How much independence do your kids have?

[MoiraRoseIsMyQueen]

I’ve just read this from Jonathan Haidt on Insta - https://www.instagram.com/p/DM_O3uFsqne/?img_index=8&igsh=cWplaTB5ZTM2bW9i - and it’s really made me think about my son and how much we ‘let’ him do. He’s just turned 9, but he’s a very young 9 - doesn’t have a phone, doesn’t go online or play computer games (he would if he could 😁 but we don’t have an Xbox etc). Quite honestly I’m happy for him to stay playing with his Lego and cars for as long as possible, I think children grow up too quickly nowadays!

But, this made me wonder - does he have enough independence, and what do others let their kids do? We don’t live in an area that allows him much independence currently - bit rough, very busy roads, etc, so it’s not really the norm for kids to go out alone. But we’ll be moving soon to a much quieter area, with possibly more opportunities for him to be independent - for example, we’ll have a park behind our house. Would you let him go with a friend and no adult? What do you let/encourage your similar-aged kids to do on their own?

I'm a big fan of JH and try to let my DCs have as much independence as possible.
This includes doing things around the house as well.
My DCs are young for their age too but when the older was 9 they were allowed to go to the park across the road and when the younger was 9 they were given money for sweets every Sat and could go and buy them two streets away.
We made sure they could cross the road (you can see the road from our front door).

We worked up gradually. It depends so much on the individual child and the area you live in.

The main thing to have in mind is how they will get to school in Secondary and build those skills up from y4. So walking in area independently, crossing roads, going to local shop etc. If travelling by train making sure they learn how to read train departure boards etc.

At 9, mine went to school by themselves (I picked them up in winter from clubs as it was dark with poor street lighting), went to the shop by themselves, went to the post box and some playing out. That was a risk assessment of where we lived... its a quiet village.

Now they are 12 &14... they had friends over last night whose parents pick them up, but that was 11pm. Up until 9 they would have walked home alone. Its 5 minutes walk! Realistically there was no more danger at 11, but there was a psychological difference

I should add that our older one has some SEN and also has epilepsy. We are happier with him going out to the shops on his own than staying home on his own as if he has a fit (very unlikely) when he's out and about someone will spot it.
It's really important for children to know how to cross roads independently even if you don't plan to let them do it soon.

My youngest DD is 10 (starting her 6 in September), she has been walking to and from school independently/with friends all this year, it is under 10 mins walk and no busy roads.
This summer she’s been allowed to meet friends at the playground alone, and generally go for a walk around the streets around our house, we live in a village.
She is also allowed to walk the dog “around the block”.
She isn’t left alone at home that much mostly because there’s usually someone else home, she has been left 10 mins or so while I pop to the shop.
This school year I think if there’s an occasion when nobody can be home when she gets home from school she’s ready to let herself in and be alone for an hour until my eldest gets home.

It surely depends on where you live and the individual dc.

My dc didn't go out by themselves until they went to secondary school.

My youngest dc is 11 and has SEN. She has never been out by herself.
Even if she didn't have SEN it's not safe where I live to let her go to parks by herself. Children don't 'playout' where we live.

I think independence is important and can be achieved in different ways. It would be easy for you to think “oh we live in an unsafe area, he can’t walk to school or the shops/park on his own - and he is young for his age anyway” but he will have to do these things sometimes and you won’t magically feel better about it when he is 12 or 14, you have to build up. I bet you do some of these already but some steps towards independence are:

get them to order for themselves in restaurants
if they need the loo get them to ask directions themselves, find it themselves, use it and make there way back independently
you are you for the day and they are thirsty/their water bottle has run out get them to think of where to refill, get them to go into a coffee shop or bar or whatever and ask for a refill
going away for a night/weekend get them to pack for themselves - check it with them but also let them make their own mistakes
let them choose their own outfits for the day
get them to offer solutions to day to day problems that occur ‘mum, I’ve lost my water bottle’ ‘oh, what are you going to do about it?’
Little things really work to build up a strong, confident child - I started on the above (not fully, just starting) before 6 years old

We live in a village with one fairly busy road.

By 9, my ds was allowed to walk to the village shop on his own (half a mile, across the road). He could go and call for a neighbour's son and they could play in the woods if they were together. He had a console and played computer games.

He was at home on his own on Fridays after school during year 6, and knew not to open the door to strangers, and to call me if there were any issues. We practiced what to do if there was a fire or other emergency.

He got a phone at 11 when he went to senior school and an email account about the same time. He was completely uninterested in social media so I left him to sort that himself and he settled on Minecraft messenger to talk to his friends.

Since then, I've left him to his own devices, although I have access to all his accounts and do have a quick look occasionally.

