Personal boundaries with your kids?

[Undercovva]

What are your personal boundaries with your kids? Mine are 6 and 3 and up until maybe a year ago, I felt persistently exhausted mentally, physically and emotionally.

Having grown up in a dysfunctional family where our lives revolved around alcohol, I have made it my mission to create a wonderful childhood for my kids, to the detriment of myself. I realised this when my friend said to me "so you spent your whole childhood coming bottom of the list and you're going to punish yourself by spending your adulthood doing the same.",

It hit me like a ton of bricks when she put it like that.

My 6 year old had constant control of the remote control whenever we were relaxing at home, our weekends used to be spent doing kid orientated stuff all weekend, every weekend, I was around for every bed time, every school run, my clothes were threadbare whilst they swanned around in higher branded high street clothes that looked beautiful. They never stayed anywhere over night and the youngest was still getting in bed with me each night whilst DH was kicked out into the spare bed.

I've since joined the gym, go to a painting group, get my nails done and have had some moles removed. I do feel better, but still find that my kids are so used to being revolved around that they interrupt my adult conversations and both talk incessantly.

Recently, I have imposed a boundary where they're not allowed to tell long stories when I'm cooking or driving. This is after burning myself a few times and also skipping a red light. I really can't concentrate on 2 things at once. My eldest daughter has a stammer and this goes against all the advice we've been given about giving her space and time to talk whenever she wants it and getting down to her level. It was mentality killing me following this "plan" as I was so drained by it. I feel guilty but it has made such a difference to my mental enjoyment famiy life since saying "is this a time to talk or is mummy needing to concentrate right now?" Sometimes she looks sad when I say it, but I just couldn't go on with it. Her younger sister is similar, also developing a stammer, so I've erected the same boundary early on.

I also find that DH isn't so great with boundaries so will allow them to interrupt/ talk at inappropriate times, lets it go, ignores it and then yells at them. I just think that boundaries are so much better than resorting to that.

Last night, DH and I were trying to watch something on TV at 6pm, the DCs had their toys out before bed time, but instead the 6 YO took to yelling and wailing loudly, climbing all over us and jumping around for attention. They're just not used to not having control of what's on TV... it made me think that a boundary needs to be had here.

What boundaries do other parents have?

Boundaries are difficult for me too I think. My needs weren't listened to in childhood and I sometimes go too far the other way. Other times I enforce pointless boundaries that make us all unhappy, because it's what I was taught was right.

I wondered if there is any neurodivergence in your family? Me and my kids are autistic and your post rang some bells for me. Might help you to be aware of this if it was the case, so you can take that into account when dealing with family life.

Isn't that just what happens when you have kids? They generally come first? Your boundaries sound really odd to me. It's well known that in the car is a really good time for kids to talk as it's not face to face and so not so intense - she's got a stammer fgs. Why don't you just let her chat on while you concentrate on driving or at least put on the radio or an audio book for her so she's not just made to sit in silence feeling rejected. I'm amazed you can't manage a conversation while cooking without burning yourself. And why are your clothes threadbare? It all sounds very odd.

I think your kids becoming aware that it’s not always a good time to talk is good - it’s an essential lesson. They’ll bump into it at school and in friendships, no one likes the kid who interrupts constantly and won’t let other people speak.

Your kids not liking something isn’t a sign you’re being mean.

The question is, what else do you need to happen in order to function better but without seriously impinging on their happiness.

Tal45, just because someone is different to you, doesn't mean it's OK to call them odd. I am autistic and I couldn't concentrate on a conversation while driving or cooking either. You think that's odd - I think you're rude and ableist.

Our boundaries are very inconsistent, that's our problem. I would never watch something on TV that they didn't want to watch, as we just watch TV when they've gone to bed. Partly because it's not worth it. But we have been teaching them not to interrupt, and trying to model that by not interrupting them. They're very happy with that and have responded well. However, I then end up doing that absolutely awful thing of discussing the stress of organising childcare with other parents, which will no doubt make them feel unwanted.
I love their stories, but they know that the primary thing I'm always doing is making sure things are safe. I just ask them to pause sometimes, which they find funny - we make it into a game.

"It's well known that in the car is a really good time for kids to talk as it's not face to face."
Not when you can't concentrate and you're skipping red lights as a result @Tal45
I'm definitely quite noise intolerant @ThisTownAintBigEnoughForBoth as it really impacts my concentration. I have also wondered if my eldest has ADHD.

@tal45 your whole response lacked empathy. You are judging someone off your own needs.

Yes @bowerofbramble this has happened already with my eldest "They’ll bump into it at school and in friendships, no one likes the kid who interrupts constantly and won’t let other people speak."
Her teacher told me that she asks persistent questions in class and in her friendships and that the children sometimes find it overwhelming.

