My children are like wild animals

[TiredYorkshireMam]

Don't really know what I'm after here, just having a moan. I know I'm being mardy but I'm having a bad day / week.

I have a 5 year old who is ok on his own, and a 2.5 year old who is hard work on his own, just because of his age. But together, omg they are like a pack of wild animals.

Just had a big shop delivered. They pounced all over it like a pack of hyenas. Toilet rolls and bread squashed to buggery. Packets ripped open, things dragged all over the house.

House is always a tip. Can never find anything. Just so much junk and toys. We moved 1.5 years ago to a bigger house but it's still too small because of all the crap. I keep trying to get rid of stuff but they run around at the back of me pulling stuff out bags and dragging it back into their rooms. Trying to do it when they are not here, but they are always here. I'm either working or I'm looking after them, I don't get time away from them.

5 year old started football club a while ago. Got him pair of secondhand boots about a month ago. Brought them home, put them on side - haven't seen them since. Just vanished. Will be under a mountain of crap somewhere no doubt but that's been a month now and no sign.

They are always screeching to do things and for me to set up games etc, but they lose interest almost as soon as it's set up, or they just start fighting.

They are having their dinner just now. 5 year old is a good eater but 2.5 yo won't sit on his arse. Constantly getting up and running about. Eventually I sat down to have my own dinner and he starts screaming and grabbing at the food in my mouth same food as is on his plate.

Had planned to take them swimming this afternoon as 5 yo has been asking for ages but can't find swim suits. Not where I put them.

It's my mams birthday on Monday and I'd put her present on the table ready to be wrapped. They were painting at the other end of the table yesterday and spilled the cup of water for their brushes but didn't tell me, so my mams present is sodden as the water has ran across the table and seeped under it.

They are always running about screeching and crying, but they won't just play together, they follow me room to room, grabbing at me and climbing on me, and I feel like I can't just get a minute alone with my thoughts.

They fight a lot and knock lumps out each other and I feel like I am constantly refereeing them. I feel like they feed off my stress and involvement so I think Im just going to have to leave them to it to fight it out amongst themselves.

They have me and my husband run ragged and I do feel they feed off it and we need to stop. It's just so unpleasant in our house, so much screaming and unhappiness (they have nothing to be unhappy about, they have pretty good lives).

2.5 yo screeching and whinging just goes through me like a dagger. If he sees something he wants, like an apple or something, he will immediately start screeching and screaming for it. Omg, you can have it, it's not an issue, just take it, have it, you don't have to screech at me!!!

I just feel so drained. I don't like the parent I am. Sometimes I put the tv on and end up shouting at them "just watch the tv!!!! Just sit down and zip it, for 5 minutes!" because I just cannot cope with them running around me, screeching and grabbing at me all day.

I find being at home impossible so we usually try to get up and out, but we are waiting on a plumber this morning so are stuck here until 2ish. And to be honest I find being out just as hard for other reasons. The 2.5 yo has no sense of danger and it is so stressful. They also never eat / drink when they are supposed to and they screech that they are hungry : thirsty or the 5 yo will need the loo, at the most inopportune moment, and I'm so physically tired of dragging myself around laden down with bags and snacks and bikes and scooters.

Sorry, that really was a moan. I'm just so bored of it all

Thank you @TiredYorkshireMam
I'm glad your boys aren't like my friend's little boy!
I just needed to offload as the incident really upset me.

Hi Sommer did you use your friend's real name? Maybe ask for your post to be deleted if so.

The little boy is clearly very distressed and unable to communicate it. Bear in mind he is almost certainly hitting and kicking your friend. Please support your friend if you can by being a listening ear. That doesn't mean you need to be alone with her distressed child.

It is very isolating when your child is violent to you. Mine has more or less grown out of the hitting, kicking and spitting but it just adds another layer of shame when friends are visibly horrified.

