Raising boys - advice please

[LeopardSnow]

Looking for tips / advice / guidance specifically about parenting / raising boys. I’m a woman married to a woman, and we both grew up with sisters - I have brothers too but they were much older and we weren’t kids at the same time - so basically neither of us have much experience of being / being around / raising boys.

Obviously I know all the basic parenting is the same for boys and girls and you get plenty of boys who don’t conform to stereotypes and vice versa so I don’t really need to be told to just love them and let them be themselves etc. In reality there often are some differences and especially once they get to school boys and girls will face different pressures, peer expectations and environments and I want to make sure I’m equipped to raise a happy, thriving son who feels good about being whatever sort of boy he is.

We’ve got a 3.5 year old boy and a 1.5 year old girl. Looking for any wisdom or advice from parents with boys (dad views particularly welcomed) about what challenges their boys faced, what really helped them or boy specific stuff. Any books you’d recommend found really useful would be good too.

For example a friend with boys told me she wished she’d taught her son at least the basics of football before he started school, as regardless of whether he was super into it or not, being able to play a little functioned as a sort of social currency and way to make friends

I have a boy and a girl. Just do what feels right as there is no right and wrong.

My daughter didn't do football before starting school and she turned out to be a million times better than her brother who went to toddlers football etc..

We’re also a female same sex couple. Our kids are older teens now. Made sure our son had men in his life he was close to. My brother taught him how to shave and they’re really close.

apparently his friends have said they can tell he doesn’t have a Dad and unpacking why they’ve said that it seems to be he’s less aggressive and confrontational that other young men. No bad thing!

otherwise, no issues.

Just on the football, if he loves it, get him in a club early (even just for fun) as it becomes impossible to get them in later. Make sure the coach is sound (ask around) as the kids really do end up looking up to them. Very disappointing for a 6 or 7 year old if they’ve all started at 4 or 5 and you can’t get him in.

The football thing is ridiculous! We are not into football as a family. DS still managed to kick a ball around at break time.

I had one of each - in their 20s now. I taught them both to be kind and polite. To look out for others. Work hard.

The rest is down to their individual characters and you have to address each thing as it arises. It doesn't matter whether they are male or female.

My son was 5 when he was able to retract his foreskin for cleaning it. Before we had the conversation he had been a little bit itchy so I told him about the mechanics of this and so did his Dad. We now give him him a bit of privacy at the end of bath time to give himself a clean.

Apparently the foreskin can be retracted some time between the ages of 5 and 7.

There is a really good book called ‘raising boys who do better’ about raising boys in today’s world. Worth a read.

but also I’d say let them find lots of interests out of school and see what they like. Jonathan Bailey was saying that he was the only boy in his dance class and that turned out well!

For what it's worth I don't think the football thing is ridiculous. My husband isn't into football and he says it's something that hinders small talk between other men. We tried it with our son but he isn't that interested.

I am a woman married to a man and we have two sons.

Our parenting styles are extremely different, as are most male approaches to parenting boys.

I’m the one who gives all the love and cuddles, look after them when they’re sick, do their bedtimes and reading etc, all the nurturing aspects. They’re definitely “mummy’s boys” in that respect. I’m the one they come to when they’re upset or when they want/need something and we have have that stereotypical “mother’s love” relationship.

Their dad on the other hand is the wild and crazy one, again, in the stereotypical way. He’s lunging them around the living room, chucking them up in the air, tickling them until they’re crying, constant rough and tumble play etc. He does all the sport with them, they go on “Daddy and Son Day’s out” to sporting events, or trekking through the forests, rock climbing or lots of other random stuff that doesn’t appeal to me but they all seem to thrive on. He takes them to all the theme parks etc and when they’re queuing for the scariest rides possible, I’m well out of the way and worrying if they’re warm enough!

If they get anything from their dad it’s being taught about resilience! His nature and the way he parents them has such a positive influence on their ability to bounce back and be independent whereas all I want to do is cuddle them and protect them. He’s far more practical when it comes to dealing with emergencies that involve the children whereas I’m more full of worry about them. He has an extremely calming nature towards them and they all have so much boisterous fun together that I know they wouldn’t be exposed to if parenting was solely on my shoulders.

