My ds doesn’t seem to understand consequences

[itstrafficlights]

Maybe this is normal, I don’t know.

DS(5) attacked someone at school quite badly. We were meant to be going for ice cream as a treat; obviously not going now. Ds doesn’t seem to understand that he did something wrong so isn’t getting a treat. Doesn’t seem bothered about what he do just just the ice cream. Is this normal? Quite upset about it.

@itstrafficlights I think you are getting a lot of unfair grief on here and I would have done the same as you. Perhaps explaining we can’t go to the park now because we need to go home and think about how we might say sorry to ‘X’ and what we could do next time when ‘Y’ happens.

School will have had consequences already and hopefully he can see / hear / feel how disappointed you are.

At age 5 the consequences need to be immediate and have a direct link, because they’re too young to associate not going for ice cream with attacking another child.

It might have been better to take him straight home, talk to him about how disappointed and angry (or whatever) you were with his behaviour and reinforce whatever sanction school have imposed. I’d then clearly explain that the treat has been removed because he let you down in his behaviour and impose whatever I’d impose whatever sanction you feel is appropriate. The school will address his behaviour there, the home sanction would be because he is accountable at home too for his behaviour.

For me that would be me effectively doing “time in” doing stuff with me around the house while listening to him explain what happened from his point of view, while thinking about how he can deal with things at school. That may be staying well away from the other child, seeking help from adults before he looses his temper, asking the school to facilitate an apology but I’d be led by the school and the other child’s needs.

I agree with drawing a line under it, but my child would be under no illusion that their behaviour was utterly unacceptable and would be clear about consequences should it happen again.

I would be grateful if you could share the consequences you would impose because I am unsure of any that correlate directly to the action.

They don’t, the concept of natural consequences doesn’t fit here because ultimately the natural consequence (not having friends) is too abstract for a young child and too harsh to let play out. I think it’s fine as a parent to impose a consequence - which you did - he just needs you to make the link very explicit.

Thank you. Much appreciated. It can be hard to get ds to listen and I guess he was too emotional after school to take it on properly.

I can see you are genuinely taking this seriously so ignore some of the comments. You were right not to buy him an ice cream. Maybe set consequences going forward. IE if you hit again you will lose your favourite toy or whatever he enjoys. Also try and explain he is hurting another child and he wouldn’t like if another child hurt him. Tell him if another child upsets/annoys/hits him to tell his teacher.

Thanks @Wayk . I do appreciate that - I knowMN can be a bit like that sometimes though. Ideally I’d like him to understand why it’s wrong and not to do it. We’ve read the colour monster and talked about what to do when he’s ‘red’ for those who know it and I’ve stressed it’s OK to be angry but absolutely not OK to hit or worse and hopefully he knows that now.

Writing an apology letter.

I would have not gone to the park or for ice cream.

I would have banned screens for at least a week. I would have got my son to write an apology letter. I would have spoken to him with his dad and explained that we don't hit people because it hurts them and that next time he's cross he has to tell a teacher.

Yes, my two need a bit of space to calm down and think before being able to talk about it. That’s the purpose of “time in” it keeps them close, keeps communication open while also doing something constructive.

I agree with leaving a bit of time after school before trying to unpick. I'd have told him about the screen ban in school to try and make the link. Then I'd have gone home and let him play lego or something for a bit, then talked to him.

He is in reception, he can’t write ‘properly’ yet. He’d need me to write it and copy it (and the child wouldn’t be able to read it!)

He likes writing and drawing so I’m not sure this would be a consequence although it is a nice idea.

As it was the evening went

no park / ice cream following the conversation with teacher
home, played outside for a bit, dinner
shower, he read to me
we talked about what happened and how he could have handled it differently
read Colour Monster and spoke a bit more generally about anger
read some funny books to move on

so I think I handled it reasonably, maybe not perfectly and would welcome any tips but I don’t think it was that bad really.

You writing and copying is exactly what should have happened. At the very least a sorry picture. It's showing them that a gesture can help repair relationships.

Apart from that, you've done nothing else wrong. Your consequence wasn't really a consequence because he had it anyway, I'd perhaps have gone harder on that with no screens or taking something he likes. If he does it again, you have that option now.

As a teacher, I always hoped that whilst parents would reinforce how disappointing poor behaviour was, supporting the consequences that the school had implemented they would not follow up with more sanctions at home with very young children.
I don't think you should have gone to the park but also don't think you should implement any further sanctions, other than telling his Dad, who will also express his disappointment.
You do need to tell.him each morning as he goes into school that you want to hear that he has been kind all day. If he is then you can reward his good behaviour, which is always more effective.

Of course you shouldn't have taken him to the park and bought an ice cream. Are you being obtuse on purpose? It's not sufficient as a stand alone punishment. For physically attacking another child at school, I would be giving him protracted talkings to and consequences lasting at least a week.

I don’t feel I am the one who has been obtuse on this thread but it is possible we are all reading one another with intent that is not there.

No screens would be hard to implement as he has a sibling. They don’t have tablets so this would mean I effectively ban her from the TV as well which is unlikely to go down well. We don’t actually have TV during the week and today is Wednesday so the after effects of this would only be felt Friday which is unlikely to be very effective, I don’t think (in case that is read wrong that isn’t me being obtuse, I’m genuinely asking.)

The other issue with no screens for a week is that it drags it out, I feel. I instinctively feel it’s better to draw a line rapidly and move on but perhaps that is not right.

I think dragging out a consequence is OK once it's started. Attacking someone should have a severe consequence.

Banning screens is easy, make his sister watch and he's in another room.

I think the point with banning screens, toys etc is you're taking away something they usually and routinely have. Taking away a park visit and an ice cream isn't something they have every Wednesday.

I won’t be banning screens as they don’t have screens in the week anyway. But thank you.

It isn’t but it was more about not wanting to reward the poor behaviour than directly imposing that as a consequence (I have acknowledged I phrased the question badly as I was upset at the time.)

I completely agree that he shouldn’t have had the treat either. Did you clearly explain to him why? I am a teacher, and you do need to check that he understands why you have removed/taken away something.

I would also have made him do an apology letter/drawing (tricky for a 5 year old, so heavily supported by you). I would also tell him you will be checking with his teacher daily as to how his behaviour has been.

With my own DC, I also really don’t beat around the bush with hitting. None of this, “Well, my darling, I can see you are frustrated…” I go straight to, “We do NOT hit. It is NOT kind. It hurts.”

@Covidwoes i did but he was upset and probably not listening. So I posted the thread on the back of that. I will reiterate tomorrow about not hitting etc (which he does know) and hopefully it was an isolated incident which will not happen again.

I don't think quickly skipping past really poor behaviour with a gentle word and a book is correct. We learn through experience and if the rubbish feelings that go along with the negative behaviour is too light touch then it's essentially meaningless.

I completely understand taking away the ice cream. I probably would have done the same thing. I have 5 grown sons. A couple of them did similar things at your child's age. After I determined I was clear on the situation I marched them over to that child's house and made him apologize.