Broken hearted over my DS

[DistressedMumHELP]

Okay, i want help and reassurance really. I have name changed for this in case anyone recognises me. I was stopped and asked for an account of events yesterday after witnessing an altercation and the police officer noticed the bruise on my little boys cheek. Which i explained was where he had fallen in between the step and bench in my garden, they then noticed he has bruises on his legs around his knees, so eventually they arrested me on suspicion of ABH. I was of course a mess, but i was told at the time that it was procedure etc, so i was compliant with them, Last night i got released on police bail and was of course expecting my little boy back, but today after seeing social services they have said i cant have him returned to me. I am heart broken, i have never hurt my child on purpose, and i look after him as best as possible. Originally they were saying he didnt talk, but today in front of the social worker he was talking, and i am trying to explain that he gets shy about talking, when they say he is friendly etc. They went through all my history and i have been as open as possible with them, and i dont know what to do. They want to keep him in care and are applying for a court order on friday to do so. I plan on seeing a solicitor tomorrow, the only reason i didnt today was because i didnt leave the social services until half 5 so no where was open.

I NEED A HUG. I PROMISE I WOULD NEVER HURT HIM AND FEEL THAT JUST A FEW BRUISES HAVE TAKEN MY SON FROM ME.

I want him home. Does anyone have any experiences? How long will it take? They said they couldnt say,

Yank, I presume you were not direct participant in knife wielding altercation then? OP was being questioned by police for her knowledge of said crime. I think we are not getting entire scope of story. We probably will not be privy to such details.
It is in Op's best interest to portray herself as the victim of the police. My concern is strictly for the child.

No, I wasn't, but I have been a participant in an altercation where someone was wielding a big fold-out baton thing. Said person is a (very) unstable, angry neighbor of my best friend.

Again, my son was not directly involved because he was an infant at the time and asleep in the house, but he could have witnessed it if he'd been older.

I'd definitely be concerned for the child too, I'm just saying that "I am still stunned that a mature, reasonable parent would place a child in a situation that resulted in a weapon being drawn" is a bit of a harsh thing to say. Surely it could happen.

I'm quite sure that the OP and her friend asked for a random person to racially abuse them in the street.

And if you speak back to someone that racially abuses you, or your friend, I'm sure that the first thing you will assume is that that random person in the street is going to pull a knife on you, and threaten a young child. Again, .

If the OP was concerned enough to try to get away from the situation by boarding a bus with their child to get them away from the situation, but was stopped by the police as a witness to the knife pulling etc, do you not think the OP WAS trying her best to remove her child from the situation?

I get so frustrated when people see things in black and white, not thinking about how a situation like this could easily have been perfectly innocent on the OP's behalf, but misinterpreted by the police and SS.

I can see how it LOOKS bad, your child has been threatened with a knife in an altercation, and already had pre-existing unusual bruising from accidental injuries, police and SS think that child is in an unsuitable situation.

The other side of the story is that a woman was walking in broad daylight with her DC and her friend, when some twat decided to hurl racial abuse at them. When they complain about the racial abuse (are they meant to just ignore it and turn the other cheek?!), they get a knife drawn on them and a tiny child threatened. Then, bruising from believable accidents are taken to be signs of abuse, and your child is in FC.

Right now, my toddler has a bruise in the shape of a line going vertically down his forehead. I have no doubt that if SS saw the bruise, they would think it was down to a non-accidental injury. Because it is such an unusual bruise.

My toddler got the bruise when trying to run across the front room and out of the back door to play with his new sand & water table. He misjudged the doorway, and ran straight into the corner wall that juts out next to my doorway, with his forehead, hence a vertical line bruise. No way would anyone but Usain Bolt have been fast enough to prevent that accident from happening.

Can people honestly not see how some unusual bruises ARE non-accidental?

That question is mostly to SW's on the thread as I would be quite interested to hear their answers on that one.

Are there any types of bruise that will ALWAYS be seen as non-accidental?

Goodness, OP, that sounds so dreadful.

I hope you get your child back soon. My DS has ASD and would refuse to talk or co-operate with strangers so I find that utterly believeable.

I think a lot of people couthy are not seeing it in black and white but think that's there are bits if this missing.

This might be innocent on ops behalf but still it's impossible to help someone if you don't know the facts, which is why I think it's a good thing op is seeing legal people this morning.

Yank I get what your saying. What I can't see from this is the link from being a witness to being in a cell. That's why I think there are some gaps here too.

What Pickles said.

Wish I could like your post!!

Not willingly allowing SW's to take your child will land you in a cell. They would have taken her to a cell to process her for the injuries on her child, and bail her. That actually seems quite plausible to me, having been the parent in that situation.

(I might add all charges were dropped, because all injuries were proven in the end to be accidental, and not through lack of supervision, but more due to DS2's unsteadiness on his feet due to his dxd disability).

