What can we do to prevent our Sons growing up into a manchild? Or is it inevitable?

[HollidayArmadillo]

I literally do not know a single person in a relationship who doesn't agree that they have to basically coach the man through life
Has to be told very specifically and clearly how to do things and that things need doing in the first place, wants a parade every time they do something round the house
Are generally largely useless at housework and childcare
Shows zero initiative in this area of life whatsoever
And don't even get me started on the mental load

Every single woman I ever talk to has the same issues, and we see thread after thread on here about it

Why is this happening?? Why do we as a society accept it?
And most importantly what specifically can we do with our Sons now to prevent it happening in the future?

Or do you think no matter how capable they are the minute they move in with a woman and procreate that they will become a manchild as that's what society expects?

My ex was like this but that's the only example in my life/family. My Dad is elderly and manages fine as a widower, when I was growing up he and Mum shared cooking cleaning etc equally, this was in the 70s.

My DH does more than me and he's better at it- cooking, ironing and cleaning, he's also the one to remind me about life admin.

Have 2 sons and they are perfectly capable, the eldest is in a LTR and he is the one that does most of the housework.

So it can be done but I'm not sure why some are and some aren't , sorry not very helpful!

My brothers are perfectly capable, my mum made sure we all were (sahm mums can model gender equality too for the record!). My dh I have to admit has been fairly successfully trained, and my sons are going to bowl women over with their practical life skills in cleaning (insofar as I can teach something I’m not great at), planning life, cooking a delicious meal and budgeting. If I don’t say so myself.

I think about this ALL the time. My partner was a manchild and I've taught him how to cook and clean properly, even how to change bed sheets. I'll be absolutely mortified if I raise my son to be like that, I love MIL and she's got two little ones of her own and I always tell her to teach them how to do basic things (don't think she will though)

On the other hand, my brother is more than capable and loves cooking, is very clean and runs his own home whilst working long hours etc, and when he's at my house he'll see a job needs doing and crack on, he doesn't even realise he's doing it! Unfortunately the girlfriend's he's had have been the manchildren and he gets wound up by them not taking on any of the mental load so I think it swings both ways.

It's interesting all these examples of very capable men and useless women coming up - I genuinely can't think of a single real life example of this
And even men who were fully functioning adults before a relationship switch PDQ once there's a woman around

I think lots of women who think their partners are capable are probably subconsciously unaware of how they facilitate them though, for example their partner may well clean and cook and do specific tasks for the kids, but I'd bet any money the woman has to tell them to do it first, or tell them where the kids clothes are etc etc
But they do a bit of hoovering so 'aren't they good'

Bump

I think the main thing is male role models.
When I was in my teens my parents' roles reversed, my brother was only 5 or 6 at the time so all he can remember is dad doing the shopping, cleaning, cooking and childcare (including informal, paid childcare for my cousins). This has lead to my brother being the most hands on parent and main cook in his marriage. He and his wife share the cleaning.

I'm the messy one in my relationship and we both cook and share childcare equally when we're both at home. But I definitely do all the planning and carry the mental load, I basically organise everything and he does what he's asked to/what's on the to do list. It drives me insane but whenever I talk to DH about it he says I like being organised and wouldn't want to let him do it (conveniently for him ). Like fuck I wouldn't! The best holiday for me would be one where I could live minute to minute and didn't have to think about whether or not we have enough clean clothes, stuff for meals, who needs a back action appointment booking, where and when we should go on holiday etc..

My dh is perfectly capable of running the house without me and we’re raising our sons to be the same.

I have lots of friends married to lazy men but they totally enable it too - constantly putting them down and belittling every little thing they do - and skivying for them. More fool them.

My DH does just as much around the house as I do - he always has done.

We have 3 boys who have to help out around the house. The older two (11 and 13) cook at least once a week.

To answer your question - it is happening because their partners allow it to.

My DH is perfectly capable. He & I have made sure that our three sons, who are early 20s, are capable adults too. I don't think it's unusual.

Such an interesting question, and one I'm following in case someone turns up with all the answers.

