How do you maintain an enthusiastic demeanor about your child's school play, when inwardly you HATE that it is nativity?

[nevergoogledragonbutter]

Ok, so i'm not religious. I'm personally somewhere halfway between atheism and humanism depending on whether i can see a difference between the two, a moment that comes and goes.

But, I have come to accept that we live in a country that teaches a 'broadly christian' approach after being initially a bit wtf to find that him going to a non-faith school actually doesn't mean we can avoid the subject.

I don't feel that taking him out of assembly would make any difference other than to make him feel different about something he's too young to understand.

But, it irritates me highly that he is taught bible stories at a non-faith school and it irritates me even more that he will be expected to re-enact the nativity story and spend the next 6 weeks learning his songs and lines.

And while i would dearly love to see my 5 year old sing and dance or say some lines, the experience is marred by the play being religious. i have to somehow look past the religious aspect.

I don't want my own beliefs to ruin what could be a very enjoyable thing for him to do with his friends.

Is it possible to keep my feelings hidden? Is that the appropriate way to deal with it?
Why can't they do something else that would be entertaining for everyone?

But if you as parents think it is rubbish, then just tell them it is like Cinderella or Snow White or whatever, but that some people believe it.

We are a Christian family, but we don't tell it as fact, we say 'some people believe that....' and they know that we do.

Don't you think the nativity is part of our cultural heritage, as well as a religious heritage? Generations of children wearing teatowels or sheep ears, lisping Away in a Manger?

I'm a diehard atheist who was brought up JW (no Santa or Christmas whatsoever). My boy goes to a Catholic school ( I'm in Ireland so I have little choice). I blubbed shamelessly at his Nativity play. .

Also having lived in London until a few years ago I would have been sad if my son's school wasn't multicultural, as I want him to be exposed to lots of cultures. Coming from Northern Ireland myself I think the more mixing of races, cultures and religions the better, especially at school age.

absolutely, I think it's important for them to learn about all religions, and although our kids are at a CE school, they learn about other festivals such as Diwali, Eid, Hannukah etc.

Who is that post addressed to, Lily? Because of the posters on this thread, everyone (even the OP, after her OP) appears to either fall into the "genuinely religious" camp or the "part of our cultural heritage" camp.

I don't know exactly - prob the OP.

Actually, I do find threads like this touch a bit of a nerve with me, because from now until Christmas, there are threads on here and stories in the media about 'Christmas not being PC anymore' and 'Christmas will offend the Muslims' (and I no sooner believe that than I believe in Santa Claus!). Or calls to 'rebrand it Winter Festival'.

It seems that Christians are the only people who have the right to celebrate their festivals questioned.

I know that isn't quite what the OP was saying, so apologies for that, but it is infuriating when you keep reading that 'the nativity is now offensive to certain groups of people' etc etc.

Sorry for ranting!

The stories in the media are bollocks, though. See here, for example. The publicity huffs that "Christians have the right to celebrate their festivals questioned" but the actual amount of questioning of Christians' right to celebrate their festivals that goes on appears to be close to zero.

I think i see your point LilyBolero.

I have no problem with christians celebrating christmas with a nativity play.

It's that all the non-christian children also have to do it and their non-christian parents only get one chance to see their 5 year old perform in a play and it's the nativity and not something that everybody can enjoy.

I'm astonished that parents don't enjoy seeing their kids in a nativity play. What a shame.

Here in the usa in the state (public) schools we don't do anything religious. Instead they have Thanksgiving performances that consist of the Pilgrims singing and dancing to the tune of some inappropriate contemporary pop song. Never mind that the Pilgrims were devoutly religious and did neither singing nor dancing. Nobody seemed to grasp the irony of it and I got a lot of blank looks when I tried to point it all out. Maybe a fairy story about the "virgin" Mary is a little more believable/palatable than singing and dancing Puritans!

I'm a Christian but I see your point. I go with other posters on the "if it's just a story it's no big deal," thing, though.

I don't believe in the whole Pilgrim/Indian thing we go on about on our Thanksgiving, so that's going to be a tough one for me when DS goes to school.

I'm in Canada and the no religion in schools things seems very strong here too. In the UK the children usually did some strange combination of a nativity plus Santa plus some other story too. Here we just have Santa, and the choir doesn't do many non Santa songs either. I am an atheist, but I also really really dislike all the Santa rubbish.

