If you use “natural consequences” what would you do with this 5yo behaviour?

[mumofonetwo]

This is NOT a gentle parenting bashing thread and nor do I misunderstand gentle parenting btw. Genuinely asking for those parents who avoid shaming punishments like the naughty step and generally favour natural consequences but who try to be authoritative (not authoritarian) what you would do / have done in this situation.

5.5 year old DS tired after school and very grumpy. Started being silly splashing water wildly at bathtime, then chucking bath toys etc. Long story short after warnings then coming out the bath he started kicking and punching me.

I’ve got down on his level, firmly held his arms and said we do not hit. But this escalated and he carried on hitting, and shouting “you bum-bum head”. (!)

WWYD

I used the naughty step and a stern, very loud voice. My children have never hit or shouted insults at me.

Honestly, just put him to bed to make sure that he got enough sleep to be in a better mood tomorrow. There would be no point in escalating it with punishing and there aren’t really any natural consequences?
you could address not hitting when he isn’t tired and would listen better?

Sounds way overtired based on experience rather than being naughty

I would have given one warning and then drained the bath water. When he was been hitting I would have left the room and said I am not spending time with some one who is being unkind to me.

I’d remind him we don’t hit and that we talk respectfully to each other. Would try to get him into bed asap. If he carries on he wouldn’t get a bedtime story. I never have a clue what to do in these situations though.

🤣 Love a good insult from a tired and cross 5 year old!! Obviously the hitting isn't ok. I think I would have said - probably quite loudly and firmly "You do not hit me." And then more gently "You must be very tired and very grumpy to be so mean to me. It's time for bed, lets go. Just one story tonight."

i have given up with trying to gentle parent. My children aren’t gentle children 😂

in all seriousness, I cannot fathom a world where my 5.5 yo would dare hit me. She is absolutely horrifically dysregulated after school and often just completely past it, but she knows there is a line.

she often messes around in the bath as you describe, if she started screaming at me I would put her in her room, walk away and tell her I’ll help her calm down when she is ready.

my 3 yo does on occasion hit me when he is tired, and it’s straight to time out.

My 5yo values his bedtime story. So I would explain that there is no story for people who are rude and hit.

But I'd also say there is a parenting fail before this happened. He's probably hungry and tired so needed more food, bath skipped or quick shower and bed.

Loud, stern voice, very serious dead pan face -
NO ! We do not hit anybody ! Enough !

pick him up remove from bath / toys /

right - get PJ’s on … and that’s enough !!

I would convey withdrawal from undesired behaviour sternly

and then when settled, lots of warmth and love ! Reinforce desired behaviour !!

is that too authoritarian???

I'd have done something like this, though none of my children would ever have hit me or called me names. If he continued hitting and name calling, no story either.

Agree, skip straight to in bed and lights out.

Ah well done you ⭐

Probably got the slipper out to the little shit

Shorten bed time routine down to bare minimum explaining why whilst you do it "we need to get you straight into bed because you are clearly so tired it is making you behave in a not nice way/hurt mummy/ not listen to mummy" and get him into bed ASAP.

Then review evening/ bedtime routine so he isn't repeatedly over tired in the future.

What time did all this exactly happen?

Because a 5 year old should be in bed by 7pm tops at this time of year.

Home from school, chill, dinner, bath, bed.

Thanks for these. Routine is: run bath at 6.30, but bath and before that poo time take ages, into bed at 7, stories seem to take till 7.30, then sing songs asleep by 7.50. Whole thing taking too long I know.

What time does he wake up in the morning? I’m concerned he isn’t getting sleep.

Why does the poo take so long. Is he constipated?

Wakes up around 6.30. No he just sits there chatting and singing! Not really constipated just takes his time! 🙈

Start bedtime routine earlier today, and remind him that yesterday he was so so tired that he got very grumpy and said some mean things.

So today we need to be really careful that we are ready for bed before we start feeling grumpy.

I say we, because the same applies to me🤣

Normal overtired little one behavior, but massively triggering nonetheless.

At 5 years old I would basically hold his arms to his own sides and say very loudly- I will not allow you to hit me. Stop it right now. And hold him still and try my hardest to stay calm. Once he's calm, normal bedtime. He's overwhelmed and not able to control his behavior. But yes, I'd physically stop the behavior for him. Getting angry back will just further fuel the situation.

Another time, during a morning when he's not tired, I'd talk about it again and see if we can come up with any other ways of being angry without being physical.

My kids now sometimes say to me, mum i am so angry with you I want you to go away and leave me alone. I see that as a win.

We talk about things later when everyone is calm.

Ditch the singing songs in bed! It’s supposed to be wind down to sleep time.

Then unless he has low sleep needs his bedtime is too late.

Whether this is the “correct” way of doing things I don’t know but on the occasions my overtired DD has kicked out I’ve said “you do not get to kick me”, picked her up, put her in her room and shut the door for “thinking time”. When the time is up I ask her what she thought about, then give her a cuddle and carry on with bedtime. I used to find that the stupid behaviour would continue longer if I gave it airtime and removing myself is better all round…

Absolutely take him out of the bath as you did. Had the hitting at bedtime before, not often but when it happened I handed over bedtime to DH and it was to bed without book.

Eta… it only happened twice. She’s 3.5 now and hasn’t happened for over a year.

He needs an earlier bedtime

I know it seems madness, but he needs to be asleep by 7pm.

They are SO knackered at that age, and this time of year.