Is my snobbery hindering my son's development? Long.....

[GiddyGirl]

Not sure if I have posted in the right section. Bit of background. I moved from London to a new area 6 months ago and was pregnant when I got here - I since had DS and he is 3 months old. Apart from DH's family, I don't know anyone at all and I hate it here. I miss my friends, I miss work, and I miss the hustle and bustle of London - I now live in a village. I also live very close to DH's family and have realised - well, it has been confirmed -that I have very little in common with them. They talk about eastenders like it is real, they don't watch the news, they don't read books.

In an attempt to try and settle here, I took DS to a local baby group. But again, found that I have little in common with the mums there - they are all about 10 years younger than me for a start, don't have careers, married early, all they ever wanted was kids. They seem nice, but I struggle to make conversation with them unless it's about babies - I don't want to talk about babies all the time though. The one time we have talked about anything else - holidays - one girl said " oh no, we've never been abroad, we like Great Yarmouth." Which is up to her, but why did I feel myself turning my nose up at it. I am totally pissed off with myself because I want DS to mix with other babies in preparation for him starting nursery in 6 months, and I want to get to know people too but I feel like I pick holes in them as soon as I look at them - like their clothes, or their hair or the way their babies are dressed (tracksuits for example). I feel so guilty and am asking myself, if I can't mix, how is that going to be good for DS' development. I haven't been to baby group in a week and feel like a terribly bad mother holding my DS back because I'm a stuck up cow.

I feel a lot more positive than I did earlier. Stealthsquiggle, you are right, it will take time. The past year has seen major changes in our lives: moving house, redundancy and baby all within a few months of eachother so bound to be out of sorts. I've been feeling sorry for myself a bit I think.

I'm sorry SiL

OP, how about doing a college course - ie language or something..?

BetaDad - are you my husband? I feel just like your wife, having left London 10 years ago for the North but still miss it. I get to go through work quite often and that has kept me sane but may be about to change jobs to one with no London travel and I have made it a condition with my dh that I will be able to have a child free weekend there at least once a year .

To the OP - I was you once. It took me ages to find a group of friends. With hindsight I didn't go to enough toddler type groups or other activities so if you don't like the first one, try some others in nearby villages or towns and you may have more luck.

If there is something that you like doing eg going walking, you could always set up a group, say "Mothers who push or carry" and organise walks suitable for buggies/slings. Advertise in the local paper (quite often they don't charge) or the post office and you may attract like minded people.

Also, remember that you don't need to find a new best friend, just some people you can have a coffee with or go to the park with, so don't rule out people who seem nice but "not your type". Smile at everyone, always offer to make the tea or clear up at the end of the toddler sessions, and if you are feeling really brave offer to go on the committee if there is one - committees always need fresh victims ideas.

Keep at it - you will get there in the end.

the village baby group mums may also be dying of boredom from the baby/eastenders chitchat, IME it can be hard to get beyond the superficial onto more interesting topics at these type of groups.

Gateau - yes I agree. I am from York/Harrogate and it is a little like a microcosm of the South East. Lots of South East families have moved there too which multiplies the effect.

Maybe I should move back.

southernsoftie - glad to see your DH is understanding. We used to argue a a bit about it - as I wanted DW to let go of London from her mind - but I realised it made her happy so I encourage her to go now.

We only moved 75 miles out of London but are both from the North (see above). It would have to be York if we moved back - so we could get back to the south in 2 hours by train.

I have every sympathy with the OP and anyone who feels homesick after moving from London. The recent North/South dvide programme and MN thread was interestng in this respect.

"I hate it here. I miss my friends, I miss work, and I miss the peace and quiet of my village - I now live in London. I also live very close to DH's family and have realised - well, it has been confirmed - that I have very little in common with them. They talk about money and houses and schools and they don't watch much TV.