In the car is a good place for kids to talk (IMHO). Do you go back to the conversation later (what did you want to tell me about I the car?)?
Tbh I think 2 adults both trying to watch TV and ignore the kids is unreasonable. Couldn't you watch it when they are in bed?
Have you heard the twee saying about listening to the kids about the little things, because to them they are the big things?
I think self care is important but expecting your kids not to talk to you when cooking or driving, is fairly unreasonable.

I had

-Set bedtimes, bath, story bed… and he stayed there unless ill, cannot get over elongated bedtimes, co sleeping until they are 8 etc…

• Tv, screens strictly monitored and viewed pre agreed items accessed pre agreed games sites

-No rifling through my room, similarly didn’t rifle through his -Books were to be read after washing hands and was strict about not bending spines, curling pages etc ( he was a fairly messy eater for years and I didn’t want library books returned with jammy, yoghurty splodges).

• Ok not to like some food items ( this was accommodated). However, having made those exceptions he was expected to try new foods at least twice. Wouldn’t be given snacks/ new meals if main meals hadn’t at least been tried etc…

-Toys cleared before bedtime into the toy hamper and any Lego creations moved to his room ( we had a tiny living room) he would help when small and tidy up himself as he became older 5 or so -Generally tidy up after himself, help out without grumbling ( I worked full time and was a single parent, was very lucky and faced very little attitude ….)

• Tell me the truth even if it wasn’t great, lived by the mantra ‘ whatever you have done, seen or been involved with I will love you forever, but the best way to get help is for you to tell me the truth, whatever it is we will face it together”. Worked fairly well for teen years, lied to me once was riddled with guilt and confessed, I’d never have found out.

I was an unfashionable parent, fairly firm boundaries, routine, cuddles, shared interest and laughter helped maintain boundaries and ensured I could run my household with love, safety, economic security, and my sanity.

Just wanted to say well done OP for regaining your sanity! My kids know they can talk to me whenever but if I say not now they respect that and dont get upset by it as they know it must be an important reason like needing to concentrate for 5 minutes or needing to make a phonecall :)

I need to set some boundaries as well. Not sure how to get the DC to wait for their turn when others are speaking, that's still work in progress. Same with TV hogging. I do sometimes tell DC that I need some quiet time by myself and they seem to understand and accept that. Money is tight so I'd rather that my DC have good stuff than me, I'm not as active as them and unlikely to grow any taller! But I need to show them that self care is important too and feel like I should model that for them. But with very little money to spend I don't know how to do that really.

"Couldn't you watch it when they are in bed?"
Why @trumpisagit ?
What is this teaching children about resilience? About having to be patient and not always being at the centre of everything and not always enjoying everything in life?

This occured to me a few months ago- I took my eldest daughter food shopping with me and she literally cried with boredom. I had to endure this every Saturday morning throughout my childhood. She's never been made to do much out of her comfort zone at all. And I think this is when they get a shock later on, as teenagers when suddenly, the world doesn't revolve around them anymore. This is when the mental health issues and anxiety kicks in for them because they realise that the world won't always work in their favour.

Dh and I have clear expectations of mummy and daddy time or you don’t interrupt when daddy and mummy are trying to talk, not that our kids are particularly respectful of those boundaries but we try! And we do say stop and think, you can’t think while you’re talking a lot wiht all the endless getting talked at we get (ours are a similar age to yours)
However there is no universe we can be trying to watch something at 6pm, Isnt everyone in the middle of dinner bath story tidy bed then? You can enforce that boundary by limiting tv time generally though, we allow very little.

It sounds a bit as if you're going from one extreme to the other, OP. You definitely need boundaries but things like both parents trying to watch TV at 6pm are really doomed to failure. OTOH if you need quiet for driving and cooking, that's perfectly reasonable as long as it's clear to DC that you do want to hear from them, just not while doing those things.

Interrupting is definitely something they can be learning not to do but it's a process. Impulse control needs to be taught but is also developmental so it's not surprising they sometimes forget.

One rule I remember from my own childhood was “if adults are speaking to each other, don’t interrupt.” Instead I used to come up to where they were and wait - they’d finish their sentence or whatever and say “Bramble, what’s up?”

Worked fine and I reeeeaally noticed (and found annoying) the kids of my own age who hadn’t been taught that.

I don’t think it’s realistic for you and your dh to be watching tv with a 6 and 3 year old and expect them to be quiet. What did you want them to do? As they get a bit older they might be able to play quietly by themselves but I doubt it would last long enough to watch a whole programme. Teatime/6 pm is the prime time for climbing all over you if you’re sitting around all together in the same room.

