Fucking hell!

[QuackQuackSqueak]

Having a bad morning and need a rant.

Why when you ask a 5yo to not jump on the bed as there are glasses of water on bedside cabinet and also light hangs low and is glass, would they say "no". Not really no I won't but more in a "no you're wrong" sort of voice. She does this all the time and I don't know where to go from there as it's not defiant exactly and it's not a question as to why it's dangerous which I could easily explain. I find it really weird and it drives me crazy. My DH has just resorted to "just do what you are told" or "just do what you are told when we say something is dangerous and we can talk about why afterwards". A year later though we still get that weird response. Not just about that but about lots of things.

Why when you tell said 5yo not to announce "I'm finished!" when they have had enough dinner or to repeat "I'm finished, I'm finished, I'm finished, I'm finished, I'm finished, I'm finished, I'm finished, I'm finished" until they get a response (usually angry by then), why would they keep doing it? Even when you explain at every meal time that it's because when they say "I'm finished" their little sibling stops eating too and little sibling doesn't eat enough at the moment. So you tell them not to do it and why every day or at least most days why would they keep doing it? Because they forget? That would seem likely as she really genuinely looks suprised when she gets told off (attention span of a knat!) Is it for attention? That would makes sense too as I don't think she gets as much one on one as she would like.

Sometimes I just don't get it! This parenting thing is so hard and she is such a tricky one!

Actually I think I partially know the answer to the first one. She says "no" in a "no you are wrong" way because she thinks we are wrong . . . about everything! She questions everything we say and argues abuot everything and often has pretty good arguments in fact. On the way to school this morning I was thinking that it seems a bit like she is quite arogant. She has always been like this. Is this normal? Does anyone else have a child like this?

Sounds normal to me.

I'm not sure why you can't explain the jumping on the bed thing.
And if she's doing as she is told then that's not a problem.

With the dinner, maybe remind her before she starts to eat to not shout "finished" and remind her about her younger sibling needing to finish their meal etc.

Not unusual for young children to question everything. It's how they learn a lot of the time. If they are not told, how would they know. The repeating yourself bit is frustrating but eventually that phase either passes or they get to understand.

Hope your morning improves :)

It's not that I can't explain why she shouldn't jump on the bed (I can and have done many, many times) but why she would say "no (you are wrong)". It's infuriating.

About dinner. We tell her everyday at meal times. Sometimes we can see she is about to finish and we say "don't say it . . .!" and she pauses and says it anyway!

Also she never ever stops. She talks, asks for thing, complains, moans, argues says "no (you're wrong)" all day every day about absolutely everything! I think I'm exhausted.

It depends how much you allow her to question, dd (also 5) will question certain things but if it's something I know she knows I don't argue with her I just remind her that she knows this and I will make her tell me why she shouldn't be doing whatever it is she's doing at that time

Ask her why she thinks you are wrong. If she has an answer then you can correct her view and if she hasn't then she has to believe you until she has.:o
Or, just take the 'no' at face value and ignore any implication.

Sounds exactly like my dd1 and I sympathise enormously. She has just turned 5 and has an argument for everything and like your dd her arguements are often quite convincing.

She does the thing at mealtimes too and we have a 2 year old who has to copy everything dd1 does. DD2 now starts saying she is stuffed after a couple of bites of food because this is what dd1 does.

I know what you mean about it being difficult to handle. In a lot of ways dd1 is a very well behaved child but it is hard to get through to her in the moment because she needs a cohesive argument from us on why she needs to do/not do something. It is exhausting.

I'm not sure if it is looking for attention. I am a SAHM and spend a lot of time with dd1. We do things together quite a bit. I think it is just the way her brain works. She is very curious about the world and can't easily be put off with a simple answer. DH is constantly having to explain how volcanoes, tornadoes, lightening etc. etc. work.

not sure but i have experience of a family whose child is on the ADD scale who sounds similar. Doesn't seem to have the ability to stop the same behaviours over and over.

it is normal in some ways, a stage perhaps? tho you say she has always been this way.

Oh by fudging crikey this is my life at the moment OP. DD2 is 6 I gave this note to her teacher yesterday and waiting to hear:

Dear Mrs Lovely pants (not real name)

I?m hoping you can pass on some advice to help dd2 and I enjoy each other a bit more. We are not having our best fun at the moment.
It is frustrating her to have a mother who doesn?t agree with her strong opinion that she is right all the time; that people who are talking to each other shouldn?t immediately be quiet to listen to her if she decides she needs to speak, right now; or to be outraged if she is exposed for changing a message to her father from me to one that better suits her ends.
Spending as much time with her as you do, and not having verbalised any complaints ? you are evidently very wise and good and could pass on some tips I?m sure. I try to let her make choices whenever I can offer them.

Would you have a moment before the end of the week?

Yours in hope.

Dukes.
_

She is so confrontational and gets in a fury if I a) don't respond to a question IMMEDIATELY b) give her the answer she is looking for despite not enough info in the question c) don't appear totally enthused by every request.

That frigging platitide 'a mother's place is in the wrong' has just popped into my head.

I spend a lot of time at the moment trying to supress tears or rage. It's a phase, it's a phase, it's a phase. If I get anywhere with teach I'll let you know.