The OP says that while her DS is underweight for his age, he is also short. If there is not a 2-Centile difference, or if the DS has been following his Centile and not dropping through them, then it shouldn't be a concern to SS if the HV hasn't expressed concern or referred him to a dietician and CDC. If the HV doesn't think it is serious enough to refer on, why do SS class it as an issue?

If the child did not talk in the original assessment, surely that could he put down to anxiety at being separated from his Primary carer, and his young age (just turned two), and the fact that he then chatted in the subsequent appointment with the SW present should have made that point.

How many just-turned 2yo's are going to have the mental agility to keep quiet when told by an abusive parent if they are with a SW? IMO/IME, that doesn't happen until at least 3yo, if not older. So a lack of speech on a first assessment of a child that young would surely be down to anxiety at having been removed from their Primary Carer, rather than an indication of abuse?

If there were genuine concerns about the child's speech, surely the HV or GP would have referred them to the waiting list for speech therapy? If they haven't yet, then surely below-average speech hasn't been deemed a medical issue at that point due to the young age of the child?

All these things that SS take as signs of abuse can ALSO be perfectly normal issues in a non-abusive situation. Which is why I get frustrated with people thinking that these issues combined MUST add up to abuse.

I can tell you that it DOESN'T always mean that. These things in combination can sometimes be indicative of an as yet undxd SEN, never mind anything else.

I think I will leave this thread for a while, as I can't offer much more advice to the OP than I have already given, which is to get GOOD legal advice, contact Epilepsy Action for some help, support and legal advice, and to speak to as many relevant charities as you can.

I'm getting frustrated with the responses saying something is missing from the OP's story. I don't believe there is.

Story : in a DV situation while pregnant, referred to SS by MW.
SS involvement while pregnant.
Leaves DV situation.
Has epilepsy.
Involved in an altercation involving a knife, and young child threatened.
Child having developmental issues with weight/height but within the bounds of 'normal' range, as no referrals to CDC/Dietician.
Child refusing to speak during first assessment, possibly due to anxiety at removal from Primary Carer/shyness/mild speech issues still within 'normal' as no referral to SALT.
Child having 'unusual' bruising - perfectly reasonable explanations for the bruising, but 'unusual' bruising nonetheless.

Combined gives a picture of SS reasons for removal, but all perfectly plausible reasonable explanations.

I can see why SS might remove for further assessment, based on that list, but equally I can see that it can all be explained as, well, life.

OP, I feel for you, and I hope you are getting some legal advice this morning.

Seriously, at 2YO, my son was largely non verbal.

I can't believe that people would use that as a sign of neglect.

My son has HFA and didn't speak much at all until he was well over 3. He was also in nappies until well over 3YO.

Not offended, enthusiastictroll, not at all. It's a tricky topic and easy to offend where not intended. I certainly did not give explicit consent in my situation - I was told, but I didn't argue. He wasn't taken from me, but from nursery, and I was told where to meet him, so perhaps it was different - this is all so new to me.

I would say, however, I posted not just to give some sympathy to OP, but also to show others how quickly issues with SS can escalate - and I think there is value in that. Not every post has to be purely for the OP's benefit.

I live in a naice area, with naice ham, and would never harm my child. I don't believe anyone at his nursery would either. But still, here I am waiting another phone call from SS, just because he had a small bruise that happened late in the day at his nursery, which no one is now concerned about.

The GP said it was 'child protection gone mad' - no, I am not exaggerating and I know that sounds ridiculous, but he did say it. He even said it was due to Baby P - and what can you say to that; it's obvious some children really do need this extended protection. I don't want to argue against that but I don't want to be in this situation either. Being taken to hospital and prodded and poked and taken in a car by strangers is traumatic for my son in itself, all done so the nursery can tick some boxes.

The child must come first, but on a support site where a parent is clearly distressed, I think it is wise to open your (the general your, not anyone in specific) mind to the possibility she could be telling the truth.

PS, I won't come back to the thread - not offended by anything but I recognise that this is too sensitive for me to read about and I couldn't bear to be judged at the moment, so I will bow out.

I didnt put a two year old in that situation, we tried to walk away from it. There are always drunks out there, that is not my fault and unfortunately to get to the train station i have to walk past them, this is not my fault.
If anyone here has ever been arrested they will know that you are asked all medical conditions anyway, which i of course did declare, but when asked whether i had been drinking my reaction is always the same " I cant because i am on meds for epilepsy"

I would never have intentionally put him in that situation but unfortunately i dont live in the nicest of areas, which is by the way not my fault, i had to take whatever i could because of the council. I have never ever been involved in knife incidents before, i keep away from them at all costs and if i a being completely honest tthe knife did sort of freeze me because i was stabbed in the past by my ex, and obviously as a result they scare the hell out of me, i dont like people in the kitchen while i am even washing up dinner knives.

As someone who has been there with SS and come out the other side (have no involvement at all now). I just want to say OP that I hope things work out for you. I can really sympathise for you and really hope you get the help you need. The only advice I have for you is please work with all the professionals trying to help you (yes that does include SS). Also ask for any help you think you might need from anyone. Good luck.