In an attempt to try and settle here, I took DS to a local baby group. But again, found that I have little in common with the mums there - they are all about 10 years older than me for a start, all career obsessed, married later, and aren't into their babies as much as me. They seem nice, but I struggle to make conversation with them unless it's about London stuff - I don't want to talk about that all the time though. The one time we have talked about anything else - holidays - one girl said "oh no, we've never been in the UK, we like Provence."

Discuss

I joined a baby group when I had ds and never felt comfortable - despite the fact that they were from a similar socio-economic background. I'm not great at superficial chit chat (despite happily posting on an anonymous chat forum )and prefer to see the friends I've already got.

OMG I must be the most superficial mn ever, as I kind of like the London baby group

I am finding it lonely here too - although it has got much better since meeting up with Bennyandjoon -

It does take time and you have to get out there, join everything and then withdraw from the groups you aren't keen on for whatever reason.

I moved in November, had a baby in Feb so haven't really done the "getting out there" thing until now. It's only now that I feel like I am making some new friends.

You have only had 3 months at this Mums and babys game. It takes time to find friends. A lot longer in the real world than it did at college as an 18 yr old and a lot longer than when you start a new job and spend 40 hours a week with the same people.
and sometimes it takes time to find out more than the obvious about people. Not every one talks to people they do not know about their year in japan, their banger car racing past (or present) or their passion for unicycling, some of us try very hard to pass for normal what ever that might be. I think my lad was 14 months before I found out the first of those things about the mum of one of his play mates, 24 months for the 2nd, the 3rd is me and plenty of people I see every week currently have no idea.

Giddygirl, don't panic. As soon as you go back to work you will feel human again. Part of it is losing your previous self through having kids, I still feel panicked about this every day! Can you try and find a few like minded people and also try to see the humour in the eastenders thing and even in the mums and babies group, I find that keeps me sane. Mother and baby groups are very useful but are a small circle of hell too, wherever you are...

Embrace rural life, get a few hens, grow a few veg, go to the local point to point, find a horse to ride, or perhaps get an au pair so that you can do some volunteer work or get a part time job.

How about joining a gym/ going for runs in the countryside so that you can have an excuse to wear a tracksuit too?

Sounds as if you are taking things far too seriously. I'll never forget my excruciating new neighbour, fresh from London who I invited round for drinks.

All she talked about was the expensive school her daughter would be going to and everything else she said had a competitive edge, I thought, my god, chill out.

As the local schools are fab in this area and I just felt she must have been very insecure to be like that. Anyway, 5 years on she is more relaxed thanks to her horse and the country air and change of lifestyle.

So, take some positive steps and you'll feel better for it.

I had a similar experience to you Giddygirl, when I had my dd2. I hated the playgroups and felt like I was different.

Eventually though I did make some good friends there. They didn'y but startrite shoes or bake bread but they were still lovely people. You only need to connect with a couple of people. Go to groups that you have to pay for like baby massage.

I wouldn't worry about socialising your baby though. He is not going to know.

Well it might be just me, but I always thought you have to be very lucky to find someone you really like at a baby group. Most of the time is just casual conversation about babies.
I felt really lonely and isolated when I had my ds, didn't find the baby groups much help, but still went. If no one was interested in talking to me, I just smiled politely, red my paper/book and drank my coffee. All because ds was a very sociable baby, who was much happier looking at other children playing (even at 3 months) than he ever was at home.
Oh, and I did manage to make a couple of friends... eventually. But it took a while.

giddygirl i'm going through the exact same thing! i moved from London back to my home town on the west coast of Canada, which i thought was the bomb when we left, but having returned, i'm bored to death. there is nothing to do and the art scene is a fucking joke. i think its just because i've grown and changed. when going to baby talk group, i ask the other mothers about themselves to get the ball rolling or you do end up only talking about babies, which is great but my argument is, i am not ONLY a mother and housewife. keep going because you never know who you may end up meeting. i can relate though.

