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Parenting

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Original poster

My friend's 2.5 toddler hit my 1.5 toddler on the head, and was told it was "OK, because it wasn't a hard ball"!!

91 replies

Woollymummy · 08/09/2007 20:00

I want to know what you think....is it OK for me to give her some advice, or share my worries for her little boy. My feeling is he will get his head kicked in, or worse, one day because he hasn't been shown the correct boundaries. My little girl was shocked and scared, he thought it was funny, he practises hitting his sisiter regularly and as far as I can see is allowed to get away with it. I don't know what to do, I am scared for him and his mum, dad and sister, as he is obviously annoying them and yet nothing is being done about the situation.

What should I do? I want to email her, can't quite gather my courage to put a phone conversation that direction, and cannot talk to her when visiting as the kids would be there. Help!!

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Seona1973 · 08/09/2007 20:15

I dont know if I'd offer advice but if it was my toddler that had been hit I would have told the other child off regardless of whether their parents did (or not!)

potoftea · 08/09/2007 20:17

I don't think you should make a big deal out of this incident, but be prepared in future to reprimand him if he hits you or your dc. Make it clear that you will not accept that behaviour, and if your friend says anything just causually say how you are trying to show your child that hitting is naughty.

Sekator · 08/09/2007 20:19

Could she have meant 'it's ok, your child wasn't hurt because it's only a soft ball"?
I have said things like that out of relief that ds hasn't actually hurt a child, in that situation.
It does not mean It hink it's ok for ds to do it.

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gess · 08/09/2007 20:22

he's 2.5, a baby himself, I doubt he meant to hit your ds on the head with a ball.

DS3 (2.5) sometimes hits us on purpose in which case he gets told off and given a very short time out if he continues, but if he hit someone with a ball I'd assume it was an accident and tell him to 'be careful' but I wouldn't tell him off.

Original poster

Woollymummy · 08/09/2007 20:35

The little boy knew what he was doing, his dad had just explained to him that "It's OK to hit people over the head with soft balls, but not with hard balls" - it was actually one of those ball-pool balls, so what with the strength of his fast-moving arm, I would say it was quite hard. This bit of parenting itself makes me angry! I actually think it is NOT ok to teach your child that it is alright to hit people for fun.

I guess what I did was the right thing at the time, I explained that my daughter still has a soft top to her head, that you shouldn't hit people at all, and then I removed my daughter to another room, saying we might have to go if he kept hitting her.

The back-story on this is that whenever I meet the children, he his hitting his sister or someone else. He systematically worked his way down the garden full of his friends, starting off hitting with his hands, then a spade, a ball, then finally a set of wind-chimes (metal, roughly the size of a recorder!!!) His mum had a word with him each time, asked him to say sorry, but never removed him, or actually stopped him doing it again, or showed him that it was the wrong thing to do. To be honest, no-one steps in because we all probably sympathise with what she must feel like, don't want to upset, interfere etc, but I really want to help and see a change in his behaviour, for all their sakes. He is asking for attention, he has boundless enegy, but that kind of behaviour will eventually become entrenched. I worry for his sister, she is obviously coping, but must be stressed and altered in some way by having to live with it.

OP posts:

WaynettaVonSlob · 08/09/2007 20:39

A ball pool ball you say? Hardly going to cause a fractured skull is it?
As for boundaries etc - that's their worry, not yours.
Am I to presume this is your first? Trust me, in about 6 months time you'll be glad when you hear its your toddler who has been hit, and is not doing the hitting.

Sekator · 08/09/2007 20:39

I agree that it's not a good message to give a child who clearly likes hitting! Or any child.
I guess it would be interesting to find out what their strategy is. It may be that they have a long-term strategy and they think this is ok - at least if you know that's what it is, you can decide not to be with them until they've worked out whatever it is they're doing.
I've got a ds who is hell-bent on violence and it's not as simple as removing him every time etc. Mind you at 2.5 it might be - mine's a bit older and I've blanked that bit of his development out of my mind [weary]

TheArmadillo · 08/09/2007 20:41

tbh if he was 2.5 your explanation was too detailed and would have gone over his head.

Many children go through phases of hitting - his parents are dealing with it in the way they think best.

Right you were annoyed as you felt he wasn't told off by his parents? How soon before you told him off?

If their parenting style clashes with yours then you have a problem, but you are projecting thoughts of what he will be like in the future on very little. He's still very young. Give him a break.

tribpot · 08/09/2007 20:42

I had recent experience of this, first with a 2.6 yo who was staying with us (with his mum) and didn't speak English. He regularly had a go at my ds (just 2 at the time) and my ds was very upset. I sent him to his mum to be told off in Swedish each time and bit my tongue as they were our guests and no real harm was done.

After that experience, I vowed that - unless the parents had a real issue about other people disciplining their children, I was going to speak up. Fast forward two months and we went to stay with my bro, SIL and their 3 little boys, two of whom are older than ds, one is younger.

The younger one was, quite frankly, an effing nightmare. At one point he got hold of one of ds' cars and threw it at point blank range at his head. I'm sure my bro was a bit like "what the HELL" but I didn't even wait to see if he would discipline him (which of course he did), I immediately said "dnephew we DO NOT do that!".

