How do you maintain an enthusiastic demeanor about your child's school play, when inwardly you HATE that it is nativity?

[nevergoogledragonbutter]

Ok, so i'm not religious. I'm personally somewhere halfway between atheism and humanism depending on whether i can see a difference between the two, a moment that comes and goes.

But, I have come to accept that we live in a country that teaches a 'broadly christian' approach after being initially a bit wtf to find that him going to a non-faith school actually doesn't mean we can avoid the subject.

I don't feel that taking him out of assembly would make any difference other than to make him feel different about something he's too young to understand.

But, it irritates me highly that he is taught bible stories at a non-faith school and it irritates me even more that he will be expected to re-enact the nativity story and spend the next 6 weeks learning his songs and lines.

And while i would dearly love to see my 5 year old sing and dance or say some lines, the experience is marred by the play being religious. i have to somehow look past the religious aspect.

I don't want my own beliefs to ruin what could be a very enjoyable thing for him to do with his friends.

Is it possible to keep my feelings hidden? Is that the appropriate way to deal with it?
Why can't they do something else that would be entertaining for everyone?

I think it is a crying shame that even if you don't believe in God you can't appreciate the significance of a story where a baby is born into homelessness, a baby that will grow up to preach unconditional love and forgiveness beyond everything.

Agree Pofaced

I am sad that DD will no longer do the nativity. In her school it is for the infants and she has just gone into juniors. am not sure the juniors are even the choir or anything, so will be restricted to the carol service only.

DD was Mary last year and sang solo, and I nearly cried!

I'm not religious, but believe that religion plays a big part our history and culture. Dd saw the Nativity scene at the Xmas market last year and was intrigued by the "smelly animals". I told her that they represented a story and then over the last year, we gradually introduced the idea that some people believe in God who lives in Heaven, why there are churches etc etc. I also told her that some people believe different things.

In the run up to Xmas this year, I plan to take her to the Nativity play and discuss the story. As plenty have said, it is a big part of why we celebrate Xmas - though I will get in a mention of the previous winter festivals too. We'll also need to cover the story of St Nicolas too this year as he will be visiting first.

I see this all as part of a well rounded education. I can't see why people get so het up these things.

if christmas is about a religion, its not christianity.

winter solstice more like. a bloody good booze up in the middle of winter to lift your pecker until spring.

'christmas is about christ' - why do people always bring out that chestnut however many times it gets knocked down - don't you pay attention?

rant<

now to read the thread.

you know what, the clue is in the name, CHRISTmas.

And yes, I know, the date was a pagan festival, and that's why they chose that day as it was a pagan festival. But CHRISTmas is a Christian festival. If people want to celebrate other festivals like Winterval or Yule or whatever, fine, but don't call it Christmas!

SGB - people like to peddle doubt, as it appeals to the 'discredit Christianity at all costs', but there is sufficient evidence to be pretty well certain that Jesus was a historical character. Amongst theologians there is very little doubt (my mother is a theologian). Other religions also accept Jesus as being a very significant prophet, if not the 'Son of God'.

Bit strange to say Christmas isn't about Christianity. Very odd.

and did christ celebrate xmas.?.oh wait! he was Jewish....

it isn't an xian festival until early medieval period, and then not a major xian festival until C18th.(19th?)..

though it always been a proper booze up. a Christmas by any other name is just as indulgent.
this is why the Puritans sought to ban it.

meaning of Xmas = eat yourself silly, get wasted.

there are shades of pre-xian belief in the nativity play.

so really, i understand where the OP is coing from, but its just a childrens play (would you prefer Joseph for a Hebrew themed play instead?) and the main problm will be that it is boring, and if you have other kids, they'll misbehave/talk/ wee all the way through...

can you tell that i was always fourth angel?

Maybe he did celebrate his birthday, though? Am not up to speed on social customs prevailing in the first century AD Judea...

If people want to celebrate other festivals like Winterval or Yule or whatever, fine, but don't call it Christmas!

yesterday, lily, you seemed to be complaining about the rebranding as Winterval. You can't have it both ways. We don't call it winterval because its stupid and annoying.

Anyway, its become just a name for a lot of us. Christians don't mind using 'Easter' for the spring holiday ... if you're being consistent you shouldn't be using a term deriving from derivation of Eostre, Goddess of Spring, should you?