I think your expectations are too high. I wouldn't try to watch an adult programme on tv at 6pm while my young children are still up and playing. That's not me having no boundaries, it's just recognising that when little kids are around I'm going to be constantly needed for this and that and there's no point expecting undisturbed adult time.

Boundaries in our house have always been:

Bed time at X o clock. Unless you're dying/vomiting or similar, you're to stay in your bedroom. You can read til 1am for all I care, but after X o clock you need to be in your room

Result: 2 kids that both read a lot, never get into our bed, and never have after about 2years old (I'd have taken a sick child to the sofa) and know if they need us in the night we'll be there in a shot and take it seriously.

Don't interrupt anyone when they're talking unless it's an emergency -

Result: eldest is great. Youngest is getting there. She's impulsive and tries, she gets lots of warnings but she's getting there. And apparently this doesn't happen at school....

Chores - do them. We're a family. I'm not a maid. You get flexibility e.g. if you've got a big event on a Saturday, you can do the rabbits Friday/Sunday.

Result: 2 super helpful kids, who know the importance of respecting their belongings and working as a team.

TV: don't interrupt someone's TV viewing. Of an evening we all watch TV together, and we watch one show that everyone watches and alternate between the kids for the other show.

Result: no TV viewing issues. Even if it's midday on a Saturday, and DH and I are watching the news.

I've strong, strong, boundaries. But the girls know where they can push and flex. They also know how to approach us for a discussion on changing them, e.g. bed times.

A child that feels heard, feels secure. a secure child is a happy child.

Yeah I agree it's a bit all or nothing, but you'll get to a balance eventually.

6pm kids are getting tired and a bit fractious and I'd be amazed if they had the resources to entertain themselves for half an hour in that state. I'd have probably recorded the show and watched it after bed time, or watched it when it was on but expected an element of clambering. They're very little still.

Remember it's healthy for kids to have boundaries, it's healthy that you have 'adult in charge time' such as a few hours watching what you want, it's good to teach your dc not to interrupt, it teaches them manners. It's not a bad thing at all. It's also completely normal for dc to interrupt and do all the things you've said, my 14 year old goes in phases with this. But a simple 'I'm talking, just a minute' will normally suffice.

personally the way you describe their talking - their long stories, your poor daughters with a stammer - you sound awful sorry OP - you are reproducing your childhood of not being listened too and putting it on your own children. Fair enough make them aware of not interrupting when you are talking but curbing their enthusiasm for long stories etc just sounds cruel IMO

curbing their enthusiasm for long stories etc just sounds cruel

I don't 100% agree with this. OP has a difficult balance to strike between enjoying/encouraging talking with her kids, and concentrating when she needs to / getting them to stop being a wall of sound. All parents have to sort this and some find it natural, OP clearly finds it trickier. ALL parents I know with talkative children have to find a way to stop them doing the long stories sometimes, they're just not appropriate in every circumstance! Surely we've all met the kid who is introduced to you and then starts a 10 minute ramble about their friend at school/favourite game etc. It's totally normal & not cruel IMO to say "that's great, X, but I think I/gran/Auntie Sue has heard enough about XYZ for now".

Good for you OP. I think all of this sounds absolutely fine and good for both you and the kids, with the possible exception of trying to watch something adult at 6pm. I wouldn't try and put a drama on that you need to concentrate on. I think it's good to not have children's TV on at this time but I would put something on that is for adults but that you can dip in and out of or that your kids could enjoy if they broadened their horizons. Something like Lego Masters, Ninja Warrior, GBBO, "family" shows as it were.

But broadly speaking I think it's fantastic that you've stopped martyring yourself.

I think you're totally right to start imposing some boundaries or, as I would view it, prioritising things for yourself.

However, it does sound like you've gone a bit far the other way. Teaching your children not to interrupt when others are talking = good; expecting children close to bedtime to be calm and quiet while you and your DH watch something on TV and ignore them = unrealistic.

Similarly, if you need to concentrate in the car, absolutely, that's fine. But do you make it clear that you can and will pick up the conversation later? I have to tell the DC to please be quiet while I'm driving sometimes. But then, once we're out of whatever tricky bit I needed all my focus for, I then return to the conversation. Also, if they ARE talking and you're okay with it, at that age, it's completely unfair to rush them etc. Especially if they have some speech and language issues.

Broadly, it's one thing to prioritise giving yourself a break but I'd argue that mostly that's done outside of where the children are (at this age). And it's a huge reason why DH and I have often done a lot of divide and conquer - he has kids while I do the shopping in peace (and get a coffee), or he takes DS and I take DD to different activities to reduce the mental craziness.