Parenting across two countries

[Linzie79]

My 12-year-old daughter and I live in the UK and her dad lives in Spain. Over the last couple of years especially she's said how much she hates England and prefers Spain. I've always been a single mum but I've made a real effort to take her to Spain to see her dad and make sure she spends time with both sides of the family. Over the last couple of months our relationship has become so strained and she says she wants to live with her dad. The thought of not being a presencial parent, there to support her through puberty and the challenges of life breaks my heart, but I worry that she is going to resent me if she stays here. She has more family in Spain and really just me here. I feel like I should let her go for her own mental health because right now she just thinks I'm a terrible parent and she would be happier there. Besides losing her, I worry about her education and once she goes there, there is really no coming back as it would disrupt her studies too much. I feel like I have to let her go so I can still maintain some kind of relationship with her and maybe when she's older she'll come back to me in terms of closeness. I don't think she likes my personality and with me going through perimenopause she probably picks up on my changing moods. Any advice or anyone in a similar situation?

‘Spain is in decline’, oh dear, please go and update yourself. It was during the economic crisis in 2008 but it’s now one of the highest performing economies in the world as confirmed by The Economist earlier this year. Your views are embarrassingly out of date and your UK exceptionalism is fully on display.

What utter rot! Have you any idea how hard it is to learn Swedish or German from scratch to a level of fluency that would secure a job? Have you even tried? Fluency in Spanish will not help her in Germany, Switzerland or Austria. The idea that you can just pick a job or uni anywhere in the EU and breeze in is for the birds.

Had you ever secured three or four A* in maths, chemistry, physics etc so that you could enter world renowned universities here and in the US, you would know it is very, very far from ‘easy’ - your post simply highlights your total ignorance.

I hope you are not advising real life children!

It’s is certainly in decline in terms of youth unemployment, which is what this thread is talking, please keep up. Why don’t we talk about actual facts, I have linked the youth unemployment statistics here on the link. It was 56% as of a few months ago.

tradingeconomics.com/spain/youth-employment-rate-age-group-20-29-eurostat-data.html

Op, it sounds like you have given your dd the most lovely life, and she is a bright child with lots of options and opportunities for her future.

I recognise the pain in your post, the frustration of raising a young soon to be teenager alone, and the clash of personalities you describe sounds particularly taxing. At least in part because her father gets to be Disney Dad once a year, and you are here doing the actual parenting every single day! It’s very unfair.

It would be fair to increase her visits possibly. Potentially offering you more breaks, and space to focus on your job/life.

Do you have good friends? And a close community where you live? Hobbies? I know you said you didn’t have an extended family.

Maybe it’s time for you to look into broadening your own life now she is older op, so whatever dd decides to do in the future you will be fine. Planning for an empty nest is something we all have to do. There are no guarantees that any adult child will remain close to home.

Some of the posts on here are really helpful, and they share your experience of parenting across two countries. Can you get in touch with other parents in similar positions? I would imagine that support and experience could be very useful.

Many of my own Spanish friends moved here to work, and have never returned, they would love to work closer to their families. Future employment, prospects and security will be utmost in your mind, but also general well being and living standards.

At the moment you are in the driving seat, if she lives in Spain are you ready to hand over the reins fully? It seems that after six months you would lose many of your legal rights - so it is a risk. I think getting solid legal advice is a good idea.

If you and dd were especially close as she grew up, this might be the natural development of independence which can be fraught. She may say things she doesn’t mean, but being there for her navigating the teen stage would be my first priority. My teen dds needed me more than ever from
rhe ages of 14-20yrs it can be a bumpy ride with hormones, new experiences, SM, first love etc.

Best of luck op 💐

As has already been established, she is at an age now where she can choose which of her parents she lives with, given the parent will have her, so there is no point at all in fighting this even if it hurts to see your child choose the other parent. Although, in this case I don't think it's about choosing a parent, more that she is choosing a different life. She is lucky to be in the position of having options.

It sounds like her quality of life would be greatly improved by moving to where the vast majority of her family is. They seem to really care about her and it will be a nice change from the life she has in the UK. It is also part of her culture and it's where she lived as a young child. It makes perfect sense to me that she would live there. Spain can offer her a better quality of life and she gets to experience living with her other parent properly too.

It’s very difficult, especially for those who live outside the major cities. I have a sister-in-law who trained as a teacher and waited 8 years for her turn to come up and worked as a dinner lady during that time. She is still not in a proper placement, she is a kind of supply teacher doing short contracts covering other teachers absences. My husband’s cousin who trained as an architect is working in Leroy Merlin, which is like Homebase. My husband qualified as an electrical engineer and worked as an electrician for years, and even now isn’t working in what he qualified as, although more closely related. These stories aren’t uncommon. Even to do jobs that would be considered fairly easy to get into like working for Correos (post office), working as an administrator for the local town hall, police officer etc involve doing public exams and are very competitive. The fact that a lot of people consider working in Mercadona (big supermarket chain) a “good” job tells you everything you need to know. Of course there are professionals - doctors, lawyers etc, but the overwhelming majority of people in normal towns and cities are just working to make ends meet. Often the lives of foreign nationals living here don’t reflect the lives of normal Spanish people and they see Spain as some kind of utopia, but the reality for normal working people is quite different.

