Not sure how to help wife?

[TheBlueRaccoon]

Looking for a bit of advice.

My wife and I have just had a baby. First and foremost, he is amazing and so is my wife.

I’m having a real issue with how to help my wife.
she is breastfeeding, so is naturally tired, but she won’t take opportunities to sleep when she can.

We are mix feeding, as she feels that she isn’t making enough for the baby, which I’m completely fine with and never had a problem with, but she won’t feee him bottles through the night or she won’t express milk so I can’t feed him at night, but it constantly feels like she resents me for sleep (sort of) during that time.

I will wake up before work and take him so she can get a few hours uninterrupted sleep in and a shower in peace. Sometimes she takes that opportunity more often than not she won’t.
I do the housework if I’m not working or with the baby, or I’ll say to leave it until a day I finish early (I usually get back after 10pm so can’t put the vac on that time) but again, she won’t. I do the cooking on the days I’m back early enough to do so. I’m really trying and if there’s anything else I can do I’ll do it.

It feels like she’s trying to be a hero, but the result is both of us getting less sleep.

Her timing of things just feels off. For example, She’ll want to shower when the baby wants feeding, but I have nothing to feed him with - no expressed milk or no formula I’ll suggest getting a bottle ready just in case and she’s not keen on the idea, then I end up with a hungry screaming baby for the next 40 mins with no way to feed him. I feel utterly useless and it’s horrible watching him cry as I try everything to calm him but the one thing he wants I can’t give him.

Things like this happen all throughout the day and I'm stood there thinking “why didn’t you do this when he was asleep?”

I’m not getting anywhere near the amount of sleep she thinks I’m getting and I know both of us could be getting more if we did things a touch differently. It’s gotten to the point where I feel guilty for sleeping. So I jump myself awake if I hear her coming into the room.

we’ll go to appointments with midwives, health visitors and they’ll tell us things to try or things we could be doing and she doesn’t want to try them, then acts like I’m an idiot for suggesting what they’ve suggested.

Our lives are more difficult than they need to be and I can’t see why she can’t see it.

She is an amazing mum and wife, I’ve tried to be supportive but everything I say is taking as criticism or a dig when it’s not. It’s driving me up the wall.

I thought it could be a bit if PPD but I tried to raise it and it didn’t go well.

Any advice is appreciated.

Nothing prepares you for how tough life with a newborn actually is and unfortunately the dads can often get forgotten about.

You sound like you’re doing an incredible job and the fact you have braved reaching out to Mumsnet to seek advice shows how much you care in trying to support your wife.

We can often doubt ourselves and feel like we are failing as parents, especially when we are sleep deprived and the baby has been crying all day. Having said that we also have great mum instincts. We learn baby’s cues and know the best way to care for our own baby. Advice can sometimes come across as criticism, even when it’s not intended to.

Being a mum to three I have learnt over time that the advice/suggestions from health professionals do not always work. You can have three different people tell you three different ways you should be doing things which can be overwhelming.

Take it day by day. Support each other, communicate and work together. You are a team. Keep being patient with your wife. It is so tough being with a newborn 24/7 and we are literally in survival mode trying to get through it!!

That's very short-sighted. Babies don't just cry because they are hungry. They want comfort. Breastfeeding provides that comfort. If the OP starts formula feeding the baby whenever he wants, it will affect his wife's milk supply, which means they will have to rely on formula more and more as her milk stops coming through. It is incredibly irresponsible and cruel towards the OP's wife AND the baby to encourage him to take away/fuck up the baby's ability to breastfeed just because he can't handle 40 mins of crying.

@HollyKnight do you think it's acceptable to allow a newborn to cry for 40 minutes?

I was doing EBF with my daughter. I would go to bed with no clothes above the waist, get the baby in the bed with us and she’d sleep / feed without waking me up. The release of oxytocin helps sleep quality for mom and baby and improves the milk supply.