It's not that unusual either - a researcher at the University of Durham recently published a study on it. But because of the stigma, people don't talk about it.

Sorry OP.

He really looks forwards to things but then will quite often have a bit of a meltdown beforehand.

Oh lord yes. The run up to Christmas is the worst 🤦‍♀️

@Aria999 yes, exactly.

He does this with everything, if there is something happening he gets so excited and stressed that he starts crying because he wants to do it now and I have to explain that there's nothing I can do about it, we just have to wait until the day it's happening.

Then on the day he gets up so early (he always gets up too early) and gets totally overhyped and is often exhausted by the time the thing starts

OP, my kids were fairly mellow so maybe this won't work with yours but even by 5 it was easy to discipline them because they loved playing on their N64 so much. They were allowed an hour a day ( they were active the rest of the time so I had no issues with it plus they played on it together so it was sociable). If they were naughty I'd be very calm and give three warnings. If they continued or if it was something that needed to be addressed immediately I would give them a time out. If they refused or gave any chat then they would "lose their computer privilidges". I was really really consistent but they could earn back their computer privilidges with good behaviour or chores.
I also had a rule that they had to turn off the computer after their hour was up when I said so. If they didn't they wouldn't be able to play it the following day and if they complained about that they wouldn't be allowed to play for a week. This sounds rigid but it meant that discipline (with 4 kids close in age) was less of an issue. Occasionally the boys would time out themselves 😅😂😅😂

Do you have something that your kids absolutely love?

They were naturally quite well behaved but I'm sure this set way of disciplining them worked well. I didn't have to haggle with them or shout at them.

I also did a lot of role play with them to try and help them think about what they are doing. So rather than yelling at them to stop making a mess I'd ask why are you doing that, what do you think will happen, how will effect XYZ etc etc. That sounds way more yummy mummy that it was but it seemed to work.

BTW I couldn't stop them squabbling with when they were teens but no one's perfect 🤦🏻‍♀️. It used to drive me nuts.

We have the overexcited to an enormous degree, wake at dawn thing too. It was 1am on Christmas day, gosh we were all zombies by tea time. Also a memorable holiday with a 5 hour time difference where she woke for the day at 12.45, that being her normal wake time of 5.45am minus 5 hours...

It's essentially an issue with managing big emotions, but I hadn't really thought of "excitement/anticipation" as an emotion until we had her.

We've been prescribed melatonin for the ADHD related sleep issues and it's been extremely helpful. I'd go as far as to say it saved our marriage.you

Sorry for random typo at end.

Yes, whenever DS is really looking forward to something his overall behavior and impulse control just completely disintegrate.

Normal sanctions either stop working entirely or are much less effective.

Not sure how I get through these periods to be honest as it's a bit of a blur but probably some combination of the panda suggestions in the recent link and sheer dogged persistence.

He is not actually adhd or so we are told and he sleeps well but he has a sensory processing disorder, he can't sit still, he has a very low boredom threshold, and he finds it very very hard to wait (or save) for anything, so there are some similar behaviors.

They need sanctions or consequences to their behaviour.

These need to be sanctions that will have an impact, ie if they are naughty then you will take their game off them (or whatever). You need to be strict with these and stick to them.

Equally, you can give them treats for good behaviour, ie if they tidy their toys then you take them to the park (for instance).

If they are naughty children then they themselves will be hugely impacted by this as they won't be invited to friends houses or to parties etc. Other parents don't like having naughty children round!

@tootiredforanything They aren't naughty. The 5 year old is very popular (the 2 year old still a bit young for actual friendships / play dates).

The issue really is at home, when they are together.

Out and about the main difficulty is that they are very boisterous and I am run ragged trying to keep up with them and keep them safe.

At home they just wind each other up. Either play fighting or real fighting. They are rough with each other in a way that they are not with other children.

