How much independence do your kids have?

[MoiraRoseIsMyQueen]

I’ve just read this from Jonathan Haidt on Insta - https://www.instagram.com/p/DM_O3uFsqne/?img_index=8&igsh=cWplaTB5ZTM2bW9i - and it’s really made me think about my son and how much we ‘let’ him do. He’s just turned 9, but he’s a very young 9 - doesn’t have a phone, doesn’t go online or play computer games (he would if he could 😁 but we don’t have an Xbox etc). Quite honestly I’m happy for him to stay playing with his Lego and cars for as long as possible, I think children grow up too quickly nowadays!

But, this made me wonder - does he have enough independence, and what do others let their kids do? We don’t live in an area that allows him much independence currently - bit rough, very busy roads, etc, so it’s not really the norm for kids to go out alone. But we’ll be moving soon to a much quieter area, with possibly more opportunities for him to be independent - for example, we’ll have a park behind our house. Would you let him go with a friend and no adult? What do you let/encourage your similar-aged kids to do on their own?

I know, mine are 12 and 10 and have a constant stream of friends knocking on the door asking them to go out and play. I can’t even imagine telling them to say ‘sorry, I’m not allowed out without my parents until I’m 18’.
Kids need to be given age appropriate freedoms and responsibilities. It’s part of their development.

My kids have never been the go out and play in the street/park type of children and neither have any of thier friends. Until a couple of years ago we lived in a small village, they went to primary school in another village and friends were very spread out across several villages, hamlets and lone houses in the country. Meant that it was more playdates and playing in friends fields/woods then hanging around urban places.

We moved to the (small) town - can walk end to end in 40 minutes. They are now 14, 17 and 18 and don't really go and hang out for the sake of hanging out. Not because I don't let them just because it just doesnt seem to happen here. All 3 kids are independent, have been scouts and gone camping with no adults, able to go shopping, get buses/trains etc.

When she was 15 a couple of years ago DD and her friend got the train to Norwich to go and stay with the friends uncle. Navigated the changes and the tube etc. Last month she went to a concert in London and got the midnight national express back - DH picked them up from the bus station at 2:30am!
I will pick them up at night, just because I can and I don't mind - I wouldn't be able to go to bed until I knew they were home safe anyway!

They are not molly coddled, they can cook and clean and advocate for themselves in many ways. I have friends who won't even do the dishes until the tween age child is in bed because the child has to have thier full attention at all times (no special needs just parents has to oversee everything they do, sit with them whilst doing homework etc), nothing is allowed to affect them so the child is not learning any resiliance. I have another friend whos kids are iin thier 30's and she still has to do everything for them, sort out all their problems (and pay for everything!). They have never had to do anything for themselves so now they don't know how to.

No, they felt sorry for their friends soaked in the rain having to make their own way home, and those that were flashed at on trains, robbed at Mc Donalds, assaulted outside school etc.

You do know that those things happen to adults too? Even parents? And having them happen with friends will mean they become more self reliant than with their mum?
My DCs tend to regard getting soaked with friends as an adventure (and an opportunity to make themselves hot chocolate when they get home).

Being 18 doesn't stop that happening though .... and they'd be very ill equipped to deal with it.

But they aren’t.
They dont “deal with it” the circumstances in which children are easily victimised are removed when they become car driving non school attending adults.

Your children have friends who have been assaulted outside of school, robbed at McDonald’s and flashed at on trains?!? Where on Earth do you live? If it’s possible, I would absolutely move if I were you, this is no way to live. I know those things happen, it’s on the news, but I don’t personally know anyone, and neither do any of my children, that any of this has happened to. And for it all to happen to one friendship group is madness, im not surprised you live life full of anxiety. Why haven’t you moved?

To give you an idea of other places to live @florathedresswhere i live, and have for 25 years now, the town news would be stuff like ‘Tom’s bin has been moved, has anyone seen it? Or lost cats. Or a window of a greenhouse shattered.’ And that’s 25 years.