Dukes - think you should copywrite your letter - ds (6 in a couple of weeks) is currently driving me up the wall with this'attitude' especially the talking on top of everyone else. have seriously contemplated giving him chewing gum in a hope of occupying his jaws

re the no thing OP , DS did have a phase of this and it did calm down for a while (or maybe I just learnt to ignore it more) but unfortuantely has reappeared ..... i did end up going la la la la once - one thing that helped was the how to talk so kids will listen book technique of going fantastical - so I would do something like saying the bed was saying ouch ouch ouch as it hated being jumped on and how would she feel if furniture started jumping on her - something like that anyway - the book explains it better

sympathies though tis hard going - ds teacher just says he is very articulate !

eugenefitzherbert We have the same child! Weird! Even the volcano type thing! My DH spends ages telling her about stuff and she loves it!

piratecat It's funny you say that as a while ago I did an online ADD/ADHD test thing. She wasn't even borderline though. A couple of things flagged up but I can't remember what they were. Next time I did it though they didn't so I guess it was a bit to do with how she'd been that day, so how extreme I was feeling that her behaviour was right then.

DukesOfTripHazard I like that letter. I have asked dds teacher before on how she deals with the constant questions. We also get that thing where she asks a question but it doesn't quite make sense (or at least I don't understand it) or I am not giving the answer that she is hoping for and she just keeps on asking and asking and getting frustrated and telling me I'm wrong. I must admit that I get a bit annoyed which I'm sure doesn't help as it's feels like I'm being attacked!

She's very well behaved in a lot of ways and she's so lovely and creative. I wish I could be more patient though. My DD has no patience and I can see that she gets it from me!

" I must admit that I get a bit annoyed which I'm sure doesn't help as it's feels like I'm being attacked!

She's very well behaved in a lot of ways and she's so lovely and creative. I wish I could be more patient though. My DD has no patience and I can see that she gets it from me!"

Snap! Snappity snap snap snap.

Maybe acting lessons. I need to inhabit the character of someone who is patient.

Excellent thread title, by the way.

DD is like this, she's pushing my buttons cos she knows she can. Also, she's testing her boundaries.

Just lock her in the understairs cupboard, like I do.

DD1 tested boundaries. DD stomps on them mercilessly creating fractures across parental joie de vivre.

it's good to share....

If Mrs lovelypants does have words of wiz, how am I going to hear them with Mrs need-to-know flappy ears in tow. She won't let anything pass her by? If I palm her off it will be the Spanish inquisition as to why.

When will we look back and laugh?

Fucking hell indeed

Oh Oh Oh I have one of these too. DS is 6 and actually in many ways he is an easy going well behaved boy. He doesn't really do naughty things but fuck me can he argue the toss over everything and anything. Even when I'm trying to be all patient and explain things he's butting in and arguing.

Interestingly though one of his frequent phrases to me when it's all gone tits up and I've lost it is "you never listen"

I think I don't to fair I just want him to do as his asked without question my every word!!!!!!!!!

This is the question which has been trying my patience for the last few days. So far none of my answers have been satisfactory so she just keeps asking.

'Why did little-boy-x throw little-boy-y's stickers in the the bin?'

It happened in school so I didn't witness the sticker throwing. Apparently it wasn't because x doesn't like y, it wasn't because he thought it was funny or any other reason I can think of. HELP

Answers on a postcard please.

Three questions is good. As is code word.

Connor I am laughing at your post. A wry laugh. A wry but desperate laugh.

My mum (81, ex teacher. Superb woman) eventually lost it with DD on Sunday and bellowed 'Oh just shut up' at her. She felt awful. DD had the last laugh though. She ate the little chocolate my mum always keeps inside a very sweet bird ornament.

DD doesnt know we know. Nobody eats granny's bird's chocolate.....

Eugene that sounds melon twisting. Two word answer suggestion: 'Ask him'.

For the bed type situation I am not asking you, I am TELLING you

Dinner - make her sit somewhere else, somewhere boring and tell her YOU will go and get her when you are all finished your dinner. Tell her if she comes in before you go to get her it will be straight to bed and obviously follow that through. She is well old enough to do as she has been told and if she's spoiling dinner for you all (especially the younger DC not eating their dinner because of her) there needs to be a consequence. In a few days you can ask her if she's ready to eat at the table with you again...

Honestly, it sounds tough, but you can either do something short lived and tough or carry on asking/pleading/threatening for ages and make everyone miserable...

Eugene - because he's naughty.

ChippingIn "do something short lived and tough or carry on asking/pleading/threatening for ages and make everyone miserable..."

I think that's pretty wise. We, the parents of these jibber/jabbering mini pol pots are engaging in the debate after all. Maybe some tough adult stance stuff is what it needs.

What do you think OP?

I agree on the tougher stance but I still find myself getting sucked in more often than not. I feel we do too much talking and explaining in this house instead of the 'that's why' answer I remember from my mum.

ChippingIn I wasn't sure about telling her this other child is naughty. I can't be sure she wouldn't tell the boy or the teacher I said he was naughty.

eugenefitzherbert, I would turn the question on the child. "What a good question DD, why do you think boy x threw boy y stickers in the bin ?"

My DD is very prone to asking questions about things which happened outside my sight and expecting me to know everything about the incident So I get her to answer the questions for me ;)