what are the reasons for NO smacking?

[hermykne]

I AM CURIOUS to know, folling the other thread, as my dd is so bold at the moment nothing gets thru to her, even putting her in a time out room for 2/3mins, shes 3. she will keep on screaming and then hit something or push something over.
can last 40mins and no matter how you go over the matter with her when shes calm, she doesnt seem to learn anything,
and i suppose smacking will not make her understand either...
but what does smacking create or instill in behavourial patterns in yours opinions?

I wouldn't have married a man who wanted to smack our kids tbh. And one of the great advantages of marrying a man with a child is that you get to see their parenting in action before you sign up for life
We also discussed it before we had children. I feel very strongly about it.

I remember specific incidents of my dad hitting me as a young child. I hated him for it. It was confusing, huniliating and very scarey. It has definitely affected our ability to be close to one another.

That said I think men in the seventies seemed to think it was correct parenting. I also remember my dad rubbing my kitten's nose in its poo in order to teach it to poo outside. I cried. How the hell is a kitten going to make the link?

He's a bright man my dad, but he's done some pretty thick things, looking back.

Laligo, I'm so sorry. Your story reminds me of a girl at my school and her dad. I can't imagine what you went through. Have you had help?

yes but HRHQoQ, you never know what behaviour you are going to get.
If you issue two warnings, then you are fairly sure that they have heard you and there is no misunderstanding as to what will happen if they don't do what is being asked.
It is not about it "working" it is about a consistent procedure.
I don't think you will get conclusive results on yobs, as there are so many factors at play in what makes someone yobbish. There have always been bad characters in every society - can't be as easy as saying were they smacked or not.

So did we, Aloha - DH was talking about a naughty step for DS in the future (no need atm), but he loves the bottom step so much he goes and sits on it now (practises standing up and sitting down on it - lol!) and puts his shoes and coat all ready to go out on it too, so don't think that'll work

I'm not saying I haven't ever felt the impulse to hit out. Small children take you to places emotionally you don't want to go and didn't know existed IME.

Dh is far more impatient with the kids than I am,but he has never raised a hand even as a threat. I honestly don't think it would cross his mind.

Is there a smacker who wants to answer re hair-pulling or pinching, btw?

I was also smacked as a child and I have never forgotten it either and I am DEFINITELY far, far less close to my parents as a consequence. I don't trust them and I love them much less. I know people will say that they don't feel like that, but I won't take the risk with my kids.

Personally I think any disipline/punishment is worng when the child has simply made a mistake. I think that too many people say - oooh I don't smack so I must be a good parent, but they don't
a) explain prior to a punishment what the consequences will be
b) shout at their children as much if not more.

So I am with QofQ in that smacking as PART of disiplining your child can be an effective punishment.

I also remember my mum smacking a couple of times but it somehow wasn't scarey or humiliating.

of course i am not saying smacking = paedophilia.

(and i am not saying all the worst yobs got smackied, I'm saying some of them almost certainly did and so i do not believe smacking is a cure for yob culture.)

i am also not saying "because i was smacked by a sick parent, all smacking is equally sick". i do think it's sick though.

i suppose my point is that smacking children is this time-honoured tradition and that allows all kinds of unpleasant things a foothold - nasty violence, abuse, sick people getting their kicks, frustrated parents being allowed to let off steam by hitting their kids - all wrong, IMO.

hunker's point
"What if the smack was a pinch or a hair-pull? If it was the same amount of pain inflicted as the smack you'd use?"

sums it up. what if someone prosed displining small children by sticking a pin in their hand (only a small one at acceptable moments, it would hardly leave a mark!) or burning them momentarily on a hot iron, or poking them in the eye, or something. we'd all think that was horrible, wouldn't we?

as for what happened to me, well some innate sense of justice told me my dad was way out of line (he never made any sense for a start - probably because he was just indulging his own whims) and it did not make me think hitting was ok, quite the opposite. so there is hope for smacked kids; that's something.

I never leave a mark on DS when I smack him - infact once a few weeks back the cheekyy little b*gger turned round and said to me afterwards when we were discussing why he got a smack. "You tickled me" .

Pinching or hair pulling (if their hair was long enough to get hold of) would hurt a lot more.