That is exactly my experience too. Even normal families live a very frugal, basic life. Startlingly basic in many cases. No one ever sees this side of life on holiday.

Whilst some might frame it was as timeless, the young feel frustrated and held back was my experience. They haven’t studied so hard to spend their life working in a supermarket, and it creates anger and resentment.

It has created tension that is now spilling out, and animosity in some areas. The backlash can also be seen directed towards tourism, other countries, housing and even air bnb. Maybe their justifiable
anger will serve the change and transformation needed. I hope so, it’s a great country with lovely people but they are stagnating, and they need to find a way to keep the young skilled workforce employed and productive there, or their economy will end up in a doom spiral of a mainly aging population and an ever shrinking demographic of tax payers.

I know exactly how hard it is and it’s not that hard particularly if you start as a child. I speak 3 languages. I wouldn’t have mentioned it but since you do, I got 4 As at A level 30 years ago & went to Cambridge. I have also worked in Europe.

German & Swedish are relatively straightforward. And once you have one Romance language it’s relatively easy to learn another one.

English is widely used for international business & diplomacy. Around 44% of the EU population speak English, even post Brexit.

She’s 12, she’s not looking for a job, do keep up. She may never look for a job in Spain, the current unemployment rate is utterly irrelevant. It’s a fantastic place to grow up - what you do later is not defined by that. My younger siblings grew up in Spain, they thrived and have been successful in both education and employment, in Spain and elsewhere. My sister chose to go to Imperial as it was the best uni for civil engineering but this was off the back of a Spanish education. The heated debate about future employment prospects seems very premature.

I’d say let her go, initially on trial for a year, and then review. My siblings moved there about this age and settled in quickly, picked up Spanish seemingly easily and loved the lifestyle - swimming in your lunch hour, horse riding after school, etc. it’s also the age when a lot of children board as they start to want their independence. I really hope it works out well for you both. Good luck!

Well said.

She probably likes being there because she doesn't usually live with him and so going there is a special thing. That might not continue to be the case if she actually moved there. When children reach puberty they can often be grumpy, argumentative, rude and moody, and they will take this out on the person closest to them. They can't take it out on the absent parent because it doesn't have the same effect, and they are not confident enough to do so since they spend so little time together. This is what I see in my own life anyway - my children only see their dad for less than a month a year and only do nice things together. Plus, he never upsets them or challenges them because of the small amount of time he spends with them. This isn't real, day to day life though.
It sounds hard but I probably would tell her to finish school and then see how she feels. Tell her this isn't a good time but in the future she can do what she likes. Perhaps she can spend more time there now, and go on her own if you take her to the airport?

Thanks so much. I agree with all this and I'm hoping it's more to do with puberty and her feelings being all over the place. I have to understand that it's not all aimed at me personally but I'm her safe venting space. This doesn't take away the validity of her feelings which I totally get, but I do need to think long-term and in her studies, and which environment will likely give her the better opportunities. She spends about two months in all per year there, and as she gets older she can go some more.

Op I might add one last thing if you don’t mind. Don’t give up on her, she is your little girl. If she moves there it will change your relationship permanently and forever. You may very well lose her for good.

You are the parent, her main care giver and you can call the shots, and don’t be afraid to exercise your right to do what is best for her.

I am aware this might create yet more reaction on here, but in the decade I lived there misogyny and rape was rife. It’s particularly problematic during fiestas. You need to be around to ensure her safety as she enters the years she is most at risk. You can look after her, and are invested in her in a way no one else is - not even her father. Definitely not her father, given he doesn’t even bother visiting her. She could become very vulnerable without you.

Don’t leave her alone to navigate this all by herself.

i totally understand how this is heartbreaking for you, agree with others “the grass is always greener” comments.you sound like an incredible parent who’s been doing ALL the heavy lifting on your own. It was a different situation but a friend of mine moved to a different country for work for 6 months, and her daughter (aged 13) went with her and went to the school for 6 months. It was presented more as a cultural exchange I think, and was seen by her UK school
as an opportunity. Perhaps that is something to consider? I think her experiencing real life out there - including a school term or two, could be really beneficial to her understanding what living in Spain, and not just holidaying, is like. Good luck to you, please do not beat yourself up, you’ve obviously been doing a wonderful job.

Do you pay for those 2 months? If you do then stop and pay for a different holiday instead. Her dad needs to fund these 2 months because they’re for his benefit.