He thinks I wrap them up in cotton wool (which is probably true) whereas he’s the one chucking them in the deep end of the pool whilst they’re in fits of laughter. I’m constantly worrying about their well-being and their safety whereas he’s the “fun parent” who does all the ‘dangerous and adventurous’ stuff that makes my heart beat in terror at the though of them getting hurt.

We provide a very good balance and the children know which parent to go to dependent on what their current need is.

There is research emerging now about the vital role (good) fathers play in parenting in terms of developing a child’s character so it may be worth having a read of that and thinking how you could transfer some of it over to your family. You mentioned brothers, are they local to you and could play a large part in your son’s life in terms of having a male role model?

My friend is a single mum as her arse hole of a partner left her when she found out she was pregnant, and she had a son. She has it hard as she has all those typical innate maternal qualities to protect their child but she also knows she has to play the role of “fun and adventurous” parent too in order to meet those needs. She does an AMAZING job though and forced herself to let her son experience things that deep down she’s terrified of. A child is far better off without a father in their life if the alternative is having a really shitty one.

It is good you are thinking about this but I’m sure you will be absolutely fine and they’ll grow up to be amazing children however you parent them.

It’s not ridiculous if it’s someone’s actual experience is it? Perhaps it’s not a universal experience but in that school clearly football was the way most boys interacted with most other boys and regardless of what you think about football itself, friendship is a pretty not negotiable must have and football seemed to be the way to make friends there. My friend’s son was quite bewildered by it - she said it was as if the other boys were all fluent in a language and he only knew a few words.

IMO it depends on the child, not the sex. I have two boys, and they couldn't be more different to each other. It isn't an either/or. I just let them go with their interests, and know they'll find their people. I'm bringing them up to be polite, thoughtful and respectful (or trying to). I don't treat them any different to how I would a daughter.

@NorthernGirl1981 it's great that your DH and DSs have that relationship, but much of that is because of your DHs character. My DH is definitely not like that, and my DS would not have enjoyed that type of play or the activities.

My DH is very musical, and DH and DS have bonded over piano playing and singing.

In the same way, DD begged to go to dance classes at 2. It wasn't something I was familiar with at all, neither was DH. But she went. DH and I took her to classes, and watched her shows, we both had a go at hair buns. She is still dancing , having joined clubs at uni.

So much of parenting children is down to their character, interests and what they enjoy, not their sex.

We do plenty of rough and tumble with them. They both love it and son in particular thrives on being chased, playing wrestling, being allowed to help carry heavy boxes and showing off his strong muscles etc. Mind you he also loves helping with the cooking, trying on jewellery to dress up as a prince and dancing.

Is be interested in whether it’s specifically important that boys get that kind of rough and tumble, resilience building parenting from FATHERS / MEN or whether it’s just important that they get it from someone and a mother could do it just as well, I expect the studies don’t go into that level of detail.

Is be interested in whether it’s specifically important that boys get that kind of rough and tumble, resilience building parenting from FATHERS / MEN or whether it’s just important that they get it from someone and a mother could do it just as well, I expect the studies don’t go into that level of detail.

My DS never wanted that sort of play. He didn't fight with his sister beyond the odd poke - and that went both ways. He didn't get into fights at school either.
Just because they are male doesn't mean they have to be physical.

A 4 year old isn't going to be socially ostracised for his whole primary school life if he doesn't start reception class already knowing how to play football.

It takes 2 minutes for a child to learn the basics of kicking a ball and doing it once they're at school isn't a disadvantage. These children are 4.

Also, your child needs to be who they are, not be taught that they should like football just to fit in with others.

I'd rather raise a kid with some independent thought. If they start school and decide they like football, great. If not, I'm not going to pressure them to play in order to make friends.

I think there are two different parts to this - one is what individuals are like, and the fact that on average more men take part in adventurous activities and take physical risks. If you are a woman who does this (I mountain bike and climb and ski) then that part is a non-issue. If your boy doesn't like this kind of play then it is also a non-issue. But if he wants to take risks and you don't then you need to either push yourself to encourage it or find a club or instructors who can.

