What's it really like with two?

[Cbell]

I know it's a very general question but I find myself pregnant with baby number two (unplanned: failed coil) and am not sure if I want more.

All I can think about is how hard it will be and how much I will miss enjoying my DD (17 months)

Very sad

Yes TheEnglishWomanInTheAttic, DS does play well alone, and even when he does ask me to play with him I like playing with him as he is interesting and the stories he makes up makes me laugh! I think I am much more relaxed when I'm around one child only. Having both of them together, instantly makes me nervous and on edge as I'm always expecting things to kick off (and they do!) and the stress takes its toll on you. But I love having them on a one to one basis. I particularly love having DS to myself as he is more interesting than DD (I find preschoolers so much more interesting than babies or toddlers). Although DD is totally adorable and cute and such a mummies girl, it does get a bit boring after while when it is just me and her. Whereas DS is proper company and is like being with an adult.

I do love having 2 after saying all this though. I'm just hoping that they do get on better eventually!

DS1 does also play well on his own when DS2 is away out of the picture. It's like a different child. They get on fine on a one to one basis.

lovechoc you arent a rubbish mum just because you are finding it a bit tough, we all find it tough sometimes. Like Ive said upthread mine ar 5 and almost 2. They love each other they really do but ds is quite a friendly, caring little soul whereas dd is a fiery, confrontational character and if theyd been the other way round (or both like dd) then it might have been a whole other story.

lovechoc you know you aren't a rubbish mum, if you were you wouldn't be working so hard!

I do resent the implication that anyone who isn't saying they are having a horrendous time and their kids hate each other isn't being open and honest though! I have pointed out that my kids aren't at all perfect - sleep has been a big issue but I don't think it's a multiple child one, as they have pretty much taken over from the previous one rather than been poor sleepers at the same time, so it's just it goes on for more years, when obviously if you had stopped at 1 that one would have grown out of it.

I have also mentioned my daughter doesn't play well on her own - this is the personality thing, she was very hard work on her own, I found child minding easier than having her alone, always took her to a group every day etc. until her brother was old enough to be a playmate (once he crawled she made him be a puppy in her pretend games! He loved it! She was 2.5. My eldest would have been a very high maintenance "only" child because she needs always to be interacting, but she is an excellent eldest sibling.

Sorry I said I'd bow out :o But just as I accept some people have a really hard slog with 2, I think it would be nice if a modicum of respect was shown in accepting that others aren't lying when they say their kids mostly get on and work really well as a group without needing much intervention, which makes having 2 + easier than just having the one child (though as I have said it is not "a breeze" or "easy" mainly due to the sleep and clinginess issues of the youngest, but those would exist whether he was child 1 or child 12). The 13 month old is MUCH less clingy when his siblings are around - they are more interesting than me and I can actually get dinner cooked/ washing hung out when they are home!

Fair do's TheEnglishWomanInTheAttic, and thank you :) As much as I whinge about it, I do actually love them both to bits and would not have it any other way, and could not imagine life without them both. There are some good moments between them too, despite all the negatives!

It can hopefully get better as they grow up and have a better understanding of others feelings. 'Sharing' is always tough for both of them, especially the eldest (even at 5yo!). I think he manages well with his peers at nursery though.

Have just one child at a time as someone else has already stated, is a joy. It's nice to see them shine through when they're on their own without the challenges of the other trying to dominate the scene.

I appreciate that many who have two or more find their children play fine together, and are not exaggerating about it. You are all lucky!!

Thank you lovechoc :o

I have just spent a full hour trying to settle DC3 to sleep btw, why have I never cracked the getting babies/ small toddlers to self settle despite having 3?

I wonder if it is a case of expectations? I expected my two to have sibling rivalry issues and actually, for the most part they get on pretty well - there is a large amount of luck in that, I admit. However DH (an only child) was horrified to hear DC1 tell DC2 she hated him. As an only child, he was strongly in favour of having more than one child, incidentally.

As a former DC1 myself it didn't phase me, I know that's just the feeling of the moment and it's better for her to verbalise it and get it out than be told to internalise it and have it fester as an injustice that she's 'not allowed' to feel that way. Next moment she'll be hugging him, it's the way it goes. But DH thought this was a sign of something terribly wrong, and really, it's normal... For us it is mainly disputes over toys and personal space, and DC2 gives as good as he gets, if not more so. I expect things to kick off occasionally, I don't see it as my job to make sure there's never any conflict, they learn through it for one thing - even if that learning is that if DD takes DS's toy, DS may hit her: it's not okay for DS to hit but it's not okay for DD to take things without asking... But when it boils down to it, they play together nicely more than they don't so maybe my experience is as far from those of you who have kids that don't get on as those people whose kids slept through from four months were to me...

Fwiw, I found the Siblings Without Rivalry: How to help your kids to live together so you can live too book really useful.

I've read the sibling rivalry book and it is useful. I always let DD1 articulate what she feels and always acknowledge that having a younger sister can be hard ( I was an eldest sister so I should know).