There is a lot of competition and jealousy between them which I do find hard to manage. Sometimes I feel like the 2 year old gets a rough deal because the 5 year old gets his way; sometimes I feel bad for the 5 year old because the younger gets his way because "he's just a baby, he doesn't understand".

Yes, same here. I can see his impulse control just completely leave him. He can't help himself.

@Phineyj gosh that sounds hard.

And yes, I'd say our marriage is being tested to the limits.

I'm glad you found melatonin to work for you. Luckily my two sleep better now than they used to and I think we've turned a corner there.

5 year old does wake early and springs out of bed, but he generally sleeps all night. Although the does like one of us in beside him. If he wakes up and he is alone he will shout or get in our bed. Only once a night though so it's bearable.

To the poster to asked if my husband and I get any time to ourselves though: no, we don't. We don't have any family support so it is just down to the two of us. We haven't been out alone since they were born. It is really hard. We could get a babysitter but to be honest the thought of going out for an evening and then coming home and having to deal with them and a hangover the next morning just all seems more hassle than it's worth.

The dream would be somebody to take them overnight, but we don't have anybody to do that. So for now we have an hour or so peace in the evening once they are in bed. They used to be up all evening and we didn't get that, so we're just grateful for that at the moment.

They aren't naughty. The 5 year old is very popular (the 2 year old still a bit young for actual friendships / play dates).

My previous post was stating that parents won't want naughty children round their house. You say they aren't naughty but you also say they are always screeching and running around causing a mess and won't sit down to eat. I'm sure some parents would feel this is naughty so, for their own sake, you need to sort this out!

It does state in the post that this is at home. It's their behaviour at home, when they are together, that is the issue.

My almost 5yo spits, kicks, punches etc. He will be assessed by a paediatrician in a few months. We live with this on a daily basis.

We are a happy family in general so we have no idea where this is coming from.

Have you ever come across the Ross Greene Collaborative Problem Solving / kids do well if they can /explosive child model?

It sounds quite fluffy and ineffective at first hearing, but he has used it for decades with incredibly challenging children and it is really transformative because essentially it lets you see the patterns behind the behaviour. It's impossible to deal with when everything seems random and unpredictable (or worse they seem to react to absolutely everything).

He explains that a lot of people assume (as you've seen in this thread) that when kids display difficult behaviour, it's because they are getting something from it (entertainment, their own way, attention, to avoid a situation/task they don't like, etc) and therefore the solution is to punish the behaviour so that it is not rewarding to them. But he says if the child is displaying the behaviour because they don't have the skills to behave in the way you would expect, ie, they can't do anything else, then punishing it is not going to make it go away, in fact it will get worse because now they are anxious about being punished or angry about what they feel is unfair.

So he says look behind the behaviour, find the situation that's triggering it and problem solve that. Crucially, he provides a robust framework to do this in. It's all accessible from free materials. Depending on what suits you best, you can buy the book (The Explosive Child would be the best one for your situation, even though he is not being violent as such - I was put off this for years because I assumed my child was not explosive - now I understand this theory better, he was.) There are also talks on youtube - search Ross Greene Collaborative Problem Solving - and a podcast - search any podcast provider for Ross Greene. There is even a Facebook group called The B Team which will walk you through the entire process if you need more feedback.

The first step is to understand the premise of "kids do well if they can", which I've found the best method is just to have the podcast on when I'm cleaning or whatever, the second is to do an "ALSUP" which involves writing down every single problem you're struggling with even if it goes into a ridiculously long list. The third is to clarify all of those problems and tease out any which are clumped together, fourth identify which is the most urgent to prioritise and then you can start working on them, one at a time.

Thank you @BertieBotts , I will look into that

Ross Greene is great! Seconding that advice!

Totally understandable mate! My kids are literally the same! 8, 6 and 2.5 and they’re literally like wild animals. Just had some family friends have to leave our house because of how loud and ratty my kids were. It’s embarrassing and obnoxious and makes you feel like a crap parent. It’s horrible

OLD THREAD.