However I go and smile and clap and the kids are fantastic whatever they are in.

Nativity plays are harmless enjoyment. It is the re enactment of a traditional story. Why not take it in your stride and enjoy it. I Am not religious myself but I think the unusually strong feelings you have about it are very misplaced and weird. and may ruin it for your child. Why are your feelings so incredibly strong? This is not the normal reaction!

I'm sure this has been said already (haven't got time to go through whole thread) but if you are that anti-religion and nativity, I guess you dont celebrate Christmas.

If you do celebrate Christmas then you are a hypocrite. If is wasn't for the whole nativity then there wouldn't BE christmas.

You don't get one without the other.

I disagree completely. Am Christian and had no objection to my children acting in various other stuff. Why? Why would I?

Don't put up a Christmas tree, don't do anything else associated with Christmas if you feel like this. Do you have the same lack of enthusiasm for everything else to do with Christmas? Or do you approve precisely because they are secular appropriations of it?

This is such a drainy way to think about it. Just picking holes and being so flipping right on.

'My children are atheists.'

I think that a DC young enough to do a nativity play is too young to be anything at all. They do not have enough facts or life experience to have made up their minds. I was once appalled by an American preacher whose 3yr old DD had given herself to Jesus aged 3 yrs!! Utterly ridiculous-she would have given herself to anyone her father asked. Key stage 1 DCs are not Christians,atheists, Muslims etc, they are merely the DCs of Christians, atheists, Muslims etc being brought up that way and they will make up their own minds later.
Christmas may well have pagan origins but if you adopt the name Christmas then DCs should at least know where the name comes from-the nativity play is a good place to start.

That's a quote from Quattro, whose DCs are (IIRC) 9 and 11. Which is probably old enough to have your own opinions on the matter, even if those opinions change later in life.

Oh I am very much in favour of treating Father Xmas, the Tooth Fairy, Jesus, Allah, Rama, Apollo, Diana, Odin and the rest exactly the same: colourful and entertaining stories with cultural/historical importance. Because I have yet to hear anyone explain the difference between (say) Allah and (say) the Tooth Fairy in a way that doesn't boil down to 'Well my one is more real than yours BECAUSE I SAY SO!'.

"the experience is marred"

what are you like db

Well you can celebrate Christmas in a pagan way, nothing wrong with that, the pagan festival preceded Christmas. But I cannot understand this intolerance for acting out the Christmas story. I would have no problems with my ds being in a play based on any other faith. Why can't you just tell your child it is a story? I have been brought up in a Christian environment that was loving and tolerant of other religions. I tell my dc that the story of Christmas is a very special one but we don't know if it really happened or not. What is so wrong with that?

And I just can't get into the stupid/reductive argument about no difference between major world religions and the tooth fairy. My brain will atrophy.

There are differences - for example we know that Jesus and Mohammed were both real men, whereas the tooth fairy to my knowledge is not a REAL fairy....

Santa is a hybrid - it is based on a real man (St Nicholas) but no-one actually believes that Santa ACTUALLy comes down the chimneys and flies around with reindeer.

In ds's first nativity play his part was a talking owl.

In his next one he played a tree. dd was a dancing raindrop

This time he is Gabriel. Dd is doing more dancing but not sure what.

As an atheist, I am happy with all of roles - they are all equally in the realms of fantasy.

I love watching them because I love the tradition. We also always watch a version of Christmas Carol and Christmas - I don't believe in Scrooge either, but the tradition is nice. To me, Christmas is all about tradition and the coming together of family and a small child's nativity play is part of that.

I see no logical inconsistency here with my approach.

LilyB: There is a moderate (at least) amount of doubt as to the historical existence of Jesus Christ (eg whether the mythology is about the life of one man or a collection of 'hero' tales from a particular era).

However, something I am genuinely wondering about and would like to ask any Hindu, Muslim or Sikh (or any other faith) MNers: how do you feel about the rest of the population 'joining in' on your special occasions - do you encourage it and think they are being spoilsports or bigots if they won't play along, or do you think that it's actually a bit cheeky for a non-Jew, for instance, to light Hannukah candles?

Imagine HATING a nativity play.

Actually, I can't.