I usually say it's ok not to like your sister sometimes but it's never ok to hit. We do try to crack down on name calling too. DD2 is on the verge of speaking so I'm wondering what she will come out with once she is verbal. Physically she is a lot stronger now and is going through a hitting/ poking phase herself much to DD1's dismay who starts shrieking and crying when she's on the receiving end. I told her today that when you keep poking a baby in the face you are just teaching them to poke you back ( DD1 got her eyes poked today!).

We do try to play it fair though and if we have a consequence for hitting (usually removing a favourite toy for a short period) we will do it for both even if it's meaningless for the 18mth old, in DD1's eyes it looks like we are being totally fair.

I do think things are getting better though slowly as there are more things they can do together now.

By the way for those finding two hard "Three Shoes, One Sock and No Hairbrush" is great- many people find it depressing ( don't read it when pregnant) but those who have struggled have found it quite comforting.

Thanks for those book recommendations Gilberte and TheMightyMojoceratops I will have a read of them.

Incidentally, I was an only child, and I was very undecided about having DC2, and she was an accident. I loved being an only child and all the attention I got. So maybe I feel sad for my children that they don't get their parents undivided attention and that makes me feel guilty when I can't give them this attention. So in a way, my expectations are that every child should be getting loads of attention and one to one care, and as this is not possible I feel like I am failing as a mum whatever I do.
DH is the oldest of 3, and he only wanted one child as well. Although he does get along with his siblings, he doesn't think they are invaluable or that he couldn't get through life without them, or that they made his life better.

I think at the end of the day, most of it is down to the childs personality. Me and DH always say that, if DD was born first and DS was DC2, then it would be a whole different experience. DD is so motherly and loves babies, never jealous etc, so I bet she would love to be an older sister. Whereas DS likes being spoilt and only thinks of himself.

It looks on this thread as if some of the mums posting about the hard times they are having with their children do have quite young children and/or children at quite difficult ages.

I found mine a nightmare when they were 3.5 and newborn respectively. But if you ask me now, when they are 12 and 15, I will weight that against all the lovely times they've had together since and see it in a different perspective.

Also, ime most parents struggle with something. Dd has a lovely relationship with her brother, but struggles badly with anxiety issues and has virtually dropped out of school which affects the whole family. Doesn't make me either a better or a worse parent than someone whose children struggle to get on together.

I also think Mojoceratops has a point about perspectives. I grew up in a large family where we love each dearly but have also been through some ups and downs, so I wasn't terribly upset or surprised when big sister whacked little brother over the head or little brother told porkies about big sister; I expected those things as part of a wider picture.

Theenglishwomanintheattic - I used to beat myself up about dc1 not self settling, then I had dc2 who has self settled since she was born, literally, she hates being cuddled to sleep or if you sing to her etc. Its just the way some kids are imho (or aren't)

Hi!

I just wanted to thank everyone for there responses. I have been surprised be the level of interest in my original question as to 'what it's like with two'.

I asked this question from a place of great uncertainty and I think it is fair to say that these last two weeks have perhaps been some of the worst of my life.

Initially I was uplifted by how positive everyone was of the prospect of two children. This helped me reflect on what I want my family to look like and yes I had always imagined more children and a sibling for my DD. Obviously things took a bit of a downward turn but I don't think this is a bad thing, necessarily, 'different opinions are available'.

I love being a mummy. It is one of the greatest joys of my life and I love the little team that me and my daughter form. However this has come at a sacrifice and as the poet Philip Larkin said 'you can feel you are living on the periphery of your own life'. The prospect of a second child seem to compound that and I have a feeling if the cage doors are being shut. Not a nice feeling to go into a second pregnancy with.

At the moment I feel I need to try and accept the negative aspects of parenting two and hope for the positive elements. I am terrified that due to the difficulty of having two and my initial reaction of wanting to bolt from this pregnancy that I am at greater risk of PNT. I was so happy and so ready to have my DD. I felt I only had to listen to my instincts and that all would be well but I feel detached from this pregnancy and am fighting myself to overcome these feelings.

I hope my family with two is as happy as many of you have described

Cbell, just throwing this out there, I hope unnecessarily - but do talk to your midwife about your feelings and be aware of pre-natal depression as well as post-natal depression. I think it is normal to be worried about how your family will change, and of the loss of freedom that a newborn entails. But in many ways, while we fitted our life around DC1, with DC2, he had to fit his life around the rhythm of family life that already existed. It wasn't the shock to the system that DC1 was; things changed, but not such a total shift of the landscape as going from none to one. I really struggled with DC1, DC2 was nowhere near as bad, partly as I knew what to expect from babies in general, and partly as I expected it to be awful and it was actually okay.

Logistically if nothing else it's not easy, not for anyone. But that doesn't mean it'll be terrible and it also doesn't mean that even if there is some jealousy or whatever at the beginning, that things will always be difficult.
At the moment I feel I need to try and accept the negative aspects of parenting two and hope for the positive elements
that's a very sensible approach I think. i'm sure you'll be fine.
xx