'SAHMS' that have full time childcare or help - a fantastic liberation or downright lazy?

[Enid]

There are lots of mothers down here in Dorset who are (or whose husbands are) well off enough to afford NOT to work. I know a few and they all have full time aupairs or nannies. One of them has TWO nannies - one for each of her children.

It seems to be a matter of pride that you always take the nanny/au pair on holiday to help with your children. Also that the nanny/au pair takes the children to clubs and activities.

OK - I think it is outrageously lazy (and so does dh). What do you think?

Agree with Beetroot- there are so few people that fit that picture (the woman wih TWO nannies one for each child sounds as if she does) of swanning off shopping whilst leaving their nanny to slog (I mean how many nannies would put up with that- all the nannies I know would tell the mother to get stuffed and go and get a decent job somewhere else). The thread may have started that way, but it descended into "I'll wear sackcloth and chew off my hand in order to prove I'm a better mother than someone who makes life a bit easier for herself".

SS haven't given us term time funding either (although they moved some holiday cover to term time), but I spend their money as and when is suits. I'm not going to feel bad for getting help. DP's are a mess- I;m lucky to live in an area where because of initial teething problems (and a massive complaint from a friend who recieved nothing) it has been sorted out. However I definitely know people here and elsewhere who should be getting help, and aren't, but I also know people who are far more able to access stuff than us that get more help than we do. Fairness is a major problem of this system.

It also makes me laugh as to when are classified as being entitled to need help on mnet. I appear to be allowed it, but someone like beetroot (with 4 kids isn't). If anyone has ever tried herding 4 kids everywhere they'll soon find it's easier to employ someone to help make the tea, whilst you can rush another one to the dentist/music lesson or whatever. How does that make someone lazy? And yes I know that's not what Enid meant, but that's how the thread progressed. Peronsally if I had the choice I'd rather lunch at Harvey Nicck's occasionally than never go out for 15 years because they're my children and I had them so I have to do every little thing for them immediately they wish or they will feel rejected.

On another thread someone (a nanny I think) said something like "by the time she has her 3rd kid she'll be leaving him with the mmilkman to get 5 minutes peace" which is exactly true and the point I was trying to make. As soon as you get above 2 kids, especially if they are pre-schoolers help in some form (whether family, friends or paid) becomes a necessity.

Now what I never understand are maternity nurses - except for particular reasons (twins, maternal illness etc). Otherwise why not save your money and pay for a mother's help to help out with your other kids/cooking etc whilst you do the nice bit with the baby.

oh god

it was only an idle musing on a tuesday morning

I think I know some very unusual people down here tbh (Dorset Nanny Users)

"the origin of this thread is the idea of 'fragrant yummy mummy who spends all her time at the gym', the sort I know who have no qualms to work their pregnant nanny into the ground because they're too posh to get up for a nightfeed and really don't do anything meaningful during the day. I think people like that just waste their lives away. "

yes exactly that is what it meant

funny how full time working mums identified most with this despite being polar opposites of what I meant!

nannies certainly don't leave!! they get paid well i guesss

it is their job to look after the kids - certainly doesnt matter what the mum does - otherwise they are as guilty as me of making a judgement call!

And before I get jumped on- yes i know there are people who have 3 + kids and can't afford help, but it definitely makes life a lot easier, so if you can afford it what's so wrong with taking it.

Anyway no pheasant for me today. DS1 is standing naked next to me pinching me (I am trying the ignoring technique- its not working- he's back tp pinching because he's bored- when we can go out it stops completely), and ds2 is next door with a bowl having been vommy yesterday. Ds3 is safely ensconced in playpen (poor thing he hates it). Today is my first day of this half term without help (my mum is at work today) I would willingly pay triple to get an extra pair of hands in today. However I did recieve 4 CV's today- and one in particular looks fantastic (a dissertation in sensory rooms- just as I'm trying to put one together) so hopefully will not be in this situation next half term. And although my employing someone is all very worthy and allowed, I'd be equally happy to employ someone in order to get the odd lunch at Harvey Nicks.

lol but you said it first

Lockets how many kids do you have? If its one then I think you would be mad to employ lots of help (with your child), that's what I'm trying to get at, how many people complaining about others getting help, actually don't need it?

Enid I know one mother like the ones you describe, but I've never met her because the little girl (very sweet) was always with the nanny! And yes that is odd (not sure lazy though, I assumed the mother had some sort of mental health or social problems )

Well if I could afford this I certianly would.

