Feral two year old

[Understandtheconcept]

My two year old is just awful: I know terrible twos are a thing, but I honestly didn’t expect it to be this horrific.

I can’t believe I’m actually considering using physical chastisement, I’ve always been totally against any form of smacking but just nothing works and I’m absolutely at breaking point.

I really feel for you but some of these suggestions are just so unhelpful!

As the mum of a small and generally well behaved 2 year old I would not be at all happy if someone just gave a verbal warning then a 5 minute time out etc , basically letting the more aggressive child hit mine three times before taking them away

On the occasions mine is having a bad day she would be straight out of somewhere if she hurt another child and I think it's pretty selfish parenting to do anything else

I think talking to your HV or trying something like the family lives parentline might be helpful as you've clearly tried a lot of strategies and are really suffering from this

Oh op it's really hard.. how's his speech etc?

My eldest was a late talker and used to get frustrated! His behaviour was similar and I nicknamed him "feral".

I had a newborn too so it was bloody hard work!

My two year old was referred to the paediatrician who has been amazing! He is 7 now and whilst he does have an ASD diagnosis his struggles now are to do with being too sociable and giving cuddles etc.

Speak to your health visitor and ask for advice abs support. Advocate for you and your child.

Sending as I've been there but honestly my little boy now is mostly a joy!

Thanks, I really am grateful.

Not all days are as bad as today, some days we have quite a nice time although he’s always going to be tiring, he’s a toddler. He did have a number of recurring ear infections and I do wonder if that affected his speech but it doesn’t seem to.

Its maybe true soft play isn’t the best, but he does need to release energy somewhere and while MN toddlers might be happy running around in thunderstorms in puddle suits it really isn’t always possible or sensible or safe. I tried going to a rain soaked park once with a puddlesuit and DS nearly slipped and broke his neck on a climbing frame and shot off a wet slide with such force I thought he was going to be catapulted into the river.

I do feel quite low about it, it was hard even working up energy to read to him at bedtime and he can be lovely, I’ve said a lot about him at his worst but at his best he’s delightful. I don’t even mind the annoying but normal toddler behaviour like pouring drinks and making a mess. It’s when he’s so unkind to other kids it is awful.

I’m sorry - of course, that would be really scary. But it is easier when you have the correct information and tools for the job instead of trying to lay foundations using a kids bucket and spade. The right tools can be a game changer.
I really do wish you well, and I didn’t mean to cause you any additional upset. I do hope it’s just a moment in time for you - the pre school years are absolutely brutal.

How cuddly is he with you? I think you mentioning overstimulation earlier is something...definitely more calm, less busy. More time to connect with Mummy and rebuild a more positive relationship as its currently where Mummy is always saying no, taking things away from me, taking me away from places etc....calm time at home and in the garden with lots of praise for every single good thing, fill him up with how kind he is how caring he is, play and model interactions with soft toys...gently stroke a toy dog etc, introduce a 1 minute meditation session where chilled music plays, no lyrics, on a cushion and deep breathing with him. Build the relationship at home and it will show on the outside. If it doesn't help a medical assessment may be needed.

I used to wonder if DD was feral at the same age.

I ended up going on a parenting course which was super helpful.

Its 22 years ago so a bit hazy but
dropping the pitch and volume of my voice, repeating the same phrases quietly"shoes on please, shoes on please, shoes on please" until compliance and always giving choices, put your coat on or I'll carry it in case you get cold rather than coat on or you can't go out which set up confrontation.

If its any consolation DD was a delightful child/teen and is a charming adult but jeeze birth to 3 was tough.

I’m really not like that at all @PerfectPrepPrincess . I’ve taken a fair amount of flack on this thread but I am going to take exception to that.

Since birth he’s had his needs met, sometimes I do have to step in and take him away from something or someone to stop him or someone else being hurt, but it is not very frequent. We did soft play today as there was a thunderstorm outside. I took him away from some toy cars on two occasions because he was not letting kids play on them, the rest of the time was spent lumbering around the place following him.

Probably should add DD is dyslexic and ADHD which probably explains her early challenges but both those traits absolutely make her as an adult, I can PM you details but she's self employed working across Europe in a creative industry, the envy of many NT's.