I was however terrified of SIDS. The best thing my husband did to support me was not taking over night feeds, but stay awake and watch over, while we were asleep. We split the nights 50:50, so each of us could get 6 hours of interrupted sleep, plus a nap during the day. (We’re not in the UK, he could take paternity leave of 8 months and I took 12, so we were both off work, but our arrangement could be something you could try over the weekend?)

No one is "allowing" the baby to cry. The baby wants his mum. Dad can comfort him the best he can until mum gets back. You don't just decide for your wife and baby that they are no longer going to breastfeed. The baby is who is important here and this baby wants the boob.

A newborn isn't a problem you can fix with schedules and plans, they really like to (literally) shit on that. You're just along for the ride.

I think this observation is key.

Forgive me, but the idea that this situation can be 'managed' by organisation, schedules, and clear headedness is a very typically male response to a challenge.

Please don't take umbrage, because no offense is intended. I haven't yet met a man who didn't feel that everything had gone completely tits up when the baby arrived; wife was exhausted, baby cried inexplicably and inconsolably, nappies didn't work as they should, baby slept a fraction of the time the books said they would - many men feel completely powerless and very uncomfortable in such circumstances and leap (grasp?) at the idea of organising and schedules and doing the logical thing so they can feel a little more in control.

But this is something you just have to buckle in for and be swept along, like whitewater rafting. You'll all eventually be carried to a calmer stretch.

@HollyKnight yes, the baby is jmportant here but having two exhausted parents could be detrimental.
If mum wants baby exclusively BF - shower when baby is asleep as husband suggested. Not when it's been asleep, wakes up hungry then go for a 40 min shower. 🤦🏽‍♀️ if that's the route a mum wishes to take then I'm sorry but it's on her to be there 24/7 to feed or comfort baby as she's the one with the boobs.
Poor bloke is just trying to help.

And women who like to present themselves as 'better than the rest' when a man posts...

She's fine with it though. It's the OP who can't handle the crying. You're encouraging him to mess everything up so he doesn't have to comfort a crying baby for 40 mins.

@mathanxiety not atall. It's facts if you read the first few comments. Jumping down his throat, being rude.
He's came here seeking advice and some of the replies are horrible.

It might be necessary. My eldest would cry when she wasn't with me and while we did our best to minimise that crying but there were times when my DH would have to try his best to comfort her while I got a shower in. It's a phase and it will pass.

Of course, but it's a choice when you shower (and whether it takes 40 mins or not).

If baby has just had a decent breastfed, dozed off, then woke up crying straight after mum has crept off to the shower, that's one thing. In that situation, baby is not starving hungry but wants comfort, and yes dad needs to learn methods to comfort baby, and yes sometimes babies do cry for prolonged periods and we don't always know how to stop it. That being said, I definitely never continued to take a long shower whilst breastfeeding if I could hear newborn crying for the breast. I would be all done in 20 minutes max even if was washing my hair etc. Of course sometimes it's nice to take a long shower with all bells and whistles but also sometimes that just has to wait when you have a tiny baby depending on you. I don't think it's reasonable to continue a long leisurely shower whilst a newborn screams for the breast and also not 'allow' dad to try milk in a bottle in that time.

If baby has not been breastfed in some time say 2hr+, I would wait til they woke for a feed, or wake them myself if necessary, before showering. Unless I was ok with dad giving a bottle in my absence. It wouldn't be reasonable to pick that time to shower and still not let dad give a bottle as baby will almost certainly be hungry when they wake.

So I'm afraid as someone who has breast fed 3 babies (actually mix fed but they only had a couple of bottles a week and usually at night) and whose DH is fantastic, I think it sounds like OP's wife is being very unreasonable.

@LegoHouse274 this is exactly where I am coming from, you hit the nail on the head!

I think this is actually the best solution for your situation. To be proactive. I would not presume that your baby is hungry. Babies do feed little and often as newborns, especially during the night to increase supply as the milk is richer then.

