Nursery not taking 3 year old to the toilet

[Sarahannn]

I feel like I’m banging my head off a wall with my daughter’s nursery. She’s a nightmare at not going to the toilet and at home needs asked to go every time. I don’t know why it’s never clicked but she will wet herself or leave it too late to say she needs it so constantly needs asked. Shes been ‘potty trained’ for a long time but we just don’t seem to get beyond this. She’s been at nursery for 6 months and I made them aware of this from the first day. She must have came home wet about 40/50 times since she started. It’s more than half the week I’d say. She was on reduced hours last year but has moved up to longer hours in the older room since last week. One member of staff seems to be really helpful and makes sure she goes - no accidents if she’s there but she isn’t always there. This week she’s came home wet both days so far, on Monday she was smelling of pee and most of it had dried so must have been wet from the morning and said she hadn’t been to the toilet all day. It’s fully her issue for not saying she’s wet or asking to go but I’m just so conscious if they keep letting this go we’re going to end up having this problem when she starts school 🤦🏻‍♀️ I’ve spoken to the head of centre and sent emails, spoken to staff so many times but they seem to say what they want you to hear then do nothing about it the next day. What else can I do other than keep phoning every week?

I would change nursery
that’s is so abysmal of them

I have applied for another one but they’re all full it seems and the one she’s at will be the one she goes to school beside so it has all her friends. I feel like I just worry the whole time she’s there that she’s walking about soaking all day 🤦🏻‍♀️

Lots of nurseries would expect her to go back to nappies I suspect because they can’t ask every single child constantly if they need the toilet. If a child at our nursery was having accidents every day then they’re not toilet trained and the nursery would then be saying they need to be in a nappy until they are.

Honestly I would rethink her going to the school if the nursery is this uncaring then I wouldn't hold out much hope for the school. There's no excuse for her coming home in wet clothes. Is there another nursery/school you could consider?

Is it the job of the nursery assistant, who is probably in a room with 15 or more other kids, to remember to ask your daughter every 10 minutes if she needs the toilet? I know its tough and not all kids are the same (my ds struggled with this until he was 4, so I absolutely understand) BUT this sounds like something that needs more work at home. If you're asking her all the time, she will come to rely on that and take no responsibility for remembering herself. Let her get wet and uncomfortable, she should soo figure it out.

this sounds very hard.. I do think they should be asking her - taking her - every couple of hours and more on board with what you’re trying to do. She’s not really toilet trained if she cannot feel / recognise the urge to go though. Can you do a weekend where you give her a smartie or reward every time she goes to the toilet successfully of her own initiative ?? Maybe at home you’re not teaching her to be aware of the urge because you are anticipating it for her by taking her to the toilet rather than her going when she has the urge.

It doesn't need to be someone constantly asking though Shmee1988. A plan where she's reminded or taken at set intervals would go a long way to resolving this issue or at least preventing the poor kid from spending all day in urine soaked clothes.

Except, every single post on here about kids going in to nursery will insist it is impossible to find one who will take a 3 year old who is still in nappies. It’s such lazy parenting, imagine a 3 year old who isn’t toilet trained.

If a nursery can’t do something as basic as making sure very young children are reminded to go to the toilet, they shouldn’t be in the business of looking after children.

As evidenced above by spending hours wet for probably 40-50 days so far, being wet does not let her figure it out. It’s just reinforcing the fact you can wet yourself if you want and don’t need to go. There is literally no more work at home that is not already being done, it’s taken over my life and is genuinely soul destroying. She’s missed nursery some weeks to go back to basics again and again. It seems to be a fear of going to the toilet so being taken repeatedly is the only thing that’s going to help

Minimum ratio is 1:8

Presumably every other child doesn’t need this. It really isn’t difficult to have a routine where they take this child to the toilet. It can be done when any of the other children choose to go in the day. This is such a basic thing, what exactly are nursery staff for if not to make sure children’s basic needs are met?

So she’s not potty trained.

You asking every time at home is doing more damage as she’s not learning to recognise the body cues in time to go to the toilet herself. So when that prompt isn’t there, she’s not going in time.

I don’t think it’s acceptable that she’s left in wet clothing or not appropriately cleaned so that she smells of urine. Sounds like her care plan at nursery needs updated.

If I were you, I’d take time off work and keep her at home for a week. Work on drastically reducing the toilet prompts at home and she’ll begin to recognise her own body cues. Then should be able to return to nursery with far fewer accidents.

