Come and have a pop at the NCT... how we love to loathe 'em

[volunteervole]

Why does everyone love to hate the NCT? Seriously, why?

Open up the Times today and you have Melanie Reid spouting about homebirths and casually chucking in a nasty reference to the NCT making women feel like crap. A quick search on MN reveals complaint after complaint along the lines of: "Oh the NCT, don't get me started", "Bloody NCT, what do they know?", "NCT bunch of smug bastards make me feel like rubbish", "Fleeced at an NCT sale" etc. etc.

I volunteer for the NCT (hence name changer here) and spend hours and hours each week running teas, putting pregnant people in touch with each other, hosting a website about local playgroups, trudging around in the evening delivering newsletters ... and so on. All for an organisation which seems to be popularly loathed. How is it that the NCT has such a spectacularly bad reputation? Am I wasting my time?

I really get what you are saying about motherhood denting your confidence - I felt like a nothing after my first baby was born - now I have two I am an opinionated mouthy cow . The MN board is anecdotal and so not a guide to how people actually feel about the organisation. I am guessing they do do some sort of feedback (can't remember if we had forms) Anyone who works with first time mothers (of any age) needs to be aware that they are undergoing a huge life change and not all of us find the transition easy. that's why I would urge you to get your thoughts down on paper and send them in. Obviously you don't want to say which groups/teachers you found unhelpful on here, anonymity and all that but if you really feel strongly about this then please tell the NCT (you can google for the address). You paid for a course and it didn't meet your needs. Telling them that is not an unreasonable thing to do and it doesn't matter if it is retrospective.

Let's see if we get that webchat eh?

True, i might consider it. My Mum is the chief exec of a voluntary organisation i know they take there image very seriously a web chat would be a great PR excercise.

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I must admit at this point admit i am a nurse who is hoping to train as a midwife next year so i do hope to play some part in the system. I hope that one day when i'm a midwife i'm one of the nice ones although judging by the kind of nurse i am i doubt it. I had always planned on being a midwife but got waylaid by a handsome man and an exotic beach.

Getting a bit worried now.

You basically have to book in for NCT classes the moment after you pee on a stick (and I'm not even in London). So I'm signed up, paying in installments because it's so expensive.

This morning, my midwife was droning on about me being 'socially isolated' so I mentioned I'd signed up for NCT classes and hoped I'd meet some locals. She REALLY didn't like that and made a number of comments about the NCT 'slagging off' the midwifery team, and how I'd be made to feel bad if I didn't 'give birth on a single puff of gas & air'.

She wants me to go to the NHS parentcraft classes, and I expressed concern that I'd be twice the age of some of the participants (though I'm happy to go and get whatever info I can, but I just can't see making friends there).

Gah. At the moment I feel like I don't want to go to anything. Before I got pregnant I was all for a lentil-weavery home birth with no pain relief. The fact that pregnancy has not been ANYTHING like I expected has made me rethink a bit. Plus because I'm fat and depressed, I'm not allowed a home birth, and I have to see a nasty consultant who just goes on and on about how fat I am.

I've given up feeling like I have any choices about anything. What's the point in educating myself and trying to have any measure of control. Whatever I do, someone will think it's wrong, and I can't possibly know what will happen. I don't even want to bother with a birth plan--if I have no expectations, I can't be disappointed, right?

Wonder if I should just get my money back from NCT.

Yank, it is a good place to meet people. You just have to take it all with a pinch of salt. Having had 2 babies i can honestly say that having friends with babies is the most important thing for your sanity. Have a look around your area ifm there is other things such as post natal groups childrens centres etc then that may be enough.If not go for a snigger you'll be going with your eyes open.

Good for you Wolfy. Ultimately it is not going to be change from within which improves maternity services for all women in this country regardless of class. I get why some HCPs feel defensive in the face of criticism from voluntary organisations but then the maternity services in this country are not very good (as we frequently see in the papers). I say this as someone who had a great community midwife. Parents and babies are being let down by the system (which you also pay for via your taxes). As far as I know there is supposed to be an active and constructive dialogue between the NCT and the NHS but that doesn't mean there aren't unpleasant disagreements between individuals.