Have no advice op sorry but wanted to say I believe you and hope that the situation is resolved quickly and ds returned to you.

I have a solicitors appointment for 11Oclock, will update when i return as to what happened

DistressedMum - do everything you are asked to by SS. Attend parenting classes, go to the CDC with your DS (you CAN ask to be present at medical appointments, with a SW present, right now), don't miss ANY appointments, either with SS, solicitors or contact. If anything needs rearranging due to clashes, it must be the legal advice, NOT the contact or SS appointments.

And i am working with them, i caused no trouble to the police which surely says i was helpful, and my social worker confirmed i had told her everything that she already had and more about my past which i didnt have to but it makes it easier if you are honest with them, which is exactly what i am being, though there have been a lot of tears and i did say i dont like my son seeing me upset, i like to look "strong" in front of him, but obviously yesterday i crumbled.

I believe you, DistressedMum. I hope you get your little one back soon.

Please do keep us posted as much as you can.

I know Mumsnet believe you too, as they deleted a post that could have 'outed you' in RL, so I am sure they will keep an eye to make sure you don't post anything that shouldn't be on a public forum.

Wrt speech - even if speech concerns are raised it is very very difficult to get any sort of referral to SALT before the age of two and a half. I insisted on a referral for ds2 on his second birthday (was told any referral earlier would be ignored). This was despite him being a known very high risk for a severe communication disorder. He was seen aged 3 - yes, despite being known high risk he did wait a year . This was prior to the cuts - god knows what it's like now.

To use lack of speech in a just turned 2 year old placed in a strange situation as evidence of anything is extremely worrying. Get that solicitor OP. I somehow missed you had epilepsy, but yes I think epilepsy plus history of an abusive relationship makes you very vulnerable. Please get a good lawyer. And follow couthy's suggestions (was it epilepsy action?h

Distressed- Ask them to check his iron levels and vitamin d level. I was interviewed by social services as a child (in the mid 80's) as I had lots of bruising. It turned out I was severely anaemic and so bruised easily. Get legal advice urgently and if you are experiencing any other issues (mental health, DV, addiction etc) then seek help for these. Show yourself to be making a genuine effort to address any issues but most importantly do not allow your mental health to suffer or be used against you in any child protection proceedings. Think about getting a support worker or an advocate as well as a Lawyer. What ever the circumstances, I hope this is best resolved for you and your son.

I'm so utterly at this whole situation....this is such a nightmare for you OP....I can hardly imagine how distressing and 'out there' this must all be for you...

I hope you have found a good solicitor and the advice you are given sets a positive ball rolling for you and your DC to be united very quickly....

It very much sounds as though there has been an OTT response here with the Police and things have gone to an extreme which has been totally unnecessary...I so hope that SW can see the truth of this and return your child very quickly....
Couthys advice and experience may be very close to the fact for you and I hope you get as much support as possible from your specialist and anyone else involved with your situation and medical history, especially currently, how you're meds and treatment is working for you, etc...proof of seizures and impact on your general life and ability to care for your DC.....it sounds like you may need to draw upon all of this to defend yourself with this situation....It's so wrong but sadly I believe Couthys experience is very possibly what is happening to you right now....

I just wanted to ask though....does your ex have visitation/contact with DC and is it possible he has stirred up any of this for you? Could he have created this trouble towards you by reporting the bruise on your DCs face and raising alarms at all???? ....just a thought

Good luck at the solicitors. I really would say that Epilepsy Action can be good advocates for you in respect of your epilepsy not causing problems with your ability to look after your DS.

Thinking of you.

Nope my son doesn't see my ex but I was told he has a solicitors appointment in October for exactly that and pre
Christmas my former mum in law told me that before I stopped contact I should think carefully cos he was thinking of going for residency.
I should add my health visitor and gp have no concerns regards of my PND and in fact I went to my doctor before Christmas regards of it because I was feeling drained, tired and sleeping a lot. I said I was worried my meds weren't working any more, she done blood tests and it came back I was dangerously low in b12 which would cause the tiredness and folate. I used to suffer from iron deficency anaemia as well.
With my post natal depression and I know this will upset people but I am being honest, I hated my little boy, I mean really hated, I wanted either him or me dead and I did take an overdose of sleeping tablets. I also told the social worker I was no longer prescribed diazepam as it was (by my doctor) no longer necessary (they would've got that info from my doctor anyway)

Distressed for what its worth, I believe you too.

Jump through those hoops to get him back with you. HUG.

Ive heard Ireland is a nice place to live.

I already moved him half way down the country closer to my family. Poor thing, then moved 5 months ago pretty local, and now this. Poor boy. I feel so guilty. I took him away from an unsafe environment for this to happen.

I already have said to a friend I will jump through all the hoops, backwards and with somersaults if that means he comes home. Waiting at solicitors now.

Good luck op.