AIBU for feeling weird about what I saw at my daughter’s nursery?

[Probablytired]

My 12 month old daughter has just finished her second week (mon-wed) at nursery. She’s adjusting okay but things could be better, like sleep. I know that’s to be expected though. Today she actually slept really well and came out super happy, but something I saw before that flagged up to me as strange.

Overall, we chose this nursery because of the play environment and how the staff came across as genuinely caring and kind during our visits, but as I was waiting to pick my daughter up today I heard one of the staff shout loudly at a little boy. It was in the slightly older toddlers room, I believe that’s from 17 months, and the little boy was climbing onto the food table (I could see this through the door window). She screamed from across the room ‘GET OFF RIGHT NOW’, stormed over, grabbed the little boy under the arms and roughly put him on the floor. He started crying and nobody comforted him. She then spotted me through the glass pane and I noticed that she went over to him then and calmly said ‘I asked you not to climb on the table’ and comforted him. The manager was sitting in her office with the door open next to us so she would’ve heard it too, and she didn’t bat an eyelid.

Something just isn’t sitting right with me. Did she really need to shout at him like that? They’re only very young still, and handling him like that felt very rough and unnecessary. Thinking back if I’d seen her doing it with my child I would have marched straight into the room and said something, and then I feel bad because that’s somebody else’s child and they might feel the same way but they don’t know about it.

how would you respond to this? Nursery is very new to me, so I don’t know if I’m being overly sensitive, all I know is that we don’t shout at our daughter because shouting gets nobody anywhere and is demeaning when she can’t defend herself. I don’t really expect the workers at a nursery I’m paying £95 a day for to be shouting at my child either. What’s your view? I think I need some perspective

Trust your instincts OP.

I had a very similar incident. Told myself I was over reacting.

As soon as DS was old enough to talk he told us the nursery staff were deliberately hurting him, and described/demonstrated what they were doing. I really wish I had trusted my first instinct.

OP, you have raise your concerns with the nursery manager and remain vigilant about what goes on in your DC own room. You’ve already read a few posts with others experiences of nursery and it’s the reality. I too turned up unexpectedly one day to collect my DC and waited outside the door for them to finish lunchtime. I saw a member of staff standing over a little boy berating them for not eating and it made me feel sick to watch - it it had been my child I would have stormed in there and then but I complained later and the staff was sent on some training … the nursery later lost its ofsted grade rightly so as lots was going on behind the scenes and by that time I had pulled my dc out months before as he was so unhappy.

Absolutely this.

We've been using our nursery five days a week for four years and never seen anything approaching this at any time of day or with any age group. I wouldn't be happy with it.

A raised voice and rushing over to get him I could understand - could be the hundredth time in a very long day. But being rough and changing when a parent can see are different.

I’d be horrified.

You can’t ever be 100% sure what happens but I am as sure as I can be that doesn’t happen at DD’s nursery. If anything where we go they are a bit too far on the “soft” side. The manager is very against raised voices and very much leads by example.

I’d definitely be wary and you night want to scope out alternatives. It’s hard to move when they are settled. We travel ridiculously far now to DD’s nursery as we moved away but didn’t like anywhere near to the new house so haven’t moved her. Not ideal but you have to trust them and it’s the only setting that didn’t give me bad vibes despite the fact it is “only” Ofsted Good and not Outstanding. But the Outstanding ones didn’t give me the right feeling. I think it’s really important to trust your gut.

I'd agree to trust your instincts. I work with kids in various settings, worked in some great preschools and nurseries where staff are great. Just started new job at big chain nursery and already having similar concerns to you. Shouting at kids, rough handling, slagging off parents to staff and even to child itself. It makes me really uncomfortable to the point where I might leave and report. It really put me off sending my daughter to a big nursery sent her to a small village hall preschool in the end. Obviously will never know either how it was behind closed doors but feel like these big chain ones are so money driven. It is a hard exhausting, badly paid job but it doesn't excuse shouting and handling children roughly at all.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2023/03/230330210742.htm

Awful but not surprising. You can’t get good quality nursery staff anymore. The wage is too low to attract good people. Honestly? Try a childminder.

If its one of those chain nurseries, I wouldn't be surprised at all, some of the people they employ shouldn't be within an inch of children.

The initial shouting wouldn’t bother me, but rough handling and not comforting him crying would.

Came early to pick 2yr old dd up from 'outstanding' nursery attached to a private school and saw a staff member walking with her back from another room across the playground, but walking in a cross sort of way so her little legs couldnt really keep up. They werent looking at her, just pulling her along.
Also picked her up to find her with poo on the outside of her clothes. She hadnt had a poo apparently.
And they threw the lunches out so you never knew what theyd eaten.
Took her out after 3 weeks.

I work in early years, I would not speak to one of our children like this. If the child was in danger I would have rushed over picked them up and put them on the floor and maybe said something like "not climbing on tables Jemima as you might fall and hurt yourself"
If the child wasn't in danger I would have probably said the same thing and asked them to climb down. I wouldn't shout and I definitely wouldn't have put them on the floor in a rough way. Our interaction wouldn't have ended in the child crying.