My DP in fairness is fantastic and does the lions share of the housework etc , for us it works in order in my industry to be a highish earner I have to work long hours in a very intensive role (that doesn't get me out of it at all it's just the agreement we made that works for us)

He knows how upset I can get to spend time away from the DC so he also sees it as allowing me to be able to enjoy being with them rather than cleaning when I get home

I'll admit I take pretty much all of the mental load for me the DC and the house admin but he does take his own to be fair

It's a far cry from my Exdh who was entirely a man child....a well meaning one granted but useless at following through

It was most definately their upbringing, both of their parents were single mum's with challenging circumstances but there were downsides to both....i do think my DP grew up far too quickly but he is a hell of an adult

My Exmil bemoaned her circumstances and became bitter and tried to instil that in Exdh

Exdh on all fairness does seem to have learned from his mistake and has changed a lot ,unfortunately far too late to save the marriage

So I honestly don't think it's a given , it's entirely possible to bring sons up to be equal

Eh? I’ve never had to coach my DH to do anything. He does the vast majority of our cooking (also the meal planning and food shopping). I don’t have to ask him to, and I’ve never had to teach him to. Same with any other household tasks.
He went away to uni and lived alone before he met me, he’s perfectly capable of running a household.
I’m sorry you’ve only ever met shit men.

but I'd bet any money the woman has to tell them to do it first, or tell them where the kids clothes are etc etc

Honestly, no. Speak for yourself. I’m genuinely confused that you have only met men who can’t figure out that their DC’s clothes are more than likely in the drawers in their bedrooms. Or that if they’ve got no clean clothes then they need to put some in the washing machine, etc etc.

Massive gender stereotype.

I think the reason we never hear of lazy, slobby women is because men don't tend to bitch about their partners online. Or elsewhere for that matter. But there will be plenty of them.

My DP is most certainly not a ‘manchild’, and does not require ‘coaching through life’.

He does almost all the cooking, he does half the food shopping, he does his own washing and irons his own shirts as he (quite rightly) doesn’t trust me to do it to his standards.

I’d have laughed at DH if he’d ever even suggested I iron his work shirts.
Luckily he never has, as he’s more than capable of looking after himself.

Dh does more than his share around the house. There are things that I take responsibly most of the time like cooking but that’s because I enjoy it. If I’m going out I leave him to it and he’s fine.

I agree with pp that if men are allowed to act like this then the lazy ones are more likely to take advantage.

And also, my dh’s mum never made him do anything around the house and he’s grown up to be more than competent. Same with my db. Our df relies heavily on my dm and did little to nothing when it came to the house although he did manage all the finances etc. However, my db and his partner split everything 50/50. So not sure it’s down to how they’re brought up but then if I had sons I would make sure they were capable of doing everything around the house, just like I will be dd’s as one day they’ll be in their own house and need to know!

Ah ok clearly I'm making it up and all of the threads on here about it are lies and the whole 'mental load' thing is nonsense and all of the 'silly menz' type threads where a bloke can't do the most basic of tasks and women all find it hilarious are all made up too!
Silly me! 🙄

It's not inability, it's laziness in most cases. I've never stood for it. From day 1 we've taken an equal share of the household load. The kind of helplessness some men apparently display around the house would be a big turn off for me.

There is something in between ‘every single man is useless and every single woman enables it’ and ‘you’re making it all up’. Some men are useless. Some women enable it. They’re the ones posting on forums moaning about their partners. I don’t, as I don’t have to. Clearly though I’m lying about my DH being more than capable and I’m in denial about the fact that I actually have to tell him to do these things.

You said this:

I think lots of women who think their partners are capable are probably subconsciously unaware of how they facilitate them though, for example their partner may well clean and cook and do specific tasks for the kids, but I'd bet any money the woman has to tell them to do it first, or tell them where the kids clothes are etc etc

And I said no, in the case of me and my DH that is categorically not true.

I disagree. My DH is very capable, doesn't need to be coached through anything, can and does run the house/kids just fine, and has a full-time job. In fact, he's much better than I am at this sort of stuff. I think in his case, it's that he "had" to be independent from an early age - boarding school from a young age. And when he was home for holidays, his parents were often at work, so he had to cook for himself, etc, even at primary school age. It wouldn't be done now, of course, but back in the day it was fine.

Actually my partner is amazing/better than me at everything. Joking!!
I did not expect the responses on here OP 😂 I totally get what you mean, I have a man child. If he puts washing away it's all in the wrong drawers - DD's drawers so simple, tops, bottoms, dresses, pyjamas. Always wrong, even though he just has to look in the drawer?! If I work the night I'll come home to DD in bed with leggings & a top, not pjs & not in her sleeping bag it's just a never ending cycle of... do. It. Like. This. Do wish he'd use his brain more... can't speak for every man obviously but mine is definitely guilty of this!! I really don't know if it's laziness/stupidness/can't be arsedness! But if I have a son I do hope I can teach him better!!

So you’re asking for ways to ensure your sons don’t become lazy, entitled, enabled men, but then don’t accept that there are men who aren’t lazy, entitled, or enabled and, if a woman claims she knows one, she’s deluded?

Riiiiiiiiiiight