Really finding 4 year old very difficult. Breaking point

[Heartofstrings]

I don't even know where to start. I hate him as much as I love him right now. I'm grieving for what I thought having him would be.

He's violent, impulsive, doesn't follow instructions, hurts his little brother, hurts me, doesn't play "properly". He pooed on his bed today. He's pooed on the table and also on the laminate floor (floor needed pulling up as it went in the cracks...it WAS quite old though). He doesnt sleep through. Finds it hard to drop off so we have to sit with him. If we leave him he escalates his behaviour and is very very distressed.
He rarely gives cuddles. Doesnt like kisses. Doesn't like singing. Music he likes if it meets his approval.
He pulls his hair out in chunks.

Yesterday at my mums was just awful. My husband spent his whole time trying to stop him destroying the place.

I cant even have a conversation on the phone while I have him or leave him and his brother alone unattended to put the washing away.

I'm a wreck. We are entitled to 15h preschool finding and if they close I don't know what I'll do. I didn't imagine life would be like this. I'm worn down and tired.

Ps he's actually 4 in 2 weeks

Honestly? I think you would be wise to visit your GP and request a referral to a paediatrician. Sounds like there’s more going on for your son

He sounds as though he needs help. Have you spoken to your gp about him? There is being boisterous and testing boundaries but this sounds far beyond that.

I have a 3yo who I refer to as a threenager, out of my 3 DCs she is a nightmare but noting compared to your DS. What have nursery said about his behaviour?

I agree with the PPs that this sounds like there’s more to it.

Your DS sounds like my friend’s son, but even more challenging.

I won’t diagnose over the internet, but I think you need to find a way to get some professional support, as this isn’t sustainable for you as it is.

Nobody can diagnose anything here but I would say get a break,get some support for yourself.The pandemic has made everything pretty awfulmHas he always been like this....are some times better than others. Could you calmly keep a very basic diary for a week to help see any patterns?

You need to seek professional help. I would start with GP, look for referral to Paediatrician and also Psychologist. Your son sounds like he needs some extra help, and it will likely get easier for all of you once he has it.

Have you spoken to anyone else about him, HV, GP, nursery etc? There more going on here and it’s likely nothing whatsoever to do with your parenting.

He has a paediatrician. We have an autism questionnaire to fill in. But preschool say they have no issues. The paediatrician is 50/50 as to whether we should be doing the assessment as he's still so young.

I'm in tears. Today I just really wish I never had him.

Dh has just gone upstairs. He's at the end of his tether also. He needed to walk away rather than get angry.

Time out doesnt work. Telling him off doesnt work. Removing toys doesnt work. He doesnt give a shit about any of it.

And my 2 year old is 3 in 3 weeks and turning in to a proper three year old. Amusing but testing. You know, the usual like refusing to eat dinner

I agree with the others about you needing specialist support. It maybe worth posting again on the SEN board.

Do the autism questionnaire. At nearly 4 he isn't too young at all so I would think about maybe getting another opinion?
Maybe try visual schedule and routine. If it is autism then having a very clear routine that he knows happens every day may help his behaviour. Keep a diary (as pp) said so you can see if there is anything in particular that sets him off. Also, google the coke can analogy.
All ideas from my own experience with likely ASD (awaiting daignosis) child. May not help but hopefully may do.
Sorry you're having a tough time. It will get better I'm sure.

The only experience I can offer is my own. Our eldest had ADHD, and we found it extremely hard at times.....

The only thing that helped us stay sane was a very strict sleep routine. We banned screens after 4pm, and had a military routine of bath, stories, quiet time then settling in bed. She loved audio books, so those helped her settle enormously on evenings where her brain was still running at 100 miles an hour. And never stay in their room - we had a stairgate (one of the tall ones meant for dogs) across their room and just keep taking them back to bed with zero interaction (like Supernanny).

Being a parent can be really shit at times - don't be afraid to keep pushing for professional help

Have you tried putting into place the strategies you would use with an autistic pre-schooler? They won't do any harm at all if he isn't.

Rock solid routine.
Picture schedule for each day/ activity.
Support for communication if he needs it (pictures for choices etc).
Low arousal home environment.
Tonnes and tonnes of exercise.
Sensory diet if you can work out what works (the 'right' music, the 'right' clothes, swinging-if he likes it- etc).

But most of all, routine, routine, routine.

@Heartofstrings

He has a paediatrician. We have an autism questionnaire to fill in. But preschool say they have no issues. The paediatrician is 50/50 as to whether we should be doing the assessment as he's still so young.

I'm in tears. Today I just really wish I never had him.

Dh has just gone upstairs. He's at the end of his tether also. He needed to walk away rather than get angry.

Time out doesnt work. Telling him off doesnt work. Removing toys doesnt work. He doesnt give a shit about any of it.

You need to push the assessment. You also need to change your mindset about him not giving a shit about it. Behaviour is a response to something and at his age it isn’t usually a choice. If he is autistic - and he does sound like it to me - you will need to come to terms with the fact that he will need to be parented in a different way to what you thought you would parent him. You have to try and see his world through his eyes rather than him trying to see it though yours. Christmas (and birthdays and parties in general) can be an absolute nightmare for children with autism. It’s a massive overload to the senses. Everything is over stimulating which is why people with ASD can spiral into uncontrollable behaviours. Try to read up on sensory overload and how to reduce it in small children. Here’s a link to start you off. www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/topics/diagnosis/post-diagnosis-support/parents-and-carers He may not be autistic in the end, but he’s clearly struggling, so getting some support will be helpful.