I didn't make a fuss about it, but he knew that he would have all privileges removed and I would cancel his phone contract if I caught him bullying, sending intimate images or talking to total strangers on line.

I didn’t let any of them do anything alone until they turned 18 and on her 18th year my eldest flew herself over to Australia and then got on an internal flight as well without any issues whatsoever.
They watch and they learn, They don’t need to do until it’s safe to do so
But she’s never had any issues whatsoever navigating herself around without her parents in a large city on public transport Day and night. Holds down a responsible job.

Mine are just 9 and 6.5 and have read the anxious generation. I’ve tried to be less protective since.
They play in the garden alone. It is a big garden where we can’t see them so a bit of freedom. They climb trees, invent things and do stuff that if I were watching I’d be saying ‘be careful!’

I’ve started to let them play on the street alone. This is a very safe cul de sac type street with instructions that they can’t go into anyone’s house without coming back to tell me and the 9 year old can’t leave the 6 year old alone.

We’re currently camping. They are given a lot of freedom on the campsite. They are exploring woods and playgrounds etc. No pool access alone though. Lots of scrapes and bruises but very few tears which would happen if we were with them when it happened.

You didn’t let them do anything alone until 18? Like they never walked to school or went shopping or concerts or got on a bus or train and went to a different town or pity? I feel like this must be satire.

I think ours probably have more independence than most because where we live is quite rural and safe. They would definitely play out and walk over to see friends next door from about 4. But we live on a farm, so they’re just roaming about in fields and in the woods. It’s all private land and the only people they’d bump into would be their friends’ parents who live all around us. At 4, there were older children with them, so there was always a trusted one who could bring them home if they fell out of a tree or something. 😂 The families all know each other so we all look out for them.

They could go into the village to go to the playground with friends from the end of Year 6, once they had a phone and I could track their location. It’s about a 3 minute drive or 15 minute walk, so if there was an emergency, I could get there quickly but not right away. I generally don’t allow them to walk it because it’s on an A road, but I don’t mind them wandering around the village with a friend or going to the shop. My 12 year old walks home from the bus stop.

I’d let my 12 year old go to the cinema with a friend if she wanted to go on her own, but usually I go with them because I like to see a film too. We have no public transport where we live, so I will forever be the taxi, but from 15, they’ll start learning how to take the train from town to our nearest city (about 45 minutes away). They’ll need to do it for 6th form the next year.

Mine definitely frolic in the woods alone, but we very tightly restrict anything online. No gaming with other players. No social media before 16. We check phones. Etc.

Nothing at all.
They were dropped at school, picked up from the door.
Did them no harm and kept them safe

At 9 my ds got his own breakfast in the morning, could make a basic meal, would go to a local shop (no busy roads) to buy bits and pieces and keep his room tidy and be responsible for putting his clothes in the laundry basket. From 10 he walked from school to his piano lesson.
From 11 he cycled to school (again, no busy roads) but had done his cycling proficiency and was competent at getting himself around. He got a phone at 11 for secondary but was restricted on social media. We also restricted screen time and games like DTA were not allowed.
By 12 he was going to town/cinema/park with his friends, could catch a local bus/train
At 16 he caught a train across Scotland and flew home alone. I also taught him how to use the washing machine and he had a weekend job at 6th form
So by the time he left for university he was pretty competent and could look after himself. It absolutely astonished him how many of his peers had never done their washing, cooked a meal, lived on a budget.
In many ways he was also quite 'young' in terms of what he played with etc but I think that's a totally separate thing from learning life skills.
I read something very interesting about the rise in young people having road accidents mainly because they had not been exposed to traffic and so were not able to judge speeds of oncoming traffic.

We live in London and DDs have walked to school from the summer of Year 6 (aged 11). They took the tube to school from Year 7 and were able to take the tube and bus across London to meet up with friends and go out to places like cafes and the cinema. We don't have a car and have used public transport with them since they were babies, and we've taught them how to navigate that and deal with delays and cancellations.
Their primary school didn't allow them to walk home earlier than that although we would have been fine with it (but we also didn't need to insist on it as it didn't clash with work etc). From age 9 they would go to local shops (crossing some busy urban roads but all with pedestrian crossings) and I'd let them spend time with friends in a nearby park (roaming out of sight in a 400 acre park) although I'd walk with them to go there and I'd be in another part of the park and they always knew where to find me. It's in a central area and they are streetwise and smart.
They have basic mobile phones at age 14 and 12. I don't want them having smartphones until they are older.

This is absolute madness? Until they were 18! You may think it didn't do them any harm but it will have done somehow. Going out by your friends yourself, exploring etc are all such an important part of growing up and childhood and I think it's so cruel to have deprived your children of this.

There's a really good book called Free Range children for those wondering about promoting independence in children and the benefits of it.