Am going mad - paraphrasing & misunderstanding quotes of other peoples quotes.
I am off now & will always differ in my opinion from those who smack.
Maybe the question of the thread should have been "what are the reasons for smacking"

Like I say, if it was the same amount of pain inflicted. It seems that to smack is OK, because it's almost more "open" - but a pinch seems sly and hair-pulling is spiteful - or perhaps childish? How about a flick on the earlobe?

beatie, I'm not judging your parentign techniques, I already said I wasn't sayign you were airy fairy. I'm just discussing different approaches to a given situation. We have different viewpoints, because I would see standing in the carpark as giving in, if I wanted to get home. I personally would be boiling over if I was kept standing there while I have three other kids in the car waiting to get home.

I often get exasperated with my kids, I just choose to deal with it in different ways. If you can raise your children to be well adjsuted individuals without smacking and you are happy with the way you are doing it then that is great. I don't believe my children would be as well behaved as they are if I never raised my voice or smacked them.

spidermama - thank you, and don't worry i am not suddenly sharing my unpleasant experiences here for the first time! i have had lots of help and feel well-adjusted these days. i have to say though i have two sisters and i'm afraid the effect on them (and the abuse) was worse, and in one case you could say it is still casting a very long shadow.

Smacking and screaming and shouting on their own (as they often go together when used as the sole disciplines) rarely work. Generaly because in most of those situations the child doesn't get any praise for when they're good either.

My DS1 gets lots of praise when he's been good (he made me proud yesterday after the After School Service at Church, without ANY prompting at all he went up to the ladies helping serve out the cakes and biscuits and said "thankyou for the lovely food" ).

By the sounds of it, a lot of the very anti-smackers didn't have parents that smacked, but that lashed out and physically abused them. I'd never dream of using "something" other than the tips of my fingers to smack my children with!

beatie - with the car seat thing. DD is a pita about being strapped in the seat atm. If we're on the way to school I really don't have time to indulge it, so I tickle her belly. She moves away from my hand (so, into the seat) and I get the belt done up before she recovers. It feels a bit sneaky because she can't help moving (or having hysterical giggles) but it's better than getting p'd off every car trip! It's taken a couple of weeks, but we've now gone from fighting every time I try to get her in the car, to once or twice a week. Worth a try? DD's 2 btw

With regard to hair pulling - My DD did it to me once in a fit of terrible twos temper. I did it back to her (without ripping out handfuls like she did me) and she hasnt done it since.

Aloha, that was not directed at you BTW I know you are a perfect parent ;)

In answer to hair pulling, pinching tbh that is far more painful than the smacks I have given (bar one which to this day I regret HUGELY)

Oh Crunchie - so, so far from it! I wish. I go to bed racked with guilt quite often. I don't want to add anything else to my burden of shame

oh, now we're having a debate about what hurts the most!!! the point is, smacking is inflicting pain on your beloved child!!! hunker's question (i think hunker?) invited us to imagins the same pain beong inflicted a different way to see if it sounded so acceptable.

I certainly wasn't abused or beaten. But I still love my parents a LOT less because they smacked me. That is my key reason for not smacking my kids. You just don't know what they'll think of you for doing it.

oh for gods sake.

a smack - not beating the shit out of a kid.

any sensible person knows that smacking is not done when you have the temper.

and on the question of yobs and smacking - i tend to disagree - i think the parents dont give a shit enough to enforce any structure.

laligo - your memories are linked to something far more sinister and takes it out of context in this argument.

i flatly refuse to accept the argument that smacking is linked in any way to sexual titilation. - when done on the bottom.
everything ould be construde as sexual - dont eat a banana - dont wear high heels, nurses and your uniforms - beware -. very tenuos link IMO.

mothers who smack their children all the time find it an ineffective tool - it doesn't do the job - no ofcourse phychological punishments are much worse " ait til your father gets home" - yeah 6 hours of wondering what the f*ck dads gonna do - or how angry dads gonna be when he finds out what i did - not appropriate either.

IMO phychological punishments are much harsher. smacking like any other parenting tool used in the correct way can be effective IMO. IMO. IMO!!!!

Quick question - if smacking (in smackers opinions) doesn't hurt and isn't humilating, what do you think makes it work? What is the punishment aspect?

As much as I respect the posters on this thread I do think you are deluding yourselves.