You're quite right. There's no point saying "it's alright to hit with a soft ball" like a child can understand that distinction. It is not alright to hit with any ball, end of.

gess · 08/09/2007 20:44

At 2.5 he's not going to understand. If you have a 1.5 year old who is your first then 2.5 will seem huge and grown up- it's not he's a baby. I wouldn't worry much about a ball pool ball being thrown (think they're meant to be really). tSometimes when children have a throwing heavy items thing going on, one of the suggestions is redirection to things they are allowed to throw. Must say I think that redirection is hard to put into practice but its the sort of thing that clinical psychs etc suggest so maybe its been suggested to them by the HV or something.

I doubt his sister is that traumatised. DS2 and ds3 have grown up around some very odd behaviour with a severely autistic eldest brother. They don't bat an eyelid. Sometimes they copied him until they went off to nursery when more typical behaviour replaced it.

gess · 08/09/2007 20:46

I think there's going to be a difference here depending on how many children people have. When ds1 was small I was scared of other children hurting him. DS3 just threw himself into any crowds of children he could find and came out laughing. I intervene far less with him.

TheArmadillo · 08/09/2007 20:50

I think gess is right on the ball here.

tribpot · 08/09/2007 20:53

gess, I'm sure you're right. Ds' fellow Junies who are second children tend to be much more robust and have-a-go than my ds, simply because they have to be. Still doesn't make it very upsetting for me to see him in tears because another boy has had a go at him, for whatever reason.

Original poster

Woollymummy · 08/09/2007 20:53

I agree he probably didn't quite grasp the concept of the fontanelle but I always try and give a reason why something is "No", like it hurts, is not nice,is too late, blah, blah, just to show that I am not just always saying No No No, it is just that this mum friend of mine really doesn't delieve in saying No at all. I guess, I am interested in what to do, as if I am to keep up the friendship I need to know how to be a good friend, not a boring paranoid novice moaning nag, and so I want to know how far to go with help/suggestions/advice/questions. They are totally responsible for parenting their children, but unless they want to home-school them and then let them grow up on a mountainside, he is going to encounter people who
a) don't share his parents ethos about saying no/hitting with soft balls is "OK"
b) have bigger and stronger arms
c) are not his friends and will probably kick the * * * * out of him.

Before school you really need to get that socialising thing sorted out, or else you are in trouble. Believe me, I see plenty of teenagers everyday who never got shown the basics of how to behave when they were little. It is very sad. I don't want my friend's little boy to end up like that. What should I do. Should I say anything?

OP posts:

JodieG1 · 08/09/2007 20:53

I agree with Gess. 2.5 is still just a baby really as well and he won't understand or "know what he was doing" (as the op said) fully. Do you seriously think a 2.5 year old was being malicious?? I have a 5.7 dd, 3.11 ds1 and an 8 month old ds2.

Dd is wonderful with the baby but ds1 can sometimes be a bit rough with him (unintentionally) but it's just play and them getting used to each other. Ds1 is a lovely and affectionate boy but I'm sure other people could think differently if they didn't know him like I did.

tribpot · 08/09/2007 20:55

woolly - parents who won't say "no" will inevitably have to deal with their own consequences, I wouldn't worry about that. There's nothing you can usefully say about it, they have to find out on their own. Such is the joy of parenting, after all!

TheArmadillo · 08/09/2007 20:55

you really are projecting too much onto it. Really really.

He is a normal 2.5 yo. His parents have a way of dealing with his behaviour for whatever reasoning they have not decided to share with you.

All this does not mean he will grow up as a thug with issues.

Dear god you are really taking it too far.

If you don't want your dd around him for whatever reason then don't take her, but it is not for you to tell them how to parent their kids.

JodieG1 · 08/09/2007 20:57

Why would anyone want to kick the out of a 2.5 year old? What he's like now has no bearing on what he'll be like in 10 years time really and I don't think the way his parents are bringing him up will have an adverse affect on him as a teenager.

Original poster

Woollymummy · 08/09/2007 20:58

Also, the ball in question wasn't thrown (i.e. very light, no effect)- it was hammered repeatedly, HARD on her head as he sat next to her. I think what I am concerned about more is the concept of someone who is old enough to understand that something hurts someone doing it deliberately, and not being told not to.

OP posts:

JodieG1 · 08/09/2007 20:59

TheArmadillo totally agree, way too much projection there and assumptions imo. He's 2.5 ffs!

southeastastra · 08/09/2007 21:00

this is how children learn how to behave.

JodieG1 · 08/09/2007 21:00

Well imo 2.5 isn't old enough to fully understand actually. I would either just tell the boy to stop nicely and help him move on to do something else or show him how to use the ball correctly (I don't do time-outs etc) or remove my child.

Jazzicatz · 08/09/2007 21:01

Woollymummy at 2.5 he would not understand the concept at all. It is only when they reach 4 - 5 that they have even the slightest inkling and even then they are still predominantly egocentric.

tribpot · 08/09/2007 21:03

Jodie - I agree that Woolly is assuming the worst about the long-term behaviour of this little boy, but surely being allowed to repeatedly hammer another child over the head with a ball isn't normal at 2.5? I certainly wouldn't allow my ds to do it - is this a part of PFB syndrome I haven't encountered yet? (I'm quite prepared to believe it is). Woolly - fontanelle be damned, I would have bounced that ball off his head repeated to demonstrate my point!

TheArmadillo · 08/09/2007 21:05

so why didn't you take your dd away?

If you don't like the way he is being parented then don't take your dd to see them.

It really is not your business to tell them how to bring up their child.

I'm sorry your dd was upset, but she wasn't exactly badly hurt.

ONe of those balls thrown full whack by a powerful man does little more than sting (I know from experience).

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