Babies also use their mum’s breast as a dummy. You may actually find that getting a pack of dummies (presuming that your baby was recently fed) could help just for this type of situation. But just to note, using a dummy instead of the breast if used regularly may reduce supply.

If your baby is growing and thriving, I would not feed your baby the bottle. This will not be helpful to your wife. I would in future ensure your baby isn’t desperately hungry - cluster feeding in the afternoon is very common and normal to increase supply - so it’s best if you can to help your wife to do the things she wants to do in the morning or evening. But 40 mins without a feed even during cluster feeding really won’t hurt your baby.

I breast fed my dd until she was 2 and a half and I didn’t have a bountiful supply. It wasn’t easy for me at all. I went out for the day when dd was 6 weeks old and decided I wanted to go shopping with my cousin and took a bottle as a ‘treat for myself’. I was in agony after that and couldn’t wait for the next feed. My boobs bulged and I have permanent stretch marks from the experience so I’d proceed with care on taking these sort of decisions away from your wife, especially if in future she laments that the decision to stop breastfeeding your baby was taken out of her hands as you started to formula feed.

It is unlikely that your wife doesn’t have enough milk. It may well be she, like me doesn’t have a bountiful amount. So the next time you’re in this situation, I would suggest a dummy and some movement. Go out in the pram and take a walk. This will be incredibly soothing for your baby and for your nerves.

I should also add, we used an independent midwife, who helped me a lot with breastfeeding. She was involved for several weeks after birth and the advise from her was definitely to put the baby to the breast at every opportunity. It’s fine if that’s not what your wife wants to do btw. But please don’t take the decision away from her unless you really need to. And a baby waiting 40 mins on the odd occasion really isn’t a need even if it feels desperate to you.

Op you don’t deserve to be flamed here. You’re a good husband and father.

I have an exclusively fed now toddler.

I remember DH looking at me lost. The poor man not having the tools and ending up holding a screaming baby.

The best thing for your wife to get her supply up is to feed on demand. Yes it means you can’t help during the night/do a lot of childcare but before too long you’ll get into the rhythm. A non hungry baby won’t feed. You can’t just ‘top them up’ before jumping in the shower. In that instance my advice would be take the baby on a little walk so momma can’t hear him cry whilst she showers. She can feed him when she gets out. DH did all the nappies so I could do the feeds in bed, fall back asleep quickly as I wouldn’t be getting cold by getting out of the covers to change her.

Another bit of advice is to take 100% responsibility of certain jobs. Dh took responsibility for all laundering towels/bedding/his clothes, putting together a shopping list, doing the shopping, putting away all the laundry, cleaning the fridge, bins, animals, dishes and keeping everywhere tidy. This meant I knew that I didn’t even need to think ‘I need to put the bins out today/empty the washing machine etc’. He’d always say that my job was to look after baby and his job was to look after me/‘everything else’. 90% he’d come home to me surrounded by dishes, surrounded by mess and he’d big up how I must have had a hard day and that he was grateful for keeping baby healthy whilst he was working.

He’d always follow me with my water bottle, it was like magic as when it would get near to the bottom it would reappear full. Same with the constant cups of tea, sandwiches left in the fridge for when he was away, biscuits always left in arms reach.

Honestly you just being her cheerleader will boost her morale. She’ll know what’s best for baby. You’re all in the trenches right now. Every day things will get better (they’ll be dips but on the whole things will get easier).

Bloody hell - how rude are you?

We dont know when the baby was last fed though. The OP is just assuming the baby is crying from hunger because he won't stop crying, but the baby might just want comfort from his mum. In which case it won't matter when the wife showers because the baby will start crying as soon as he realises he's not with mum. He's brand new. He really only knows his mum and to a lesser extent his dad. Do you really think she's just sitting there doing nothing while the baby sleeps then says to herself "Welp. Baby is going to wake up now so I'm going to go have a shower"?