Literally done it all/still doing it all 😩 We’re back at the chocolate buttons every time she goes just to try and get any sort of association between ‘I go to the toilet, I get a reward’ but it just doesn’t seem to matter. Tried even going the opposite way and saying if you don’t get X amount of stickers today there’s no tv programme tonight but it doesn’t matter. We’ll have a run of a few good days then back to square one. Been on the phone to helplines, read books, started again, had the health visitor round, been to the doctors etc but just praying something clicks before school

My DS2 was like your daughter. He just couldn't/wouldn't tell us he needed to go. He had a bladder of steel and could hold it for hours, but if you didn't prompt him to go, he wouldn't. For ages I tried leaving him and hoping he would 'recognise the urge' but he just didn't. We didn't have a nursery problem though because they used to remind them all to go at certain points in the day. It did eventually click and he started spontaneously taking himself off to the toilet but it took ages: he'd been 'potty trained' (this issue aside) for well over six months.

So I'm sure you'll get there, but it's tricky if the nursery won't co-operate. Leaving the issue of prompting her to use the toilet, it's clearly utterly unacceptable to leave her in wet clothes all day. Does she recognise that she's wet/does she have the confidence to ask them to help her change?

Sorry - cross posted with your update that you’ve gone back to basics already.

I realise this isn't what you're asking, but it's not really ok that they're not changing her when she's wet. If you think it's genuinely not obvious can you put her in clothes so that it is? E.g. light coloured leggings or joggers? If they are having to change her on a daily basis they might also be more motivated to take her to the toilet.

We tried it all too. Didn't work. DS2 is incredibly stubborn. He has to decide he's going to do something or he simply digs his heels in. He still (at 9) can't ride a bike because he refuses to try. I offered quite ridiculous levels of Lego bribery to try and persuade him to give it a go. But nope! (And he loves Lego!)

I’m glad you had some success eventually with it! I’m praying this day comes, I really wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy 🤦🏻‍♀️ She’ll eventually tell me if she had an accident at home but wouldn’t at nursery. It’s a very busy nursery though and I don’t think they have much small group time so she’d be quite far away from her group leader when the urge came. A lot of the time before if she came home dry it was just because she’d managed to hold it all day but now it’s longer days this is virtually impossible so she will need to go

It’s so beyond infuriating isn’t it 😭 You have to try and be so positive but in reality you’re like how have you not got this?! She can tell you when she’s hungry, bored, tired etc so must know she needs it and just will not say. How did you eventually get it to click?

Except if you say there’s a 1:8 ratio in a 3 year old room, a member of staff cannot be expected to be constantly checking if every single one of those 8 children need the toilet- they wouldn’t have time to do anything else.

As I say our nursery absolutely has the expectation that if not potty trained they come in nappies as it’s not possible for them to be toilet training.

Nurseries just don't seem to have enough staff to do anything regarding toileting now

DN's nursery requires two weeks of being dry at home before they'll allow them to come in without nappies. If they have more than one accident in a week then they must go back into nappies until they've had another two weeks dry. They won't remind or prompt children to go to the toilet except for to wash their hands before lunch.

Vastly different to when my older children went and nursery were very involved in toilet training.

I have kind of given up with that angle because originally that’s what I was asking for but then thought if they could just set an alarm or something to take her at a set time each day then we’d bypass the need to change her. The more obvious wet clothes could be worth a try. My friend has said she’s seen other children wet at pick up time 😩 so clearly not the only one

Except if you say there’s a 1:8 ratio in a 3 year old room, a member of staff cannot be expected to be constantly checking if every single one of those 8 children need the toilet- they wouldn’t have time to do anything else.

It shouldn't be beyond any nursery to have a general "does anyone need the toilet?" prompt every so often.

Yes, it won't catch everyone, but it would be a good start in reminding children to go while in nursery.

The local school nursery does this. Every hour or so at the beginning (while all the toys and equipment are new and exciting) and then by the time they're nearly ready for school they do it to coincide with break and lunchtime

The more you post the worse the nursery sounds to be honest. If parents are easily able to spot other children are wet at pick up time why can't the staff spot that a child has had an accident?

I can't understand why you're continuing to send her to a place where you know she's being neglected? It's happened 50 times, that makes it pretty obvious nothing is going to change. You need to pull her out.

You can’t expect a nursery nurse to ask every child every hour if they need a wee! Most if the children if they are interested in doing something will say no anyway even if they do!