knowledge and experience? I am not saying I have any answers to these questions or that I think it likely he did this - I have no idea - but if I were in your shoes, I would need the answers to feel more comfortable about continuing to send my DD there.

Just seen your post Caligula. Am now listening whilst typing.

Gothicmama:
"From your posts i get teh sense taht you are very protective of your dd and I wander if maybe she is palying on this in some way for attention . It may be better raterh than saying xx is silly and rude to say soemthing more neutral. This seemed to be teh best approach with dd. " - Yes I am a bit overprotective, and you are probably right about saying something more neutral

my typing is so bad - sorry

HMC, I have to say that from your posts, far from being hotheaded, you have acted in a very sensible and sensitive manner.

Did your DD find it funny when the little girl showed her her bottom? What reaction did you give to this tale? Just wondered if the "showed me his willy" story is a step up from that as being deemed "funnier". DSs often escalate stories in that way (generally about poo or fighting or being able to fly but I'm sure YKWIM) until it gets to a ridiculous level.

wrt staff being police checked - don't forget that only people who have been caught (or possibly accused, depending on the level of check) would show up on a police check. Of course some slip through the net.

Agree with Lizzielou btw - I think you've acted very sensibly in flagging it with the nursery manager without making a fuss.

Thanks Soupy and Lizzylou - still not sure that I've done enough, but I will be staying vigilant for signs...

Thanks also Basketcase - I will be asking Nursery Manager to document this at the very least.

Soupdragon - I think my reaction to dd telling me about the story of another little girl showing her bottom to dd was quite calm and collected in what I said to dd about it, but I expect that for a few seconds before I said anything surprise registered on my face which might have given dd a frisson of pleasure!

I'm really hoping that the Man at the Nursery incident is simply an imaginary escalation of this...Certainly when I read "My body is private" to dd yesterday she didn't refer back to the Man at Nursery incident which you might imagine she would have if it had happened.

And sorry SofiaAmes that I got a bit snippy at your suggestion. Feeling a bit sensitive at the moment.

HMC, I have nothing to add in the way of advice and I do hope that things get sorted but I have to say, I think it's a real shame that so many of us hold these prejudices about men working with young children.
I did teacher training with one guy who was fantastic in class. He was really in tune with the little ones (he was specialising in nursery/recep). He was married with three kids under five and he just knew instinctively what to do. Despite this, he had real difficuly getting a job and ended up working at KS2.
For many kids, having a positive male role model, and one as good as he was, could have made a big difference.
Once again, I hope you and your DD get to the bottom of this.

I agree with you Homemama, a positive male role model would be fantastic for many children without one in their lives.

I agree too - I don't know where these prejudices of mine come from! I rationally think its great to have positive male role models but then wonder why they are working with children. Its really strange but I can't get over it! (in case you are wondering I have contradictory views on most things [roll eyes])

I'm in two minds about the prejudice thing. I don't doubt that there are lots of men who are really competent and great child-carers, but otoh I got very irritated listening to the woman's hour thing this morning, where some woman was going on about how it's the last taboo and it's got to be broken and the implication that silly women who don't want to hand their precious children over to men are just neurotic and have to be bullied out of their taboos. The tone of the discussion just peeves me - I think mothers have got the right to have a prejudice about who looks after their kids and shouldn't be bullied into thinking they have to have them looked after by people they're not comfortable with, just to prove they're not narrow-minded.

The fact remains that masses of paedophiles seek jobs working with children simply in order to have access to children. It is well documented and I think any mother who ignored that would be very unusual. Which isn't to say that we've all got to get hysterical and instantly suspect every male nursery worker of being a paedophile (presumably, most of them aren't) but in Richard Dworkin's words, sometimes you can be so open-minded that your brains fall out. I just think with so much awareness of paedophilia, it's quite understandable that people are cautious about it, and I think they should be. It's just very difficult to know where the line between caution and hysteria is drawn.

well a sex offender i dealt with recently was in the army with 2 teenaged daughters so think thsi " working wiht kdis" thing is a red herring

I fully understand your point, Caligula.
However, I don't see why it's seen as more acceptable for men to work with 10-16yr olds than it is for them to work with under 5's.

yes ds1s deputy is an etxremetl ytalented teacher and county advisor
adn male adn a reception teacher and the parents are killing to get their kdis in his class

HMm type tastic!

bravo basketcase.my thoughts exactly.

basketcase makes some very valid points. Obviously HMC knows how seriously the manager is taking it but I do think with that sort of allegation (let's face it, that's what it amounts to) their CP procedures should have kicked into place.

Message withdrawn

HMC - did you still want the booklet I mentioned photcopying??

Yes please!

I'm cat-ing you now...

Done, but I'm not sure how long CATs take to be processed by Mumsnet Towers

I am keeping a look out for it HMC!!

Sorry hmc, I didn't mean to be rude. I was just trying to figure out what was going on from a slightly different angle. I think part of parenting is questioning yourself and I was not trying to suggest that you were doing something wrong on purpose, but perhaps just that you hadn't considered something that you were doing inadvertently. For example, my ds (4) has just started recently saying "I'm not very good at that," which has started me wondering, what am I not doing, or doing wrong that is making him feel like he can't do something which he actually can do. I consider myself a very encouraging parent, but perhaps I'm doing something inadvertently that is making my son question his abilities.
Going back to hmc, my impression was that you don't really think that something happened with either this man or your dd's grandfather, in which case there is another side to all of this which is, why is she saying that something happened to her? I think it's important that you take it all seriously, in case something did happen, but also important to figure out what's going on if something didn't happen so that it doesn't escalate into something more serious.

Hey I know that you didn't mean to be rude, did you see my later post in which I said sorry for jumping down your throat? I'm hypersensitive at the moment...

You are right to suggest that I ought to reflect on what might be happening and why. Have been thinking about why she might be doing it. It might be an attention thing because she is a little jealous of her younger brother. Not that I favour him - I most certainly don't, but she is very possessive of me and doesn't like sharing.

On the other hand I've got to keep an open mind and consider that something might have happened with her grandpa or the Nursery Nurse Assistant, or both