How to deal with rude people on public transport with a Baby

[Mummy31x]

I never learnt to drive when younger, live 5 mins from town and everything was accessible on foot or taxi easily. Before having a baby I realised that having a car is essential so booked and paid for lessons but only after 2 lessons there was covid lockdown.

I'm trying to learn now but there's a massive wait and will take time. So basically now I have to rely on public transport. Ive always used taxis in recent years but with a buggy I find it bit difficult, getting it out from the back of the taxi, assembling it again whilst holding the baby and other bags especially when getting dropped somewhere busy.

So Ive been using buses and 100% of the time I've come across rude people!

People who are sat where the buggy is supposed to go and aren't happy to move even when there's plenty of other seats. When they move they keep giving me dirty looks.

There are people who are sat in the seats right next to the buggy space and don't move. They aren't elderly or with luggage either. I dont have it in me to say can you move please (I have social anxiety and barely manage to get on the bus with people and don't wana get in conflict). I don't mind standing but on a longer journey where bus keeps stopping I feel like I'm in the way when standing. And it does bother me that why aren't they moving when they can see its causing someone difficulty and there's plenty seats.

I try to go out on times when I think bus will be nearly empty. Other day I got on the bus and another buggy came which there was enough space for both and it was fine. Then there was a driver change and he let 2 more buggies on. I moved my buggy to give them space and had to stand. Beacuse there was a woman sat on 1st seats next to the buggy area and had her bag on the other seat which she only moved for some man a while later.

So now there was 4 buggies and people who were getting on the bus had to go sideways to move down the bus so I had to say sorry to couple of people as I was standing. After a few stops the bus driver stopped the bus and looked at me out of all the other people with buggies and shouted that I need to rearrange the buggy or move it as people are having difficulty. I already feel anxious around people and his tone was so horrible. The first time I lost my patience and thought to myself I have to say something. I was so frustrated because he was the one who kept letting more people on with buggies. I was the 1st there and I was only one stood up after trying to be helpful. These other women (I'm not a racist, I'm not originally from England myself but im not rude. Them on the other hand didn't say thanks or acknowledge what the driver was saying, on top of it they just kept staring at me). I said to him there's no space beacuse you let more buggies on. He didnt like that and said well 1 of them can get off meaning me and goes there's no need for the attitude. I said there's nowhere I can possibly move my buggy and why would I get off. Meanwhile some random woman on the bus goes why don't u collapse ur buggy and make it easy for everyone else which made me even more angry because it was not her business why was she picking on me. Also how can I do that with a young baby with nowhere to sit then reassemble the buggy before getting off and why don't any1 else do that if necessary whose kids are bit older and can sit on a seat. Anyway he drove off and i felt like everyone was just looking at me. At every stop he would tell people sorry can't let u on "too many things on the bus already". Then he let some people on and kept apologising to them and they kept moaning. I felt so uncomfortable and miserable that I decided to get off the bus way before my stop.

I am now scared to get on the buses and its made my anxiety even worse. It can't just be me who thinks people are so rude on buses.

I do wonder perhaps if it’s you that maybe needs to change the way you are doing things. If it’s happening to you 100%.

The waiting lists for driving tests are frightening!

I used an umbrella style buggy that you could clip a car seat into. If I needed to fold the buggy I would unclip the car seat and sit with it (plus baby obviously) on my lap.
This was 13 years ago though and this type of travel system was more common where now you hardly see them. It's unpopular now for recommended safety reasons which obviously does makes sense.

The rules for using buses with a buggy are pretty clear. You have to fold it if requested by the driver and/or if a wheelchair user needs the space. If you can't do that, you need to use a sling, or get off.

Had all my DC in London and took the bus all.tnr time. I used a sling. Or when older, I folded when I needed to.

You just have to suck it up, ask people to move and remember its only for a little while.

We have to do it all the time for people using facilities for wheelchair users. And she'll have to do it forever.

In my area of Scotland, you aren’t allowed on the bus unless your buggy is folded down.

I try to park the buggy in the area with fold down seats not area opposite intended for wheelchairs incase one wanted to get on and I know that wheelchair users get priority. But when there's no wheelchairs on the bus, people park the buggies wherever the space is. I don't understand some people mentioning wheelchairs because my post isn't about that. The bus had no wheelchair users and none tried to get on.