I found the same thing with my London based NCT ante-natal group. Most of them were just very keen on shopping (I hate shopping!) especially Bluewater and IKEA. I thought they were lovely, but just not in any way like me, and they were actually not that dissimilar in age and background to me (although perhaps a bit stockbrokers wivesish). Still handy for those first few months, and great for sharing and comparing. Then I got hooked up to the slightly closer NCT group, who were all much older than me (but I am used to being the baby as I'm the youngest in a quite large family), but a much more varied group, most of whom worked in the public sector, and intended to return back to work. I felt much more comfortable, and this group became real friends.

I think you either fit or you don't, and especially if you are not naturally gregarious it can be incredibly hard work if you feel out of kilter. Work forces you to socialize because you have a common activity, and you don't have to bare your soul to have a good conversation or sense of cameraderie.

One thing I have found in moving about quite a bit in the last year is that volunteering for things is really a great way to make friends, as people are really pleased to see you and you have a common purpose. Plus you don't have to talk all the time because you are doing things.

I found general mums and toddlers groups quite torturous to be honest.

This was me, around 10 years ago.

If I had to do it again? This is what I would do differently.

I would not go to mother and baby/toddler groups. You could die in the corner and others ( who all went to School together and have never needed to make new friends) would step over your corpse rather than acknowledge you.

Accept that sometimes a bit of company is all you need. Go and find some new friends through an evening class etc- anywhere that there might be like minded people. They will exist in your new location-honestly they will be everywhere!

as soon as baby is old enough, go to something like tumbletots( from 6 months?, jo jingles and make a huge effort with anyone who looks promising friend material- literally "I have just moved here and am looking for friends". If they are your sort of person they will respond- if they are not- move on!

Start looking for part-time work now! It will keep you sane!

as others say- keep an open mind and don't make enemies- if you are going to stay where you are you will be at the school gates with these people for 6 years!

I moved from a city to the country 3 years ago. Yes at first people only talked about babies at teh titch & bitch sessions, but they didn't know me and so made the valid assumption that at least we had that in common.

I have now made loads of friends through the kids and by joining the Parish Council ( where they are all about 20 years older than me). In a village it is important to join in local events, otherwise you will always be looking in.

You may be really suprised by the locals.... our village is the first in the country to be fully wireless, you may bump into retired professors or CEO's of large multinationals, a TV producer or 3, Olympic athletes. If I had not become involved in the local community I would have thought I lived in a place where everybody stayed in the local area for their hoildays and raised sheep or worked in the local factory.

I think a lot of people go to mother and baby groups etc not really wanting to be there-they think they are different and above it all. They assume that it will be boring because everyone talks about babies and they want to rise above it.
They get there and everyone talks about babies-they have to to start with because it is the thing they all have in common. If you were going to dog training classes you would talk about dogs to start with. You don't have to stick with it!
I get the impression that you have a little group of mothers-all talking about babies and each one thinking it is boring-but no one gets away from the topic! Use it as a starting point and change the subject-there are probably some very interesting women there if you look beneath the surface.

I don't think it is always about feeling above it all, just often quite alienating if you are not great at being sociable with strangers (which many of us aren't). You sit there feeling that you should be chatting away, not knowing anyone and thinking that no one likes you, and that you would really rather be anywhere but there. Plus you are probably knackered and emotional. Then it finishes and you feel a failure for not talking to anyone. Or people do talk to you and you feel that you have nothing to say in response because perhaps the one thing you really really don't want to talk about is your baby (if you are in that there is more to me than motherhood phase anyway) or you say something a bit feeble and the person never speaks to you again. Everyone else chatting away makes you feel like a pariah (and probably makes you withdraw and the other mums think you are unfriendly). Then you wonder if you are failing at this apparently universal requirement to enjoy mother and baby groups because you are a bad mother, or maybe even a bad person.

Mother and baby groups are just torture IMO!

Hi Giddy,

I don't think you are a snob at all. Snobs don't know they are being snobby - lack of self-awareness is a hallmark of snobbisness.

Give it time. You'll start to spot the lively minds amongst the other mums - remember that they are sleep-deprived like you just now so maybe not at their best.