I can't say education was easy but we survived.

I'm sorry you are finding this so tough.

Your most recent update sounds like typical 2 year old behaviour. He is still learning social norms and doesn’t have the verbal skills to say how he is feeling so shows it in behaviour. He is upset when moved away from things so kicks, hits, bites. Has there been times when this has got him what he wants? Not necessarily by you but by Dad/nursery/grandparents etc.
Keep a record of his behaviour for the next few days, either recording positives or the behaviours of concern. Are there any patterns? Is it worse at time he might be tired? Hungry? Over stimulated? Is it always when he is with others? Etc.

So basically he's not that bad then is he? He's a normal 2yo?

I don’t know, you tell me. I do know I’m a bit fed up of being criticised this much for taking him to soft play. I do know he doesn’t respond to Boundaries or Consequences. I know I want to stick How To Talk So Little Kids Continue to Ignore You where the sun doesn’t shine. I know the kids I know of the same age don’t behave like he does. I know he is violent and aggressive. Does any of that sound like a normal two year old? You tell me.

I think this sounds like pretty normal 2 year old behaviour to be honest. It will get better and like you say, you have good days too

Then why don’t I see other kids behaving like him? I don’t mean that to sound as confrontational as it does, it’s just I’m at a loss. Activity like swimming and it’s just me and him fine, but then once someone upsets him or has something he wants he’s awful.

I think you need to stop comparing him to other kids.

@Understandtheconcept don't look at possible additional needs and panic, and don't overthink.

My son wouldn't have got an ASD diagnosis ten years ago, yet now he does it means he gets the support he needs in school rather than being labelled as being naughty or defiant.

We understand so much more these days about how "one size fits all" doesn't work.

I'm an early years teacher and lead practitioner and also sendco.. Does your son attend nursery at all? If not it might be worth sending him and seeing how he is there and chat with the staff.

Don't be disheartened, talk to your gp/health visitor and ask for support. Ask about his speech. Have you had his 2 year check yet?

I'm not going to patronise you by saying he just needs a firm "no" because I can genuinely emphasise with your entire post and feel your frustration, desperation and upset.

Is dad at home? How is his behaviour with dad?

You don't see other children's tantrums because you're focusing on your child. Just be consistent and if he's upset and not being able to share for example just keep calm and repeat things like it's your turn and then this little boy can have a turn and then you have a turn again or whatever. It's ok to have tantrums, it's their way of learning how to control their emotions.

Also maybe his behaviour isn't as bad as you feel at the time and you're a bit worried of what others think?

Hi OP, I read the entire thread and you said his speech is delayed, also no, in my opinion and from all what I've seen, this behaviour is not necessarily normal and you shouldn't feel like this. I'm sorry you're having such a hard time.

My son's speech is delayed, he'll be two this month. He says about 10 words but his receptive language is good. He loves to read, what about asking him to get things. When it's breakfast time, does he know, get your cereal out, get your bowl out, get the milk out, carry it to the table, get me a book, where is the rocket, go take this to daddy you call him from another room, does he come over? Does he turn around when you call his name?

If his receptive language is poor, I would call your local health visiting team and get him assessed. We just got our 23-26 months questionnaire which gives you a good picture of how well your child is developing.

If someone tried to take something from my son, he does pinch or bite the child but I believe this is because he cannot say no and has no way of expressing how he feels.

I am not sure he knows he can't just bite or pinch people but he does say sorry when he ask him to. He cannot say sorry verbally but he strokes the his brothers arm (often it's his brother, not other children) and his body language shows he knows it's not good and he's being "told off".

How is your relationship with him, OP?He really needs you, and quality time with you, whatever that looks like. Also I do believe that children (and all people) can sense if you see them in a negative light. If you think he is a bully he is more likely to act that way, though I do agree with PP he can’t be a bully at 2 years old.

I would definitely try getting a referral to audiology for a hearing check. Ds1 had ear infections / glue ear / disordered and delayed speech, and would get so frustrated at being unable to communicate that he would lash out. His behaviour improved drastically as he got older and worked with speech therapy. I would also read up on ASD / ADHD see if he ticks any of the boxes. If so, I’d approach your health visitor, as most areas have a long waiting list (then at least you’re on the list, and you can always ask to be removed if you need to). In the meantime, you could always try implementing some of the strategies aimed at toddlers with additional needs.