It's about people who are able to sit anywhere as they aren't elderly or with luggage. When bus is empty they can sit wherever but they get funny soon as they see a buggy as they have to make the effort to get up and find another seat on a bus with plenty seats.

Ive had buses not stopping and drivers telling me sorry no space which is fine. But this bus driver was shouting at me when he didn't realize himself that it would be difficult for people to get on the bus when he let more buggies on. Folded or not it still would have been awkward beacuse the area was fully crammed. Coz of Covid they've also taped the area where people used to put luggage/shopping bags etc. I was the only one stood up beacuse i moved to let 1 buggy park where I was sat.

Someone whose suggesting maybe I'm the problem, no im not! The problem is people's attitude towards women with buggies. Problem is general lack of kindness.

Also i can't imagine getting on a bus with total strangers and ask someone to hold my baby. I can't expect the bus driver either to come out of his/her cabin area and do that. Only time they do that is to pull the ramp to let a wheelchair user get on the bus.

People suggesting a sling thanks I will look into it and in the future be prepared in advance to have the buggy folded up.

I'd look into a sling

people that are saying you should fold your buggy aren't realising how unrealistic that is.

It’s not unrealistic at all - hence the number of people who say they do and did fold their buggies. The problem is that people now expect to get on the bus with an unfolded buggy. Not needing to fold the buggy is a bonus- ie, no wheelchair user needs the space, or the bus isn’t very busy. Then you can travel with an unfolded buggy.

I don't understand some people mentioning wheelchairs because my post isn't about that. The bus had no wheelchair users and none tried to get on.

The point is that the spaces on buses people treat as "buggy spaces" are nearly always actually wheelchair spaces, and that in most bus systems, you should not get on a bus unless you are willing and able to either fold your buggy, or get off, if there is no longer space for it due to either a wheelchair user boarding or the space simply being needed. Drivers generally aren't supposed to let more than 2 buggies on, but if they do you either have to negotiate all being out of the aisle, fold, or get off. You can't just block the aisle.

I didn't think there were buggy spaces just wheelchair spaces that buggies use if no wheelchairs were on the bus.

Our buses have both.

Where I live you are only allowed two buggies per bus, if there's two buggies already on you need to fold yours or wait for the next bus. Occasionally the driver will break the rules and let more buggies on, if you got on first and got an official buggy spot DO NOT MOVE - if an Inspector stops the bus a few stops along the people on the official two buggy spots get to stay on, the buggies in the wrong place get thrown off and the driver gets a telling off! Yes the extra buggies block the isle, yes people can't get on and off and the old people start moaning about it but just remember you got on first and your buggy is parked in the right place. If you are one of the extra buggies just count yourself lucky that you were allowed on (my buses are every 30 minutes so it's a long wait if you don't get on). Don't take it personally, when you get off the bus you won't see any of those people again. Do your buggy handles fold inwards? I find that leaves more space to budge up/stops you sticking out in the isle. I always stand next to my buggy, the seats next to the buggy space are for old/disabled people and I am neither. Also if the bus was to emergency brake I'd want a hand on my buggy.

OP you may want to consider getting this thread deleted.
I empathise entirely with you - I dread thinking back to using buses with a buggy, other people were so rude. I ended up avoiding buses as much as possible. The idea of folding a buggy is just bonkers, my buggy had things in it, hanging off it, I had a bag or backpack - the idea of taking everything out, including THE BABY, and holding it all (totally impossible) and then managing a folded buggy, is absolutely absurd.
HOWEVER, mumsnet seems bizarrely anti-buggies-on-buses, full of users who all somehow miraculously managed stuff/bags/baby/folded buggy, so you'll only get criticism from most people on here. Save yourself this aggro OP - and good luck on the buses, please try to ignore the rude people, there and here.

@chineybumps

I live in South West London and my DD is 8 months old. I'm not sure how old your DC is but people that are saying you should fold your buggy aren't realising how unrealistic that is. As long as there's not a wheelchair on the bus, why would you fold your buggy up? People are already not getting up for the OP so where do you suggest she puts her folded buggy and where should she sit with DC? (bearing in mind she'll have to be in close proximity to the buggy).

