Naked children

[nappyaddict]

Which of these places do you let your children run around naked?

1. Public paddling pool
2. Outdoor swimming pool
3. Whilst using the play equipment at the park
4. Beer garden
5. Your street

Well, I have to say, as someone who has worked closely with the police over these matters (naked children) I am astounded at the ignorance of the parents who feel it is appropriate to allow their child to be naked in any situation where the public can view them. Perhaps you should all visit your local police station and ask them about the scale of the problem of inappropriate behaviour towards children. Allowing children to run naked in public fuels this problem.

Firstly, use your loaf - where do you think paedophiles hang out? Public swimming pools is the number one venue, including in parks, and beaches is the number two venue. When Sarah Payne went missing, police clocked over 200 paedophiles stalking Littlehampton beach during their search for her.

Secondly,the majority of paedophiles are parents themselves. Not some dirty old man obvious for all to see. Woman are taking on a much greater role in child internet pornography - fact.

But just think about this - people trafficking is the most lucrative business in the world today and child trafficking is a major proportion of this. Do you honestly think this would be the case if there wasn't huge demand for it?

The police would actually like to make it an offence to allow children naked in public for the protection of the child.

I can only say that I pity the children of those parents who remain so ignorant to the world we currently live in that they continue to put their children at risk. These children will and do end up on the internet, regardless of the innocence of the picture.

Go ask your local swimming baths about the holes in the family cubicles that have to be regularly polyfilled. A member of staff at the spectrum in Guildford had to polyfill over twenty holes in changing cubicles during her first week at work and was very upset and disturbed at the level of the problem.

Sadly, as many of us know, often people who enjoy seeing their children running naked may not have the interests of their own children at heart.

Prob not playground; ouch to the slide! And prob not beer garden, though not so sure about that. Yes to the others, if they wanted to, again the risk of sunburn is the biggest put-off for me. Dd(5) is regularly naked with the neighbours' kids outside our houses, but we're not on the street.
It's not the kids responsibilty to second-guess the reaction of people who are offended or turned on by their bodies. I thought that argument had been fought and won in the 80's when we were all discussing whether women in short skirts are 'asking' to get raped. Those of us who are quite old that is.

Can I just add to that? One of the things I was told when all the above was going on was that the photos themselves were only part of the problem, it is what can be done with one of those photos. Imagine for a second a picture of your 3yo dc bending down to pick something up. Now imagine what could be done with that image with a decent photoshop programme.

It may sound like hysteria to some of you but the fact of the matter is that no-one can now tell me that the risk of a paedophile being around is too small to worry about. I used to think that and look where it got me (and my dc). I now know for a fact that that risk is too big a risk to take.

Try keeping clothes on DS in most of those places.

The park and beer garden I would attempt to keep clothes on him though.

"The police would actually like to make it an offence to allow children naked in public for the protection of the child."

Where exactly have they said this?

I didn't spend the 70s campaigning to stop judges letting rapists off because the victim was wearing a short skirt only to make my children cover themselves up just in case there happens to be some nutter taking photographs. I suppose it is possible that someone might. It's disgusting, but exactly how would it harm my child? I KNOW they will be harmed if they are made to feel that their bodies are shameful and must be covered up, or that the world is a dangerous place full of people who might do them harm.

I find it odd that DH has an issue with DD (6) being naked in our garden.

I haven't read much of this thread so forgive me if I'm repeating something someone else has said, but I kind of wonder what the point of the original question is? Is it a 'just out of interest' question, or asked to provoke an argument about paedophiles? If the former, it seems to have turned into the latter...

Personally I'd rather see a toddler running around naked than a big hairy man with his top off (there was a thread about this too).

I think we can't allow paedophiles to dictate what is and isn't acceptable behaviour.

Completely agree seeker. There might be someone somewhere turned on by my beautiful childrens' faces or legs.

But I would not make them cover them.

And the risk of a lifetime of shame, fear and hang-ups is real too. Jeez, bad enought to live with that if something does happen to you, why put that on our children who will mostly never be victims of anything?

TBH I find it quite surprising how many people think that the only way to keep a childs clothes on is to make them feel ashamed of their body. Most people have said that they keep their childs clothes on when they go into town/round the supermarket etc. Do your children have hang ups and poor body image because of that? I have already said that, in the home, we are very relaxed about nudity. Why do you think I would present the rules to my children about a paddling pool any differently to the way you present the rules about a supermarket to your children?

People who have these fears do not automatically become people who create fears in children. Some do I admit but I would coulnt them amoungst the loons too.

I really cannot see how people can see it as so one or the other, either you allow them to be nude outside or you create hang ups and poor body image. Why on earth can you not see a middle ground here? Are you really foolish enough to think that I say to my children "Ooh you have to keep your clothes on or a naughty man might photo your body and do grown up things to the picture", is it not more likely I say the same thing to my children re the pool that you say to your children re the supermarket?

But it's lovely to be naked when you swim and paddle. My children have never asked or attempted to take their clothes off in the supermarket, because it's chilly and hideous and we all want to get out asap.

I know you're not mad or horrible, it's completely culturally normal to tell them to cover up. It just seems a shame.

KingCanute- photos of naked children are still used in adverts and medical textbooks and all over the place. The pack handed out by the HV contained photographs of babies being born, nappy-changed etc. These photos are accessible to paedos already. And they are of real live children. So will these kids all be traumatised when they grow up and realise their photos have been accessible to the general public? I doubt it.

I cannot imagine that dd will be so hung up on nudity that it would be a problem to her as an adult if photographs of her as a toddler were circulated on the net. They are already on display in the family album, no doubt visiting boyfriends will get a good peek. A toddler is a toddler. Nothing shameful about it. Photos of her as a toddler will not make her feel she is exposed as an adult.