My son is 6. He doesn't have a huge amount of independence in the sense of going out on his own because he's so little. But he does go to a sports club outdoors almost every day, where he sees his friends, does his sport, climbs trees etc. When we are there I read a book or talk to the other parents and let him get on with it. I let him order his own food and pay at our local chippy whilst I stand outside (he always orders a chip butty!), he walks with his friends about 5 metres ahead of me when we go to school, that kind of thing

I think it depends. My oldest daughter is sensible so she got to take the dog out from 10, walk to shops, go out with friends on the bus and train etc younger than her brother. Although he does get to go to the next town on the bus with his friends now, he doesn't get to take the dog out as I don't think he can cope with that responsibility yet if the dog does a runner! He is 12.

First I will point out that I don't live in the UK.

My 14 year old has a lot of independence, she has travelled across the country with just her friend (although her friend is 3 years older) when she was 13. She goes everywhere in town by herself and goes to the city with her friends by train. I would have no issue leaving her overnight if it was absolutely necessary (unlikely to ever be necessary though)

My youngest is 7, he just started school yesterday and I walked him to school yesterday and today but from tomorrow onwards he will be walking by himself. He already goes to the nearby shop by himself and to his friends' houses on our estate and goes for walks around the estate alone.

It's a really good question OP and I'm so pleased we're all thinking more about it.

I love Jonathan Haidt and the Anxious Generation was fantastic.

Mine are 9 and 6 and I allow them to play out on with the other kids on the street and go into their houses. There's a good few of them between the ages of 4 and 14 and they are all lovely kids and get on well. They will be hour for hours at a time which is great for them. We have some woods at the end of the street and I would love them to play in there but they don't tend to want to.

Our road is fairly quiet and residential but cars are definitely the thing I feel is the biggest risk. We walk to and from school every day (and actually growing up we always walked as much as possible) so they seem to have developed good road sense, which I think is important. We cant just expect them to suddenly develop road sense when we allow them to walk to school on their own, not to mention the stamina you build up by walking distances from a young age.

9 yo, we've left in the house for short periods and we'll probably increase this this year. He doesn't have a phone but I do use Alexa to drop in to talk to him when we're out.

Independence is incredibly important and depending on your surroundings and the nature of the child should be encouraged from an early age. It’s basically your one job as a parent (other than to keep them alive) so that they can be functioning members of society when you are no longer parenting them.

we’ve always made sure we live near a local shop and on a bus route so they could go and buy things themselves, talk to adults without us present (just buying a pint of milk, learning to interact with others), navigating bus and train systems.

we do live in a nice little village and DCs were always encouraged to go out with friends from around 9 years old. By 11 they could get the train to the local town and one has flown transatlanticly (?? Not sure that’s a word) alone and they’re just coming up to secondary school in September.

One child is living in a different country and one is travelling at the moment, having wonderful adventures and making memories and learning skills that will set them up for their futures.

It’s interacting with others without your presence that is important, obviously in a manner which is safe and only when you feel they will be able to cope with said interactions but cosseting children and not encouraging them to have appropriate independence, in my view, holds your child back in life.

so many children these days don’t have that freedom and I wouldn’t have given it if we didn’t live somewhere safe to be able to encourage it but we set ourselves up so we could.

Depends on the area and the child. Our eldest dc would pop to the local shop alone at aged 9 but that was about it. Youngest dc was playing out all day with friends and only popping back home when he wanted something to eat. We live in a large village and kids playing out with friends at aged 9 is the norm.

I thought about the fact that at 18 they could be in a completely unknown city navigating their public transport at midnight whilst pissed and worked backwards from that.
in yearly steps, that meant that by 9 they needed to be walking eg the ten mins to school or a park on their own.
it creeps up on you so quickly, so you absolutely do need to get started. Because with school, extra curricular, family holidays etc sometimes you only get a few days in the holiday per year to ‘practice’. So dd14 is now allowed to go to the nearest small city with a friend in the daytime, and dd16 can go to the further away big city with friends. Next year dd17 will be allowed to go at night with friends or day time alone.

it will be different depending on your location and child, but I honestly would recommend working it out.

dd2 14 has a friend who is not allowed to do anything that the rest of the group are, for example going shopping in the city they all catch a train together to, and I think this girl is not going to be ready at all to go to uni after alevels, or it will be dangerous for her.

I wish schools would allow children to walk in on their own earlier than year 6. My DD is only 7 so I wouldn’t let her yet but she’s been asking to (and would be capable of) since reception!

its brilliant that this worked for you, but I can’t even think how you would manage it logistically. What about when all their friends were eg meeting at the train station to go to the beach for the day or whatever? Whatever being the umpteen things that teenagers get up to without parents.