Yank I actually found the NHS classes much more judgemental when it came to breastfeeding. The MW talked about bf for ages then said "What are the advantages of formula feeding? None! Right! Next topic". Now, I am really pro-bf but there are advantages to ff. They don't persuade me but they might work for someone else. Don't know what to suggest. Maybe you could go along to your local Bumps and Babes and get a feel for the vibe there. Also what other post natal groups are there in your area. I think knowledge is power but you can inform yourself about birth and parenthood without going to an NCT class.

I can't even be arsed to change my name for this.

I also volunteer for the NCT, like posters above, I moved to a new area and wanted to meet people. And it does work, as someone else said above, as a middle-class introduction agency.

But as an organisation it is seriously flawed. Part of this is structural. The branches are social organisations, mostly comprised of women with older children (despite the fact that the NCT's remit is birth to 1 - you're not very likely to volunteer at that stage. They mostly want to do their own playgroups/socials etc and are not really that connected to the main charity and its aims (certainly that's true in our area, where not one committee member - I asked recently - joined because of the main NCT.

Plus as someone said above, the people who really benefit from the courses - and get their social lives out of it - will never join because they don't need the NCT.

The main, campaigning charity, needs all of these members to fundraise for its campaigning, but frankly doesn't give a flying stuff about them, except to generate money. They rely on the volunteers but treat them really badly and don't take into account the fact that branches and HO have really different aims and values. Our branch has come quite close to walking away and becoming independent (as several of the richer ones have done) but we can't be arsed. That's the only reason.

Yank try and find an aquanatal too they're a good place to meet people.
Its a bit like starting school all over again but in the long run both you and your baby will benefit.

Give
The nhs is totally pot luck i've both good and bad experiences of maternity services.
I work for them now and can honestly say the service i provide is crap but its not (all) my fault its down to so many factors.

Light bulb moment.
The NCT in some ways set people up for a service the NHS can't always provide. If i had another baby i would probably go down the route of an independent midwife only because i would get exactly the kind of service that i would want. Maybe the NCT could fund more midwifery services??

BTW out yourselves name changers, i won't hold it against you.Promise

I have fessed up to working(PT) for the NHS.
I also run a business from home and must go and do some work or my DH is going to be less than impressed at my shameless MN on work time.

Vonsudenfed I think you absolutely put your finger on it when you talk about how the main campaigning charity relies on the volunteers but frankly doesn't give a flying stuff about them. It is such an odd organisation the more I find out about it, it seems amazing that it has kept going.

I will still stick up for it though, for example to YanknCock. I would recommend that you go along to the NCT course, if only because then you might meet other local mothers feeling similarly conflicted. As we have heard on this thread it seems to be pot luck whether you will get the kind of teacher that your midwife is talking about, or the kind who takes a much fairer and more sensible approach to everything (as outlined in NCT policies- but as we have heard the teachers don't always seem to stick to them). It's worth a try, I think. I didn't get on an ante-natal course of any kind, so I started motherhood with zilch in the way of mum friends, and it wasn't a good start frankly. Oh yes, and when you say Yank that whatever you do someone will think it is not the right choice- well, welcome to motherhood

Von well that explains why the two members' meetings I have been to were such miserable affairs! I had no idea there was sedition in the ranks. The only thing is that splitting up (a la Life of Brian) into factions rather weakens the force for change. I think women acting together to change things for each other is a good thing. Women having coffee mornings is also good but it doesn't have the same impact

The thing that I questionned most, having gone to an AGM, is just how much money local groups have to give to the national office.

In the meeting I went to the majority of the time was spent discussing how they could possibly find the money they had been told to pay.

No wonder the organisation is so poor when they are trying to cut costs so they can afford to maintain their group.

"Welcome to the NCT - the UK's leading charity for parents"
so long as you're a mother, not a father

"We help over a million mums and dads each year through pregnancy, birth and early days of parenthood."
through pregnancy and birth I can accept, no courses or help available in my area for the early days of parenthood

"We offer antenatal and postnatal courses,"
what postnatal courses?

"local support"
not in my area

"and reliable information to help all parents."
must have missed this bit

Maybe I'm just in the wrong area? I tried to join the neighbouring area which seems very active, but although I am equal distance between both groups my postcode puts me into the other group.

i agree with what vonsudenfed and others have said, and i am slowly moving back from my local branch. i just don;t have the time to keep giving, head office have never replied to a single email i have sent, the antenatal teaching course does not fit with my own personal ethos and the expense , time commitment etc was too vast ... am tired of fighting against the negative reputation every time i mention that i am a volunteer

but it has done me a lot of personal good, so i hvae tried to stay committed, but jsut don;t have the time anymore

That is fascinating Lulu to hear that you too are tired of fighting against the negative reputation every time you mention you are an NCT volunteer. I thought it was just me.

