Do you do things/activities as a family all together?

[staryeyed]

If so what do you do and how old are your children?

The whole point I have been making on the thread is that as a parent you ought to respect your child, not impose your own agenda upon him/her...

There is a complete difference between respecting, and being directed by. I respect Mr Inferior, mainly. I don't do what he says, though.

And when it comes to the mix of all opinions pertaining to inmates of the Inferiority Complex, mine matter too. Quite a lot.

Oh and should DD2 decide tomorrow that she does not, after all, want to come to the theatre with me, she's still coming. She got the option of which parent, and now we're going. Because she'll enjoy it. Oh yes she will. Most definitely.

the older my dds get, the more I listen to them

dd1 is a great one for not wanting to do things, and actually, as she has got older, I can understand why sometimes she doesnt want to do them. I used to really stress over it but now I realise that it isnt the end of the world if she doesnt want to go to a particular party or to someones house for tea, or to swimming one week. So I listen to her more now and we have less fights. She's pretty cool actually. I do suggest she may want to do it, or miss out, but if she is adamant I let her have her way. same witht he 5 year old.

Enid - I think that's very interesting, that you have fewer fights now that you listen to your daughter more and respect her feelings about what she does and doesn't want to do...

I am adamant that as parents we respect our children's feelings. If parents don't who will? And how will children learn that their feelings deserve respect and consideration?

I don't think anyone on this thread has said they don't respect, and listen to, their children. Or the importance of allowing them to make choices.

See my point about respecting my partner but not being directed by him, above.

I am tremendously soppy and indulgent parent I suspect

luckily all dds seem fairly grounded and thoughtful rather than horrid spoilt brats

I don't think that teaching your children mutual respect and listening skills and letting them make their own decisions turns them into spoilt brats.

They become spoilt brats by getting every last material thing they desire and not understanding that someone, somewhere has had to work at something to earn money to buy those things.

agree, MI. It is entirely possible to respect a child's preference by taking it into account yet at the end of the day making a decision as a parent that that preference has to be overriden in the totality of situation.

A child always has a right to ask and be consulted but a parent always has the right to say no or not now.

All a child needs to understand is that the final decision rests with the parent. I don't see any controversy with this statement. Fair play to all attempts at negotiation by the child up to that point - and I have some pretty persistent children who need no encouragement on that front, so I know what I am talking about.

Often, I will give in because I am as soppy as Enid. But if I need to stand firm, I dare anyone to say that I am disrespecting my dcs.

Some examples where negotiation would not be allowed in my house once the question had been posed and I had explained my reasons for refusal:

Mum, can I have a tv/ computer in my room?
Mum, can we go to McDonald's?
Mum, can I stay at home today and not go to school?
Mum, can I just not do homework today?
Can I go to Disney Land?
Can I have a mobile phone?
Can I pierce my tongue?
Can we buy some foie gras?
Can I go and watch a film which centres on a chid rape?

Obviously for some of these I'm thinking ahead but since I'm not going to change my mind what would be the point of negotiation? The answer is NO.

However rational and sensible a child (at aged 3 for example) never understimate the force of peer pressure. It's quite hard for a child when she sees herself as being different from all her schoolmates and it can be really hard for a parent to remain firm when faced with pester power.

Wouldn't you be interested in your child's POV, fivecandles?

Anna - I've not spent 30 minutes reading the entire thread, so apologies if post is redundant or irrelevant.....or misses the point entirely!

Do you think it is possible, by giving your dd so much input/control into what happens in her life, that she will find it very difficult (if not impossible) to fit into her group at school? The teacher will (to some extent) dictate to the class. Individual opinions/preferences will (largely) not figure in.

My dd is an only, and I spend some energy/effort making her aware that being bossy/domineering (or merely having a strong opionion and wanting to be 'in charge' of decsions/choices all the time) can be tiresome for others.

yes I understand the premise that the parents say is final

I think I also understand Annas point that sometimes it is good to listen to what your child wants and let them have it, even if it is different to what you would want

lol at foie gras though

Earlybird - our style of parenting is not at all unusual at my daughter's school (nor in the other two schools we might consider sending her to in future).

There are lots of different styles of parenting represented at the current school (over 60 nationalities and lots of intermarriages...).