The OP says he wants to help his wife, but actually everything he is saying is about him. He wants tips to get her to comply so his life will be easier. I dont think it is right to tell him to decide for mother and baby how they will feed from now on.

My husband probably could have written this, fundamentally he is a solutions guy, he always wants to find the quickest most efficient way to do things. And truth be told, pre baby I was the same, now if the baby is crying my brain has literally rewired itself to deal with the baby immediately and all I need in that moment is for him to do as I have asked and not suggest something different, I have never been as stressed in my life as when the baby is screaming.

Plenty have people have covered off breastfeeding but my contribution would be to listen to what your wife needs. It's such an emotive subject and I have always been able to tell whether my baby is hungry by the sound of his cry, my husband however thinks every cry is hunger.

Things worked better for us when I would pump of an evening, take a shower or just chill whilst my husband gave him a bottle and bought him to bed later on, it was our routine so we both knew where we stood.

Research safe sleep 7, I think most breastfeeding mums end up here eventually but it's a life saver in terms of sleep. I found it a difficult thing to accept after all of the no cosleeping stuff that is shoved at you in pregnancy so perhaps you could offer to sit with them as your wife sleeps/feeds in the side lying position and transfer the baby to their crib once they are asleep and unlatched. Sometimes that was the reassurance I needed. I write this with my baby asleep beside me in the bed clearly not sleeping whilst they sleep (sometimes we just can't switch off)

I always find it easier to switch off when baby isn't in the house, so perhaps try taking them for a walk/drive to give your wife a break?

And lastly, the key with all of this is how you put it to your partner. If you tell her she should try something, she probably won't, if you mention that you've heard about this and does she think it might be worth a go, she may say yes, she may say no or she may come back to it in a few days.

Congratulations on your baby and trust that you will both find your rhythm, people refer to it as being in the trenches for a reason.

Things like this happen all throughout the day and I'm stood there thinking “why didn’t you do this when he was asleep?”

It feels like she’s trying to be a hero, but the result is both of us getting less sleep.

It sounds like you are very critical of your wife and she'll be feeling that. You are also probably annoying her if you keep suggesting making a bottle. That's one of the reasons I didn't mix feed , my ex husband would have jumped on that and ruined my supply of breast milk.

It sounds like the baby is very young. Give her a minute to establish feeding and stop critiquing her.

Why does you wife think she has low supply?

This is a really common misconception. I would bet money that her supply is just fine.

Midwives, HV and even the 'infant feeding team' at hospital know absolutely bugger all about breastfeeding.

See a lactation consultant (IBCLC) and she will gain confidence in herself x

Hi OP, you are doing a good job! Sorry people are being mean!
some of what you have said reminds me of my postpartum experience and what I can imagine my partner saying.
I was exclusively breastfeeding, it was the hardest thing I have ever done due to complications. My partner kept suggesting formula but it was just so annoying to hear because all I wanted to do was feed my baby myself. When I look back, I did resent my partner and the sleep he had. I actually couldn’t bear him for ages! Sorry :( And it was so misplaced because he was doing everything he possibly could to help but hormones are mad!

as previous posters have said you need to keep feeding a baby to keep up supply. It does feel like you are trying to be the hero sometimes but with a breastfed baby you literally have to be. Your main job is to feed the baby and to keep your supply up, someone suggesting a formula feed when baby is crying can be annoying on a few levels. When a baby cries people often panic and naturally want to give them back to Mum. Husbands/partners can (IME) be guilty of thinking ‘the baby is hungry’ when actually the baby just wants Mum or to be comforted in some way. Breastfed babies also suckle for comfort so they are not always starving if they are crying. They will settle on their Mum because that’s nature but it doesn’t mean that if they are crying from starvation. I’m sorry you were left with crying baby and it is upsetting. Baby may also pick up on your anxiousness and continue to be upset. Your wife maybe knew he was crying but she may have been at her wits end. It’s hard to know from this one example but if she was doing it a lot and you lnew baby was dur a feed, perhaps it’s a cause for concern. Keep an eye on on her, is she close to her Mum? I wasn’t hugely close with mine but she came to stay once when I was at breaking point. I would feed baby then return to bed. She did everything else. I don’t think I slept during the day but I rested and showered. It wss a few days but was a huge help and comfort to my partner who was working lots.