@reefedsail

Have you tried putting into place the strategies you would use with an autistic pre-schooler? They won't do any harm at all if he isn't.

Rock solid routine.
Picture schedule for each day/ activity.
Support for communication if he needs it (pictures for choices etc).
Low arousal home environment.
Tonnes and tonnes of exercise.
Sensory diet if you can work out what works (the 'right' music, the 'right' clothes, swinging-if he likes it- etc).

But most of all, routine, routine, routine.

I was going today this too. It sounds like you’re stuck in a really transitional phase of not yet having any diagnosis (although may not be the case for LO) and therefore not at a point of using some of the tried and tested strategies which could make life a little easier. Be gentle with yourselves, sounds really tough especially with everything going on.

There is a lot going on here so and look after yourself...
Some of this is within the realms of normal 4 year old, some not so much.
Practical things which might help you for the next few days if you have DH around;
Shift parent with DH for a few days, he does 2 hours with them both then you do the same.
Get some rest where you can
Establish a plan for night time and stick to it like glue

FWIW I wouldn’t expect to have have been able to leave my 2 DS alone at all at that age, never mind making a phone call. The ERIC charity are really excellent help for dealing with continence type issues and will call back. Whatever his ultimate diagnosis may be you need support because it sounds hard, hope you’ve got people around who can offer that.

Dh is just as emotionally ground down as i am. We both split childcare.

I just can't stop.crying tonight. Christmas has been just so so shit. On christmas eve my father in law.asked why ds has to ruin everything. I'm so pissed off with him but also so devastated because it's true.

I just don't have the skills to deal with a child like this. My friends talk about their kids being cheeky and sassy and rude. I just have to try to stop him shutting everywhere and injuring his brother

He's not too young for an ASD diagnosis. I have an 8yo autistic DS and he goes through so many phases, some harder than others. I know how difficult it can be but not only is he very young, during which stage most children push boundaries, it really sounds as though he may have additional needs, despite what his nursery workers say.

I think there are additional needs there. Lockdown hasnt helped. We are exhausted from parenting him and trying to work that we rely on screens and that hasnt helped. I don't know how to get out of it. My work hours will only increase in jan

You do have the skills you just need someone to show you. You are understandably exhausted but with the right help, you can do this. It can be better.

Your father in law shouldn't have said that. My son screamed down the house at in laws yesterday. Only comment he got was "poor kid, he's overwhelmed by Christmas, it's a lot for the little ones". And they don't know we're going through diagnosis.

I know it's hard to see the wood for the trees but the first steps I would take are
-assessment

• routine. Routine.

See what happens then?

Definitely not too young for an autism assessment at nearly 4. Surprised the paed even said that.

Look up the demand avoidant profile of autism/pathological demand avoidance. That might resonate.

If he has ASD - as it sounds like he might, coming from someone whose son was diagnosed at 3- Christmas can be an awful time for someone with autism. Lack of routine, noisy, flashing lights, sensory overload etc. This can lead to huge meltdowns if not calmed down from the get go. We have had many a Christmas where our son wanted to sit on the steps and eat tuna sandwiches away from everyone else as he hates Christmas (he’s now 9). You have to do whatever makes them happy as that will make you happier long term, especially at Christmas.

I agree with the others re pecs cards (you can get some sets from Amazon), routine etc etc. Often children with autism are calmer at school as it’s the same thing day in day out.

Routine. I can do routine..husband has them a fair bit because of work. I'm not sure how he will do. I know he will try his best. Ds is more challenging for dh than for me

He has good basic communication. There's nothing wrong with his vocabulary. I could probably argue that he isnt great at expressing himself or having conversations but he can express his basic needs. It's the self regulation skills that are seriously lacking.

We are sending him to a new preschool from jan. He was at a quiet, calm montesorri but we are throwing him into a regular preschool. Hoping to either cure him or kill him. It may help our cause for support before he starts school in September

We are in a very similar position and the advice on this thread is excellent. You need to tell your paed about what has gone on at Christmas and further assessment may lead to getting you further support. At 4y Christmas can be so overwhelming for any child and parent.
With our poo accidents we reinforce that should go in toilet by scooping it up and letting DS flush.
I wouldn’t be happy with what FIL said he might affect your sons day.

What's his diet like? My son is 5 and his diet needs to be pretty much perfect (very low sugar, veg, fruit, protein, almost no processed foods, vitamins, magnesium etc) to keep him in check. He also has to have a good hour or 2, at least, of outdoor exercise daily in order to sleep and behave. And very little screen time. I have to work pretty hard to keep on top of it and if we slip say over holidays or because I'm ill or whatever then we certainly pay for it.

He also needs visual reward charts, strong routines, and we implement a lot of the strategies in books like 'Calmer, Easier, Happier Boys'

He is well above average intelligence, exceeding on all levels at school and no signs of any disorders, just bloody hard work

I really feel for you. It's so bloody hard!