French shopkeeper thinks English parenting is terrible

[Turquoiseforever]

Long one sorry, but I've included details to try and give an accurate picture!

Holidaying in France currently and have had a memorable incident in a shop today that has given me some food for thought, just interested in other people's thoughts on this.

Gave my oldest kids (3 & 6) €5 each to buy a souvenir of their choice at our local seaside town. Most shops turned out to be quite bougie and aimed at adults, but saw one which looked hopeful. Had an A-frame sign outside with a plastic colourful beach windmill on it, and a rack of children's clothes. Went in and quickly realised it was again full of very valuable things. At one end was a basket of handmade crocheted teddies, handmaid kids clothing, and some wooden toys. The kids took a look at the teddies, picked one up each then sat in two kids chairs holding them on their laps for a few minutes while I had a quick look round the shelves around them. We had a look at a few other things together, for full disclosure: when we entered my 3yo picked up a very delicate cup which I quickly set down and reminded her not to do. As we were leaving my 6yo very gently pointed out a necklace to me on a very flimsy stand that started to tip over, which I caught before it fell and set upright again. They looked at a few other things without incident or touching.

We didn't spend long, said merci and went on our way. About 10 mins later a lady from the shop approached us in the street and informed me my kids had broken two toys in her shop. We went back with her and found out that the rabbit teddies they had been holding had some very thin toothpick-like sticks of wood in each ear (to shape them a bit) which had been broken by my daughters twisting the ears, pretending to give them a 'hair style'. I had no idea at all they had been broken. Obviously this is my responsibility and error of judgement, and was totally correct to be brought to my attention.

However, the lady also subjected me to a rant about how French children would NEVER pick things up in a shop, they are taught "limits", whereas all summer she has had English, German etc children visiting and breaking things and being given "no limits" by their parents. Complained we had left the place a mess and her husband had to tidy behind us, because the teddies were placed back in the basket but not sat upright as previously displayed (I had set the chairs back carefully but admittedly been distracted from checking the basket).

I pushed back (calmly!) on her generalised critique of my parenting, and she said she has just lost patience after a summer full of similar experiences and essentially admitted this lecture wasn't personal. Still, it was pretty heavy handed to give in public in front of my children and other customers.

To be clear I know I made an error. We had been in a few quite breakable shops already which required heavy parenting, and I guess I saw an opportunity for a quick relief for us all. Normally I would supervise my children looking at anything handmade, so it was a lax moment, but I did think they were just wool and stuffing and wouldn't suffer at all from light playing. Also, typically I wouldn't take my children into these kind of shops. They have never broken anything in a shop before!

I just wonder how humbled I should be. Did I just catch this lady on a really bad day? Was she a bit racist? Are french children really that obedient all the time? Should I strike it off as a bad day and move on without too much thought, or do I take the criticism on board more strongly and accept I should be stricter with things like this and re-evaluate my parenting?! Do we really have much lower standards in the UK?

It's a shame, we've had a lovely holiday but now I feel like we're not that welcome here and have been judged/looked down on in general. Do we really have a terrible reputation in France?

France is in Europe, England is in Europe. Same race.

Or she is being honest about parenting styles of different nationalities? Dismissing the shopkeepers experience, doesn't make you right.

I’m British and as a child I was never allowed to touch anything in a shop and I am now a parent and my children were absolutely not allowed to touch anything either. The only way I would be holding a Teddy is if I was buying it.

30 years ago, I found the French,Spanish and Italians were much more understanding of my DD classical autism and learning difficulties. At the time in the UK, hardly anyone had heard of it!

I had cards printed in said languages to explain her difficulties . I also made sure that we all had a basic understanding of the language.
My daughter started using cutlery properly in France. Observational learning is powerful.
It made me realise I had let her away with it.

Different things are considered good manners in different countries. Even within different parts of the UK! When one travels you need to be sensitive to these things

Young French children are expected to follow French behavioural norms and manners.

The comments about unruly teenagers sees a little defensive. They are teenagers after all.
Language schools always seem to have poor staff student ratios. Often told to keep in a line of 4. They do need more supervision.
My English SIL complains about the behaviour of British teenagers at the language schools in her French town!

Having taught in France, UK and Australia. I would say that all teenagers all capable of being unpleasant if not supervised. Although, in France there is definitely better behaviour on the whole in the classroom. Parental support is more apparent too.

As for shoplifting, our local shops only allow 2 school children in at a time.

Years ago it was seen by some teenagers as a right of passage to be dared to pinch things from Woolworths.

OP I think you shouldn't have sat the children down and given them the teddies to play with. I would have offered to pay for the teddies. I am glad it made you think but I doubt if it was xenophobic. Probably the end of a fraught summer school holiday season.

As my mum used to say: Two wrongs don’t make a right.

Bless.

All those awful Brexity people were told they were racist for wanting to reduce the number of Europeans coming to the UK, so surely the British are a different race?

Xenophobic is the word you’re looking for.

If I were walking into a unknown or bougie shop with a 3 year old - I'd be holding their hand. Definitely would not let them walk around freely and touch stuff. This is asking for trouble, which you found out. 3 year olds are crazy.

Shopkeepers shouldn't have to have 'do not touch signs' - people should behave responsibly in a shop, and those who are too young to know how to behave should be adequately supervised so that they do not touch items they do not intend to purchase.

If shops were obliged put up signs to manage other people's behaviour, where would would it end? "Do not shit on the floor", "Do not pick your nose and wipe it all over the place", "Do not lick your money before passing to the assistant."

“Do not touch” signs are commonly used in shops. Particularly snall gift shops. If they’re that pedantic about delicate items it’s a necessity. With regard to your other suggestions, I can’t possibly comment. .

Not wanting people to damage or destroy your stock is not pedantry - the irony being that pedantry is concerned with petty rules, and some might consider your insinuation that any shops selling delicate items are required to put up a sign is literally very petty! I took issue with your notion that putting up a sign is a necessity - I disagree, having good manners/behaviour when browsing is a necessity and people shouldn't require a sign to notify them of that basic fact.

And you would have demonstrated her point about English behaviour beautifully.

I no. But you will get mums coming along defending it.. always some excuse like there kid has a label/can’t help or there gentle parents 🙄

How do you no the poor shop keeper don’t say the same to other English tourists? I’m English and im
sick of how many of us don’t bother parenting are kids.

How is it racist to say the truth tho?

I work in a school and am a mum, the worst behaved kids tend to be English. The bestest behave ones is Chinese /indian/polish

I'm English myself 🤦‍♀️

Gentle parent spotted 🙄

It is racist, because there are badly behaved children of ALL nationalities, and just picking out one is not acceptable. Would you be comfortable saying the same thing about African children for example? Of course not.

As a teacher, you should be aware of this, and if you are not aware of the racism towards British children from some quarters then you must request some extra training. As this is likely to be taken less seriously in your classroom than other forms of racism, and can be very harmful.

Your international students are well behaved because they are not at home. They are more cautious and careful naturally. Surely you must know that?! The Chinese children have virtually no rights to an opinion at all, so you are unlikely to run into problems with them. I find this inherent lack of knowledge and understanding particularly alarming.

At what point did you ever think it was okay to allow negative over generalisations and shame to be aimed at any child from any country?

She probably does say things to other English tourists, I guess we'll never know unless we track this woman down and watch her all summer.

😳😂

You shouldn't have let your children touch and play with things you had no intention of buying. That's the long and short of it.

Racism is hardly a laughing matter, what are you seven years old? Bed time chop chop.

😂That’s right, take my post out of context. How very immature.