Oh it sounds like you are having a really tough time. I know how you feel, I could have written your post 21 years ago! Sadly there was no internet friends to get advice from.
You sound like you are doing the right things, we had to leave so many toddler groups because he'd pushed after being given a warning.
He's about to start a PhD in September, he was diagnosed a couple of years ago with ADHD, and is the gentlest young man. if you met him now you'd never have thought he'd been the toddler from hell!
Hang in there

Hi OP, I completely understand your post having had a child exactly like how you describe your boy. She is my eldest so thought it was normal terrible twos (she is an adult now so before things like forums for similar stories) until I had my other children and realised how hard she was in comparison.
With my other children, boundaries and consequences and the sorts of techniques described in this thread worked but she did not give a single shit. Tbh, that is her personality to this day but she is a functioning member of society!
Sorry I don't have any real advice, we gave up really taking her to places where there would be lots of people such as soft play or eating out for a year or so until she settled (and she did). Whether there was something that would have worked and we missed it I don't know but I certainly believe there are some kids who all the tried and tested methods just do not work.

I was about to say this. I thought my DS was the worst child but now he’s easier and my second generally easier going I notice other children behaving exactly as he did. You don’t see much when you’re in the thick of it.

He sounds like my nephew who went on to be diagnosed with ADHD.
He was a draw dropping level of awful as a younger child. I really felt sorry for his mum.
Once when I watched him for a couple of hours when he was about 3 he bit my son with a smile on his face and then kicked my little dog for absolutely no reason. Actually ran up to him and kicked him.
He is 7 now and last time I saw him he was great company. Lots of chatting with the adults and he shared all of his Easter eggs after the hunt.

I have 3 of the same gender. When I had my 3rd I was of the opinion that it would be plain sailing as I was basically an expert on boys.

How fucking wrong was I?!

My 3rd was “challenging” beyond words - didn’t sleep, screamed, didn’t listen, threw things, no impulse control, no concept of danger. He was EXHAUSTING. I remember one “good” friend telling me that I’d bitten off more than I could chew in having him (what was I supposed to do? Return him??).

Fast forward 7 years, he’s diagnosed with ADHD, very bright and now medicated. He’s bloody adorable. Huge empathy, amazing with babies, animals and younger children. Still a bit wild with a dubious impulse control but in a very manageable way.

I am NOT for one second saying your son has ADHD or anything else. What I am saying is that I get, I really really get how hard it is. I think had my third been my first then he would have broken me.

Soft play is the WORST. I would honestly try to avoid it. It’s massively overstimulating for many younger children. Hopefully the weather will improve soon and you can spend more time outside. I agree with a pp who talked about wearing them out. My 3 are all high energy and I had to run them like huskies. It could be grim when it was shit weather but it worked. My youngest at the age of 2.5 was happy to walk a good 2 -3 miles. I should have been a bloody size 8.

When mine were little we had a great children’s centre near us which was helpful. Do you have anything like that? I did a raising boys course at mine which was very useful.

Two is REALLY hard. They get hugely frustrated and their communication/ understanding isn’t always great.

It’s easy to blame yourself but really try not to. Asking for help and questioning what’s going on like you are is really positive.

I hope things get easier

Hang in there OP, my son is the same age as yours and he has been a complete terror for the last 12 months. Its only in the last few weeks I've seen an improvement which has coincided with his speech really coming along. But prior to that his behaviour was off the charts compared to all my friends kids that are the same age. He's been biting other kids at nursery. He gets so angry and frustrated when he can't have something/gets told off that he tries to bite me/objects/himself, will upturn furniture, throws all his meals on the floor, hitting, kicking, throwing toys, screaming. It really made me miserable, like I'd failed as a parent. I think it's just who he is - at 6 weeks old the midwife said he was "intense" lol - he had reflux, cried non stop. But I've seen a huge improvement in the last few weeks like something has clicked. And it's been amazing! We still have difficult moments but I can see light at he end of the tunnel. And routine has really helped. So just hang in there OP!