I really think the pagans should start a campaign to 'put the Eostre back into Easter'.

(sorry, mangled my sentence there somehow)

Grimma, I don't have a problem with non-Christians calling it Winterval or whatever. I DO have a problem with the press/media/whoever telling people they 'can't celebrate Christmas because it might offend the Muslims/Sikhs/Atheists.' Which tends to be what happens. Certainly in our area.

I have yet to meet a Muslim or person of any other religion who finds it offensive - the only people to be offended tend to be atheists, or Council workers...

Christ wasn't born in December - don't they reckon April? or has that changed??

'put the eostre' back in Easter'

would this mean hormones in our easter eggs?

I really really don't get the worry about a nativity play, honestly! My ds1 did a play at school based on the book Oliver's Vegetables. I would have LOVED for him to have taken some notice of the storyline, as it ended up with Oliver eating all his vegetables. But no. It was a story to him.

If that's all the nativity is to you, a fairy story, then explain that to your children. They do have to know about world religions, they shouldn't be hidden away from them, they're such a fundamental part of understanding, tolerance and history. And with all these things it's much better for a parent to be able to have a conversation with a child about something, especially if it's school related.

Even being a Christian family, we have still had conversations about aspects of the bible (particularly things like Noah's flood/Creation stories) which are almost certainly stories written to illustrate something about God, rather than historical accounts. So we have explained why they were written, and what the message is, rather than saying 'It's just lies' or 'You must believe every word in the bible'.

I think that it is important that children learn the basics of the main faiths - the beliefs and stories that are central to each one. This is partly because greater understanding of the beliefs of others ought to help increase tolerance and respect, and partly because a lot of art and music is heavily influenced by particular faiths, and so will be easier to understand if you know the story behind the picture or piece of music.

With respect to the nativity plays in particular - I have to say that I loved them, and found them very cute, as well as heart-string-tugging, but I can quite see that some, like the OP, could object to it being given a greater prominence than other faiths' central stories. I could argue that, in the western world, more of the art and music are influenced by Christianity, and that could be an argument in favour of greater stress on christianity in schools.

I do think that acting out or role playing is a very good way for children to learn something - it would be interesting to see if children remember the nativity story better because of the annual nativity play.

The majority of atheists who've expressed a view here aren't worried about the nativity play. Not even SGB and UQD. I don't even think the OP is as het up as her title implies. Just a bit pissed off that this is the only performance the little kids do.

I agree about the media, lily - they just make up that drivel.

Amazing how long we can drag out such a non-issue!

Just think "What Would Jesus Do?", that always works for me.

Amazing how long we can drag out such a non-issue!

half the fun of Mumsnet.

Sooo... WWJD? Well, in this context that would be lie around in an animal trough. I don't think that's going to help the OP much

Surely the nativity isn't the ONLY performance they do - certainly isn't at my kids' school - they do loads of little plays etc.

My issue is finding pictures of Jesus that actually LOOK like Jesus would have.

My facebook status right now is "..has just bought a Christmas Story book for DS based on the fact that the Holy Family actually looks Israeli,"

I wish DS would do a Nativity play! What fun! But if he goes to a public school (state school over there) he will most likely just sing songs about winter. Perhaps I will have to start a thread talking about how annoyed I am that my Christian DS is being forced into doing a Humanist performance. ;)

yank

Don't they do nativity plays at Sunday School in the US though? I was in loads through my formative years - must have played every part except the donkey in my time!

Yes, they do and I imagine that DS will take part. DH and I are considering sending him to a religious school so that he will be taught our beliefs, but they're expensive. Also we talk about it at home, so really I don't care what he talks about at school. (All the public schools here are secular.)I do get upset, though, when kids who are Muslim/Jewish/Pagan/Athiest get to talk about their beliefs whenever they want and it's all fine in the name of diversity, but mentioning Jesus gets a look. Ah well, that's life!

ds3 said "
its always the same; boring jesus boring mary boring joseph, I want some action"

thank god THIS IS MY LAST YEAR OF IT I have done EIGHT of them

I'm not sure casting a child as Bruce Willis in Die Hard would be appropriate in a Nativity, but it would at least fulfil his request for "action".