So far, my daughter has settled extremely well at school and her behaviour fits in very well with the expectations of her class teachers. In fact, at our first meeting with her the teacher's precise words about my daughter's attitude were "c'est comme ça qu'il faut être dans la vie" (= that's the right attitude to life).

So, in answer to your question: not in the slightest

(my daughter is not an only child, btw)

tbh I can see me letting my dds do all of those things at some point if they felt very strongly about it

tv in room - yes when teenager so I dont have to put up with their mindless progs
Mum, can we go to McDonald's? - not something we ever usually do and can't imagine them asking but probably would if for soem reason they were desperate to
Mum, can I stay at home today and not go to school? yes if some reason behind it that I agreed with
Mum, can I just not do homework today? yes if they are very very tired and I can sympathise
Can I go to Disney Land? unlikely, but possibly one day
Can I have a mobile phone? yes when you are a teenager
Can I pierce my tongue? I would HATE you to pierce your tongue but if you do it with your money and on your time there would be nothing I could do about it
Can we buy some foie gras? lol
Can I go and watch a film which centres on a chid rape? ok, we are in the realm of fantasy here, as so unlikely to ask!!

Enid - we eat a lot of foie gras. That's what they sell in the supermarket here.

Bacon is impossible to find

Anna - glad the school is working out so well.

I am aware that your dp has children from a previous relationship, but assumed they live with their Mum most of the time - hence my classing your dd as an 'only'. My apologies.

in fact come to think of it when we stayed in a b and b in the Loire, madame served up foie gras to dh and I for our starter - eggs mayo for kids, dd2 ate some foie gras until dh explained what it was

Earlybird - my stepsons are with us a lot, my partner sees them nearly every day and from my daughter's POV they are her brothers and live with us.

I appreciate that stepfamilies are complicated and that stepsibling relationships are not always as close and passionate as our children's

To clarify, the reason my children will not be eating foie gras while they live with me and while I pay for their food is because of the following:

'Foie gras, French for "fatty liver," is made from the grotesquely enlarged livers of male ducks and geese. The birds are kept in tiny wire cages or packed into sheds. Pipes are repeatedly shoved down the birds' throats, and up to 4 pounds of grain and fat are pumped into their stomachs two or three times every day. The pipes puncture many birds' throats, sometimes causing the animals to bleed to death. This cruel procedure causes the birds' livers to become diseased and swell to up to 10 times their normal size. Many birds become too sick to stand up. The birds who survive the force-feeding are killed, and their livers are sold for foie gras'

What they choose to do with their own money and time when they are adults and earn their own money is up to them. Whle they live in my house they will respect my values. Yes I respect them and am very happy to listen to their POV but I decide what happens in my house and how to bring up my kids. Is that ok?

What you consider to be acceptable in your own homes is up to you.

If you all want to have kids with tongue piercings who spend all day playing computer games in their rooms in their underwear whilst eating foie gras so be it.

And sorry to sound like a Daily Mail reader but no bloody wonder we have a massive obesity problem, disruptive kids in school and are destroying the planet.

fivecandles - do you think that the world's problems can be solved by control tactics?

Oooh, please let this thread turn into a debate on the morality of foie gras

I think the world would be a much nice place if a few more parents had the confidence to say no to their kids more often and protect and guide them a little better.

And likewise understood a little bit more about the differences between children and adults.

Anna you 'control' your children's behaviour just as much as I do mine. Even when you decide to allow your child to 'negotiate' you are controlling and changing her behaviour. Certainly when you take her to see films like Atonement and feed her with foie gras you are controlling her as much as I control my children when I read to them or provide them with a vegeterian meal.

Our values, I'm glad to say are different.

fivecandles you sound extreme in your own way!

I would hesitate a guess that your children are under 5 and 'controllable'?

Yes I have values but I am not egocentric enough to expect that my children will follow them. I lead by example but if my children decide not to follow that is up to them. They are kind, loving, sensitive children so if they decide to have their tongues pierced I can;t imagine it will be the end of the world. It might even broaden my mind .

As parents we all influence our children, hugely, by the lifestyle we lead and the views we hold.

By control of others, it is generally meant that we make decisions on other people's behalf or that affect them without taking their POV into consideration.