The damage the picture did was to you because you worried about it. And potentially in the future to your dd if she would really have been worried by a photo of her as a naked baby being circulated.

The only thing that worries me about internet child pornography is the concern that some of the children may have been abused and frightened when the photo was taken. But I can't imagine the child in the pregnancy and birth textbook will be traumatised if somewhere out there there's a weirdo getting off on her picture.

If allowing children to run around naked in public fuels the paedophile problem, wouldn't you expect it to be relatively small in the UK, where this is frowned on, but huge in Scandinavia where it is the norm?

Well I was the victim of two paedophiles as a child and I still have no issue if toddlers are naked around paddling pools or on the beach.

Anyone can photoshop anything and a paedophile can get his jollies in any number of ways whether my child is naked or not.

As someone who has been there and fgot the t-shirt , my life lesson is that the long term damage paedophiles do is more to do with shame and humilation than the physical.

I for one FUCKING REFUSE to allow paedophiles to destroy one more moment of innocence and joy and childhood if I can help it. And my children will run naked down a beach if they want to.
Pervy perveson can do his sad stuff. My victim days are done thanks

Ahh, I strongly agree that it is a shame. I would prefer it if all children could run round nude until school age or more, it makes me so ANGRY that one persons actions have altered my life and fundamental parts of me to this degree as well as having affected the life of my children or stolen the life they would have had.

What makes me more angry is that I know there are several hundred children out there who were directly affected by the things that I experienced, some of them may never know, some of them do - and have to live with it, others may find out at some time in the future with no warning, no preparation and no way to undo it. Those children could be my dcs school friends, our neighbours children, A MNers children, indeed anyones children.

However, I feel, the possible ramifications are too high a risk (in terms of the effects not the possibility) to make the difference between paddling in a cossie and paddling in the buff important.

Not a big fan of public nudity so ideally would have swimming costume but would have them wear pants/nappy as a minimum at an outdoor pool or the beach. yes I'm a prude.
Beer garden and in the street just a bit surreal really, don't generally get naked children in such places surely?

But King you are assuming that if a toddler has their picture taken without being aware, and that image is photoshoped, then the later discovery of that image would be dreadful and terrible and damaging.
Is that what you are saying?
Because I would not find it so. Not very nice of course but if I have not been harmed, if the photo is not real, then what is the issue? Apart from anything else if the photo is manipulated into child porn who is going to look at it other than paedophiles. I would not wish to see images of my own abuse because it would remind me. But if anyone found images I would have serious questions about what they could have been looking for to find them - so my abuse is only available to those who are themselves shameful. The notion of photographs is not an issue for me really. Are you assuming that because it would be an issue for you then it would ergo be an issue for everyone?
Am I being dim here? I realise it is quite possible that I am?

i would love to let DS run around naked as much as poss but to be honest I do worry about weird (sick) men getting off on naked kids in public. In our garden, though absolutely and anywhere else with close friends in private.

OOPS - sorry King
I have to go out. Should you reply I am not ignoring you !
Will catch up with this thread later.
Sorry to post and run ....

I feel just the same way, pagwatch

1. Public paddling pool
2. Outdoor swimming pool
3. Whilst using the play equipment at the park
4. Beer garden
5. Your street

not 3 because of safety for dangly bits

others would depend very much on where we lived/ were at the time. eg a 2pm on a saturday in the beer garden with sand and water pit that belongs to my local countryside pub and is very geared to families is different to 8pm on a friday in a smoking and beer consuming beer 'garden' out the back of the high street pub

I'd let DS (4) go naked at most water/grass/beach type play areas but tbh I'm fairly likely to insist on one item of clothing - but its not knickers or a nappy. I tend to say tshirt on in case of burns, bottoms off if you want to.

On the street - well he wouldn't want to - its concrete and ashpalt! Midn you if naked little boy escaped out the door and ran about giggling it wouldn't worry me one bit.

oh and on the peadophile issue - fgs get a grip?
As someone has already pointed out here are millions of perfectly legitimate piccies of makes tots used in marketing already.
I refuse to wear a veil and long robes in case I incite a man to violence and I refuse to insist on DS covering up when he wants to run about naked.

Pag, no I am not assuming that, I am well aware that it is not a problem for lots of people but I also know, from studies done, that they are a problem for lots of people. Most people, as adults would be pretty badly affected by, for example, a boyfriend taking a set of nude photos then photoshopping them to look like they had performed certain sexual acts and put them on the internet, circulted them to other people and so on. A lot of people would be concerned that a friend/co-worker etc would see them. It is no different with pictures of children except that the child would have had no knowledge that the photos were even taken so discovering them would be a big shock.

As for how they were found, yes I understand your point about questionable intentions, however, it could just as easily be the police knocking or someone discovering their partner has been viewing this stuff etc. THere are many ways for these things to come out.

Halia, I am here arguing the opposite case to you I have not yet resorted to "FGS" and so on, there is no need.

I do feel bad about my decisions, I do feel bad about my experiences and discussing it all on here is INCREADIBLY tough but I think it is something worth discussing, I think it is important. I am physically upset, I feel sick and have been/am crying but the reason (IMO) things never change and people have this whole "Psycho" image of people who make decisions based on what someone did to them is because people don't discuss it, people are not open. I am doing my best to be open and honest about a very difficult subject for the benefit of others, not to change their decisions but to allow them to understand another view point.

Please show a bit of respect.

Re the available photo argument, can you not see how ridiculous that is? If those photos were enough we would not have any problem at all would we? If there is plenty out there for the use of paedophiles they would not take more pictures. But they do, do you know why??? Because pictures of children taken "by hand" and "natural" are amoungst the highest prized pictures, one of the most liked and most wanted types of picture.