I sometimes feel the same OP but luckily I don't have any anxiety and I'm very quick to speak up. If I'm only on the bus for a short amount of time, I'll stand near the buggy if someone is in the seats next to the buggy area. Sometimes people are kind and will offer the seat to me or take their bags/shopping bags off the seat so I can sit down.
I'm not sure where you're based but in London, the 'priority seat' stickers are placed near the buggy area. I'm now pregnant with my second so if someone's sitting there and I have a long way to go, I'll politely ask if I can have the seat. No one has ever objected. People have always happily given away the seat and have gone to sit somewhere else.

As for the driver letting other buggies on the bus. There was a situation where my buggy was on first, another buggy came on after me and then a couple of stops later, the driver let a third buggy on. Because it was rush hour I never saw the third buggy come on as I usually let them know there's already two buggies on. Of course the driver had a moan and said the third buggy was in the way (as she was just in the middle of the aisle because she had nowhere else to go). I said to the driver he shouldn't have left anymore buggies on where there were already two on board.

I'm not sure about the comments but it's not realistic to just fold your buggy up, especially if you have a young baby and/or shopping.
When being a parent you definitely have to learn how to speak up and just ignore any nasty looks or comments. Maybe work on your anxiety first but I wouldn't let the bus situation get to me. People are rude/inconsiderate and it just is what it is🤷‍♀️

Thankyou for understanding! I'm not based in London. The bus route I take has lots of schools/nurseries and usually has 1 or 2 buggies on. Most bus drivers usually don't let more on. I don't see any1 with folded buggy at all and didn't think about folding mine. If there's no space I just stand.

You're right it's not easy to fold the buggy and keep the baby safe whislt managing any bags. The bus drivers don't exactly wait that long either and get funny if someone's taking a long time to get sorted because it causes delays. You're also right I need to work on my anxiety.

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER

TBH if you’re using buses a lot, you need to get an umbrella type buggy that folds up very quickly and easily. Even if you don’t need to fold it, , two of those will usually fit in buggy spaces on buses, whereas the much bigger, expensive jobs that are popular now, will usually take up so much space, there’s no room for another.

This is good advice. Umbrella buggies, even double ones, fold much more easily.

Sounds horrendous. I feel for you. You're not an octopus. Folding a buggy down with bags and shopping attached and holding a baby and then putting it all back together again safely on a busy bus is near impossible. If I was you, I would either use a sling or avoid the bus for now.

I feel for you it does sound like people were being rude to you... I understand what its like with a newborn when it's your first... its easy to collapse a buggy for an older child but it is not easy to take apart a pram.. particularly if its your first baby and you arent used to it. I used to also be afraid of standing up on the bus clothing my newborn in case I fell etc.. and of course how do you even take apart the pram whilst holding the newborn at the same time?

Really going forward you need to get a sling or an easily collapsible stroller... it does get easier as you get more used to it. With my second I could take apart the pram with one hand!

It does wind me up how mean people are to new mums sometimes.. someone absolutely should have suggested you take their seat and tried to help you... I would offer to hold your baby whilst you took apart the pram and then given you my seat...

Umbrella fold buggy which you can fold and unfold single handed. Its what most of us have used.

They come in twin versions as well.

Hand the baby to the driver while you fold the buggy

Even pre covid that was never a thing anyone would do. Ditto 20 years ago when my two were little.

I use to practice one handed folding the buggy whilst also holding baby at home. Not easy but doable if you choose the right buggy. Yes slings are useful but not all that practical on a longer outing/if you need to buy stuff.

Nobody waits for you to fold a buggy these days and IME a lot of buggies are just as bulky when folded so not much help.

That said I've never had any problem taking any of my 3 DC on buses in buggies, in 2 different places and with approx 4-5 different buggy types in total.

You do have to be a bit assertive in asking people to move and a bit thick skinned in not being bothered by arsey looks. Obviously wheelchair users take priority.

If somebody is sitting in the space, you just need to say "Excuse me please" with a smile. Then you won't get the bus driver shouting at you to move/rearrange the buggy.

You are lucky if they let 3-4 on at once, in most places the max they will let on is 2. When you have more you need to adopt a kind of "This is fun, buggy tetris!" kind of jokey demeanour and people will work with you.

@FKATondelayo

I actually think the NCT should do an antenatal course on 'managing public transport with a buggy' - much more useful than breathing exercises and talking about dilation.

Yeah I kind of agree with that!

I waited years before taking the bus when mine were young because I was very anxious about it and didn't know how it worked. In the end a very nice friend came with me and gave me a hand and after that I felt confident enough to do it in my own.