My friend who has 4 children and is a SAHM (at one point all 4 were under 4 yrs old ) has always had a live-in au pair.

They are certainly not rich but they pay for it because as she says otherwise her life is awful.

When she first had the twins she had to take a 31/2 yr old and a 21/2 year old to two different nurseries in the morning. Exactly how do you do this on your own with 2 month old twins?. A couple of times she pushed a double buggy with a buggyboard on the back for her ds1 and carried the second twin in a carrier. After doing this three times a week for two weeks - the au pair was hired. I for one don't blame her.

I also think that if you can afford help even if you have fewer kids why not get it? We were never designed to bring up children with one woman at home with no extra help. It used to come from friends and family who generally lived with us or very nearby.

The thing is, what we are doing here is deciding who is deserving or undeserving of help with their children. And enid, correct me if I'm wrong but you're saying if a woman does no paid work outside the home (i.e. is ostensibly a sahm) and yet pays someone to look after children/do housework then they are lazy. And presumably, you are saying being lazy in this situation is a bad thing? (if not, fine, I'm with Caligula on there being nothing wrong with laziness, sod the work ethic). BUT, presumably IF a woman pays someone to look after children/do housework but works outside the home then that's ok? So the difference is what you do with your time? i.e. doing something you want to do is not allowed if it's not paid work? Interesting. (I have Time On My Hands today, no job and children in full time childcare this week !) What about mumsnetting? The work of idle hands, surely?!

I suspect lockets you'll find that once your eldest begins to be off doing stuff that you don't want to have to drag your youngest 2 all over the place to get to that a helping hand is a complete godsend. Just over 2 and 10 months can be easily accomodated together, presumably you can use a double buggy etc- which makes things easier. You may find it harder to accomodate your eldest and youngest together.

Exacltly www.

lazycow - I think making the 3.5 yo walk would have been a good start! Then stick the 2.5 yo on the buggy board and either ditch the double buggy or the sling.

well what I REALLY meant was but probably didnt explain well was that I know four or five women who are very comfortably off/rich and have 2 or 3 children each. They all have at least one live in au pair or nanny and I have rarely seen the mums drop off/pick up. I know they don't work as I have met them all socially. They garden and, well, swan around.

I DO think that is lazy - AND it shocks me that anyone can actually be happy doing, well, nothing.

I have two kids and work part time so obviously have childcare then. If dh offers to look after the kids for the w/e so I can go to London to see my best friend then I do it. If my MIL is around she will look after the kids when I go to the midwife. I have a mothers help a day and a half a week (when I am working) and she does a lot of my ironing and keeps the house ticking over.

So am not a bloody martyr! Now you can pull my life apart if you wish and point out where I am being hypocritical.

oh and feel a bit guilty leaving out all the mums that brought the dds home from school and nursery when I was poorly. So I suppose I have a good support network unlike some on this thread.

no lockets
you must have Help
you WILL have Help
you don't know your own mind

Personally I am just at all the people with cleaners. Especially the SAHMs.

Ah well Enid, you see I don't see anything wrong at all with paying someone to do school drop off and pick up, I detest it and considered paying someone to do it for me even when I wasn't working! Presumably your strong work ethic wouldn't allow you to consider doing nothing or doing something like gardening? I love doing nothing, having time to just think uninterrupted, is bliss. As is reading for 4 hours in a row, sleeping or going to bed with dh in the daytime, or visiting a museum or art gallery, oh god, I could go on and on! And you DO have some unpaid help in the form of MIL and plenty of people absolutely don't so if they want to go to the midwife without taking other children they have no choice, they have to pay someone. So beliefs about work/leisure time/idelness are at the root of this aren't they?

I will be interested lockets in how you feel when you hve a baby, and tw little ones. That is when i gothelp. (other than when i was working)

I flet i coudl give the big ones so much more quality and fun time if I had sleep.
Those awfulawful tea times, with a baby screaming, and two toddlers desperate to eat (or not) those bath times when baby wanted a feed adn the two toddlers wanted bath, storys, nappies changing etc etc.

Another pair of hands was fantastic, even if it was just to hold the baby.

Now full time nanny and sahm..hmmm..what is there to do al lday every day???

excuse typo, idleness, I do know how to spell it!

but i guess, you mifght be A BETTERMOTHER THANME [GRIN] Or at least be more tolerent