People always say sleep when baby sleeps- I could never switch off. And when my baby was a newborn I would prefer to shower when partner was home so someone was there to watch baby and I could relax. Otherwise you are trying to watch a baby monitor through steamed up glass or imagining crying every few minutes and turning shower off and on. It really is a weird time!

what would be helpful- on your time off or when baby sleeps, batch cook meals or have family make a few for the freezer. Do this quietly, doesn’t have to be a big deal. Make sure cupboards are full with easy options for your wife- cereals she likes, fruits, soups.
Cups of tea and drinks/snacks delivered when you’re about. She will be grateful even if she can’t say it/show it right now. I know that’s hard on you. maybe you are doing all this already, well done if you are.
And the planning thing is hard. My partner was a planner and liked routines. Formula fed babies can generally find a routine easier than BF babies. Newborns are newborns and can be ages before something that resembles a routine. If you just plan everything else in terms of keeping the house and let her focus on the baby and establishing her routine.
Does your wife have any family she is close to OP?
is she part of a breast buddies or similar group? I was lucky that lots of my friends were breasfeeding so I had people to talk to about it.

Absolutely this!! The baby is your’s as well and you should get an input on feeding. Your wife is clearly ok with formula feeding so I’m not sure why she’s being picky about when formula can and can’t be given. It’ll be an absolute game changer.

Unfortunately it may mean a difficult conversation with your wife where you'll have to be robust and stand your ground. She can’t just make all the decisions when others are affected (especially if it means the baby is screaming for 40 minutes hungry).

Finally, I’m sorry you’ve had some shitty, aggressive responses on here - just ignore them.

Once her supply is established/she’s more confident in her feeding you could discuss doing a daily formula feed at bedtime or something? My friends husband did the nightime feed with formula to give her a break but he was always around in the evenings so it worked for them. So baby was BF but topped up with one bottle formula every night. Worked for them? But she may not want that system. I was happy to do feeding myself but it did take a toll.

OP, don't give up. You may not be doing things perfectly but your wife will remember that you were there. You are doing your best and, although I get that you feel worn down and put upon at times, right now you are sowing the seeds of your marriage's survival. I would try to agree with your wife that, if the baby is screaming while you're looking after them, you can give a bottle of pre-made formula (mixed feeding is underrated imo and the supply issues it causes often overrated, although that's just my two pennies-worth).

Be as kind, helpful and supportive as you can. This is one of those crunch times. Check out now and your wife will never forgive you. There are many relationships which have been destroyed or are limping along mortally injured because of a failure to step up at this time. If you think she's being unreasonable, just give her a hug and tell her she's doing a great job (and that might open her up to talking about it).

Hey OP, congrats on your new baby! Firstly, I’d say if your wife is committed to EBF, try and NEVER suggest formula. That really can scupper her chances and will probably make her feel worse. If she wants baby to have formula, then maybe just let her be the one to suggest it? Difficult for you though!

Also, does the baby like a carrier/buggy/sling? Someone’s popping out of the house with the baby can make things easier if you feel like baby is really distressed.

I think my husband could never understand why I didn’t get more “done” whilst baby was sleeping, but in truth it felt like that was the only time I had in the day to do what I wanted. This situation is temporary!! How old is baby now? Soon baby will be able to go longer between feeds, and once food starts that’s a whole new area of excitement!

Hang in there. Sounds like you’re doing really well. I look back on those early days as a bit of a blur, and I’m sure I drove my DH up the wall… it gets better, and it gets more fun!