Some people are awkward and inexperienced with things like this or just with day to day life in general and it's no good just saying try CBT!!

@humblesims

I think the OP is getting a hard time here. It's not easy travelling with a small baby and a buggy on public transport if you are not used to it (or some sort of super juggling woman-human as so many mumsnetters apparently seem to be). It is tough on public transport but other passengers and drivers and mothers and non super woman-human jugglers should perhaps be a but fucking kinder. Yet again mothers have to bend over backwards to accommodate the selfish attitudes of others.

Absolutely. Add to that being shy and self conscious and it's a horrible experience.

@Mummy31x

I try to park the buggy in the area with fold down seats not area opposite intended for wheelchairs incase one wanted to get on and I know that wheelchair users get priority. But when there's no wheelchairs on the bus, people park the buggies wherever the space is. I don't understand some people mentioning wheelchairs because my post isn't about that. The bus had no wheelchair users and none tried to get on.

It's about people who are able to sit anywhere as they aren't elderly or with luggage. When bus is empty they can sit wherever but they get funny soon as they see a buggy as they have to make the effort to get up and find another seat on a bus with plenty seats.

Ive had buses not stopping and drivers telling me sorry no space which is fine. But this bus driver was shouting at me when he didn't realize himself that it would be difficult for people to get on the bus when he let more buggies on. Folded or not it still would have been awkward beacuse the area was fully crammed. Coz of Covid they've also taped the area where people used to put luggage/shopping bags etc. I was the only one stood up beacuse i moved to let 1 buggy park where I was sat.

Someone whose suggesting maybe I'm the problem, no im not! The problem is people's attitude towards women with buggies. Problem is general lack of kindness.

Also i can't imagine getting on a bus with total strangers and ask someone to hold my baby. I can't expect the bus driver either to come out of his/her cabin area and do that. Only time they do that is to pull the ramp to let a wheelchair user get on the bus.

People suggesting a sling thanks I will look into it and in the future be prepared in advance to have the buggy folded up.

I'd look into a sling

Funny how you say people who aren't disabled etc can sit in another seat. Those seats behind the buggy area aren't prioritised to those standing with buggy's. You are in a STANDING area and don't automatically get entitlement to those nearby seats. Just like those with bikes would have to stand up with them.

Coincidentally I've been on a tube heavily pregnant and the priority seat has been taken up by a woman who wanted to sit down next to her pram which was in the cut-out pram section of the tube.

@Thesearmsofmine

Non driver with 3dc here. A sling is the easiest option on public transport,

Agreed. My DS is 2 and we still use a sling on public transport to avoid these very issues (and the associated anxiety).

@ZoeTheThornyDevil

I don't understand some people mentioning wheelchairs because my post isn't about that. The bus had no wheelchair users and none tried to get on.

The point is that the spaces on buses people treat as "buggy spaces" are nearly always actually wheelchair spaces, and that in most bus systems, you should not get on a bus unless you are willing and able to either fold your buggy, or get off, if there is no longer space for it due to either a wheelchair user boarding or the space simply being needed. Drivers generally aren't supposed to let more than 2 buggies on, but if they do you either have to negotiate all being out of the aisle, fold, or get off. You can't just block the aisle.

Our buses have both its not just wheelchair user space. You're not making sense going on about something that's not relevant. Bus drivers where I live don't ask to fold the buggy they tell people to wait for next bus when there's no space. I DIDNT need to fold my buggy as I was the only one there at 1st with the bus pretty much empty. Later on it wasn't possible to do so even if I wanted to. And again NO wheelchair user got on hence no need for me to get off to give the space.

I wasn't blocking the Isle either, the people were still able to get on. I even said sorry to be polite as they walked past.

As far as blocking the Isle where do u live? Doesn't matter have u never seen or been on a bus during rush hour with loads of people standing in the bus completely blocking the whole Isle? It's pretty normal and no1 needs to get off as everyone has paid and needs to get home.

@LalalalalalaLand123 you're right some people are just critics even when there's no need. They seem to have perfectly boarded buses with no issues with their perfectly folded buggies.

The problem is that modern buggies are badly designed. They’re enormous and don’t fold easily. Lightweight umbrella-fold buggies, which is what I had, are much easier for folding and carrying one-handed, hopping on and off buses, tubes and trains. They’re sometimes not great for very young babies if they don’t fold flat, though, which is why a sling is better in the very early weeks and months.