I do have the time to continue volunteering, and the personal view that it is good to put parents (predominantly mothers, yes wriggle) in touch with one another locally. I have some kind of misguided hope that I might, in my own small way, be able to protect some people against the social isolation which accompanies so much of motherhood and compounds PND. Whether that is all on a hiding to nothing because the NCT has such a poor reputation- that's the question.

i have been involved since DD was 1. she is 4 in the summer, i have gained a lot from it, but the reputation of teh NCT , has, if anything, gone down since i was involved, i am a volunteer and i don;t have the strength to keep justifying the NCT.

which is a terrible, terrible shame

because you can change things from inside, but there comes a point where you have to say enough is enough

i applied several times for teh special expirences register, for instance, no replies

but they are quick to chase me up for my membership fees !

Kazbeth thats horrible, i had something similar happen to me but not at the NCT and it was the most isolating experience, i didn't attemp anything new for months and wallowed in depression instead. I can't imagine treating anyone like that its horrible.

I was really suprised by how rubbish some of the activities organised were at introducing people, i used to toddle along to baby splash week in week out with my 8 week old not that she could have cared less in the hope of talking to someone. I always thought it would have been nicer if there was an organised meet and greet or what ever you want to call it.

Seriously, does the NCT head office have any clue how dissatisfied its volunteers feel? This sounds like an awful waste of goodwill and hard work.

I wanted to do something breastfeedery with them. I'm not really a coffee morning group type person (antisocial bugger probably ). I get on much better one-to-one but this thread has been very enlightening and rather depressing. I'd like to help women who want to breastfeed the way I was helped when I needed it but I don't fancy the idea of "continually battling negative stereotypes". I thought a lot of the anti NCT stuff was misogynistic, and to an extent I still believe that but there is clearly more going on.

I can only imagine the delight at Nestle & Co. if such organisations which promote and encourage breastfeeding bites the dust, or at least fades out of consciousness

and the last bit should have been "if organisations like the NCT which promote and encourage breastfeeding bite the dust or fade out of consciousness

they are supposed to be consulting on their strategy for the next 10 years

Interesting thread. They do lots of good stuff and I am grateful BUT my perception is that the national bit hog all the money and then embark on campaigns that are not that relevant to lots of people.

I think they take 70% of all money raised locally as well as the membership subs I have thought about volunteering to deliver the newsletter but then thought 'for god's sake, just buy a franking machine'. It takes the piss expecting people to hand deliver them. Just gives the message that they don't care about volunteers and that they are not using people's time efficiently.

Some one asked what the charity spent its money on ... we spend some on lobbying and campaigning - examples of changes the NCT has brought about include:-

• Fathers able to choose to be present at their babies birth

• Babies kept with their mums after the birth

• An end to unnecessary routine procedures such as enemas and pubic shaves,

• Guidelines to prevent the routine use of episiotomy, continuous electronic fetal monitoring as the evidence shows these do not improve outcomes for low risk pregnancies

• Greater support for birth centres

• Focusing attention on the rising caesarean rate in the UK and successfully lobbying for a commitment to reduce the rates in line with the World Health Organisation (WHO)

• Recognition that birth environment matters and commitment in government policy to make improvements

• Policy that supports normal birth - maternity matters was hugely influnced by the NCT as were the policies in Scotland and Wales and NIs direction too.

Very interesting, i hadn't realised it was the NCT that brought an end to those things. My poor old Mum endured most of those things at my birth although i think she was rather pleased my father wasn't allowed in apparently it made her nervous.

Am i right to assume from your username you are the Chief Exec of the NCT? If so how do you feel about the reputation the NCT currently has and are you doing anything to change it. Do you think people make valid points with regards to the fact that there is vast differences in the standards depending what area you live in?

Posting to bookmark thread so I can come back and have a look at it tomorrow, and hopefully post my own view.

I'm impresssed that the CEO of the NCT (if that's true) was posting so late on a Friday night!

I'm going to read through the thread but my first thiught is how comical that people will bash the NCT on this forum when it's now the official NCT forum.