Yeah, my sister worked in nurseries and quit the profession because of the number of places she worked where this behaviour and others was common. She told some awful stand even reported some but I'm not sure if anything was done.

I'm sure there are great places too but decent staff make all the difference. It's the same with childminders, they vary massively.

*awful stories

Not surprised. The only reason I
put my son in nursery was because I had worked in it myself and knew the staff were amazing. Before I had him I worked in a few different nurseries and I wouldn’t say any of the staff were bad people but it was often understaffed with long hours and rubbish pay. Staff were demoralized, exhausted and run down as they could never take time off sick as they wouldn’t get paid. Children would come in who screamed all day yet we were not allowed to tell the parents lest they pull them out and we lose the custom. Hearing screaming kids all day, looking after children often with severe special needs and behavior problems with no support or adjustments made, sometimes being so understaffed we had to even eat lunch with the kids .. yeah patience wore thin unfortunately. I found myself being snappy and unenthusiastic and decided I had to leave the field as the kids deserved better but many will stay and get more ground down and less patient. Early years staff are leaving in their droves to work in retail
and cleaning jobs for better pay and less stress. I had never been so physically and mentally drained in my whole life. If you must use a nursery I would ensure you check the staffing levels and staff turnover at a minimum.

This. It’s not ideal. However that child could be doing that ALLLL the time and it is a danger to him. I have shouted at young children doing dangerous things when I haven’t been close enough to get to them to stop them, am sure most people have. It’s not ideal but it’s better than the child being injured

I've taken my 3 yo old out because when I've been there during the day, there have been several children crying and being ignored.
One boy they told me was doing it to be manipulative.
I just hate to think of the parent merrily going about their day while their child is there crying and miserable.

I’m a teacher in secondary where the teens often display extremely challenging behaviour. We are often like broken records correcting the same behaviour from the same students - and we correct dangerous behaviour too, like kids running in front of cars at the end of the day. No shouting policies are becoming the norm in secondary, as has been the case in my school for many years now. It therefore seems very backward to me that shouting happens in a setting with babies.

If it was a rare occurrence, I’d have probably stepped out of my office if the manager to see what on Earth had happened (eg something very dangerous) to warrant such a reaction. The fact that no such thing happened, suggesting it’s not out of the ordinary, and, more so, the fact that the key worker reacted to being heard/seen would make me quite concerned personally.

Bloody hell!

How was he going into nursery.

I am pretty confident about my boys nursery. My youngest is always happy to go in and crosses the threshold himself and gives staff a big cuddle. My eldest is 4 and tells me things in such minute detail I can’t imagine him holding anything back. He does tell me when he’s been told off and will admit to the part he played too.

So I wasn’t concerned, but feel a bit naive having read this thread. I’m so relaxed with the nursery I use and that carries across to all staff.

Something I really don’t like is not being introduced to new members of staff.

If it was a rare occurrence, I’d have probably stepped out of my office if the manager to see what on Earth had happened (eg something very dangerous) to warrant such a reaction. The fact that no such thing happened, suggesting it’s not out of the ordinary, and, more so, the fact that the key worker reacted to being heard/seen would make me quite concerned personally.

Thats a really valid point about the manger. You’re right, she should have investigated and the fact she didn’t speaks volumes.

Its rare these days to get really good decent childcare staff.

I should know as I am an ex Nursery Manager who then went on to train Nursery Nurses.

Many do it as they feel it’s an easy job. Truth is - it’s far from easy and undertaking a childcare qualification is mandatory.

Lots of childcare staff don’t want the hassle. Not all but lots .

They are paid peanuts really which is ludicrous considering the responsibility they have as well as the cost of sending a child to a Nursery.

This is not acceptable at all op . I’d be looking to remove my child in this situation.

I've worked in childcare for years. The only time I've ever raised my voice at a child is when they're doing or about to do something dangerous, and I can't get to them quick enough to physically stop them. Could probably count on one hand the amount of times it's been necessary.

Absolutely no need to ever handle a child roughly though!

most of the girls at school who chose childcare did so because it was an easy course to get on and they didn’t need good grades and they thought it was easy. My best friend was kind and lovely but she said that it was common to have a culture of bitchiness in the ones she worked in and there was one little boy who they used to laugh at calling him ugly eg and laughing at his clothes and speech. She never put her own baby in nursery.

He was clingy and would cry but we were told he was just shy and made to feel like we were being a bit precious and we’re told that he was fine within minutes of us leaving.

I am sure there are great nurseries out there, but please please trust your instincts if you feel something is off.

The changing the manner is the bit that gets me. This happened to me when my grandmother was in a nursing home, the carer wasn't being particularly nice then they saw me and looked sheepish and their manner changed. I still feel terrible when I think about it and always wondered what else went on there 😕

I would remove my child. I worked in nurseries years ago and unfortunately there were lots where shouting at children and rough handling were common. The managers reaction tells you everything , this wasn't a one off.