There’s also a rather large gulf in between forcing your kids to walk home in the rain and never letting them out if your sight till they’re 18.
for example my expectations of my teenagers would be that ordinarily they sfould make their own way home from wherever they are, but if they absolutely need a lift for whatever reason, they’d phone and say ‘it’s pissing down, can you pick me up’ and I’d say ‘yes.’

So you think people should never go on a train, in case someone flashes them? That’s a very unhealthy way to live.

Yes, 100% I’d have moved by now if I knew so many people who had been subjected to such ordeals.

I'm curious how you coped when they all reached 18 and went travelling, to uni, etc. To go from such involvement to very little/nothing. Your life has been completely emeshed in theirs ... whereas usually they start to break away gradually during their early/mid teens and we get used to being a less pivotal part.

I’m wondering this too. The dangers are still there post 18, just different ones. They might not be targeted by paedophiles or county lines dealers, but still every chance they can be assaulted, raped, mugged, stabbed -
these things aren’t impossible just because you’re suddenly a car driving adult.

Its about reducing risk. And its been proven time and time again that exposure to criminality does nothing to reduce its threat.

Are you completely mad? I feel sorry for your poor kids and their helicopter mother, it letting them do anything independently in case of phantom paedophiles and drug runners! Your literal one job as a parent is to prepare your kids for independent life, and you’ve failed miserably.

My “poor kids” are fully functioning adults having regular contact and picking up the pieces of the children affected by very real pedophiles and thousands of county lines drug dealers on your doorstep. Good luck to your poor kids, theyll need it

I suspect you’d have kept them by your side with no independence past the age of 18 if you could have got away with it. Control under the pretence of protection.

Same age, a phone but old skool Nokia, no online gaming. Going into a shop by themselves.

Walking to school and taking a regular bus journey by themselves from year 6 (aged 10) onwards. UK city.

I think you need to be more cautious with being unsupervised at a young age in a park.

Gradually increasing independence, now very independent and confident (teens).

At 12, my oldest went to Germany for 4 weeks, staying with his exchange friend. Flew on his own Inc changing a flight. Aircrew forgot about him!
The next year he flew to Czech Republic to stay with another. Exchange friend.
You can't do this if you haven't had gradual experience of independence when younger

My DC were going to and from school by themselves at 10, going to the park by themselves at 8, going out with friends by themselves at 11.

My child is 5. Plays outside & goes to friends houses.
He likes to do things himself, making food, getting dressed.

He can look around the supermarket by himself, as well.
We co-slept, and he still likes us being there at night.

We live in a large village/ small town. My 10 year old was able to walk to and from school just after her 9th birthday (year 5, she’s an August child). She was allowed to go to the park at this age too. Age 10 she got a phone and was able to go a bit further afield. She’s now about to turn 11 and she can go out with her friends for a good few hours, goes out on her bike and is very independent. She’ll go to the shops for me and can cook a basic meal. My 8 year old who is about to go to year 4 will walk to school next year. He can walk to and from a friends house (very close with us parents messaging when he’s on his way). I leave both children at home together for short periods too.

This, both my kids are autistic, but my DS14 doesn't have a lot of road sense and can't always tell the pavement from the road. DD11 is mature and copes really well, she's walked home from school for 2 years. Where we are is an incredibly busy urban area, and even if they use crossings there's always some d**k driving badly (4 times I've nearly been hit while crossing on the green man round the corner, with them driving straight through). If they go out together I feel happier though.

DS will be 3 in December so we obviously aren't at the stage of going outside alone yet except the garden.

But independence is important so I encourage it around the home when possible such as dressing himself, using the toilet as early as possible, helping to make his bed, cutting food etc.

We do most of this with our 9yo and are starting bits with our 6yo. She can pack her own bag independently (for holiday or for school), bake a cake with minimal supervision, order/ask for things in a restaurant.

She doesn't want to stay home alone or go places alone yet. All she has done so far is go round the corner to post a letter. Today I left her in the park alone for 5 mins whilst I took DS to the toilet and when I came back she was on her way to find us. So we're going at her pace on this.