The other side is male role models. I think that boys growing up need to see men in positions of coaching/mentorship if not directly as caregivers. I would seek out sports clubs with really good coaches who care about the boys life skills and emotional well-being. My son also does scouts in a still very male dominated troop - this is great for him to see older teen boys and men doing things like cooking and ironing and organising.

I was surprised how integral to my son's friendship group football had been this year (he's Year 2). It's helped him widen his circle of friends and gave him the confidence to interact with other children particularly older children at holiday clubs.

I'd also consider Squirrels/Beavers if you have a local Scouting group and getting on the waiting list (although I'd say that for boys and girls). Plenty of male role models.

Boys don't 'need' rough and tumble play any more than girls.

This is a complete societal perception/ expectation.

By assuming your boy wants rough and tumble all you're doing is teaching him to conform to a stereotype of what a 'boy' should be.

Please don't do that.

It does depend on the boy and his personality but my boys tell me that being interested in sports, any sports really but especially football, helps boys to bond with each other.
I took mine to the park to kick a football around, tried a mini football club at 4 and ds1 hated it but then played in a club at 7 and enjoyed it.
Being active really helps to settle them. I know girls need activity too, but a lack of activity made my ds go a bit crazy and start launching himself off furniture and all sorts. Dd not so much.
Boys, in my experience, tend to become more addicted to gaming so keep an eye on that. It does affect moods too and I found the frustration from his games made him aggressive after he came off the game.

Yes I will largely be doing the same and treating son and daughter equally while also responding to them as individuals. Cannot assume they will get this sort of treatment at school and from the wider world though, and they will come across gender stereotypes and expectations - some positive some negative - and I’d like to approach that proactively.

It’s a bit like choosing to raise your kids without smartphones / tablets. You can do that yourselves as their parents but you can’t control the rest of the world and realistically they are still going to get access to the internet and see or hear about things like social media and porn from friends whose parents have a different approach

I'd just respond to their interests and needs, same as I would with a girl. Mine liked drama and football when he was primary aged, he also enjoyed beavers/cubs/scouts (which I would recommend).
At primary age it's more likely that mums will be facilitating their kids interests (even football) rather than dads so you have plenty of time to work it all out.

It's better for society if gender roles become more blurred rather than setting out at a very young age that boys need to be strong/fighting, etc.
They will, as you suggest, get plenty of that from the outside world.

Try to get some good male friends / relatives involved as often as possible for an hour, even just once a month to interact with your son in particular. Young boys seem to need a lot of ‘wrestling’ type play, which girls typically don’t enjoy so much. Just being in the company of another male is very important for boys, especially when they reach about 7 or 8, just hanging out, going for a burger or playing football, board games etc.

I think a lot depends on the particular boy and what he needs, but as my has got older (he’s now 9) I see how important his father is in terms of catering to his need for physical, outdoor activity. As an example, he has taught him to split logs with an axe. This works because they both really enjoy that kind of activity and I can really see that my DH is teaching my son how to be a man. Obviously there isn’t just one way to be a man but a responsive parent fine tunes things to suit the child.

I often find myself feeling really frustrated with my boy because he has this wild energy that my DD grew out of at a much younger age. It’s really helpful to understand that sometimes, boys are different to girls in this respect.

You will obviously see what your kid is like but hopefully there is a man in your life who can be closely involved to give him that role model.

Personally I think equal but sometimes different is more realistic. I think if you go down the route of everyone being exactly the same, you end up with young men with no sense of their own role in society. I think it can be difficult for women to understand what it’s like to be a young man with an excess of strength and energy and no outlet. This doesn’t mean we should hem people in with stereotypes but we don’t have deny the reality that on average, men and women are different in some important ways.

I often find myself feeling really frustrated with my boy because he has this wild energy that my DD grew out of at a much younger age. It’s really helpful to understand that sometimes, boys are different to girls in this respect.

Some boys are different to some girls in that respect.

I've known many girls needs lots of physical activity, but not all do.
I've known lots of boys who are happy to sit building lego models for hours, but not all do.

You’ve literally quoted me saying ‘sometimes’. On average boys are more boisterous than girls, but it’s important to remember that what is true on average cannot be assumed to be true for your particular kid.