just something to share

[threeangels]

I know war has been a lot more on many minds lately. I found this sight and wanted to share it with anyone who is interested.

I also want to say that any mumsnetters who have any family members going to war along with everyone else in the world will be in my thoughts and prayers.

Are We Nearing the End Times?
Did you know all the signs Jesus said would signify His second coming are occurring in our time?
The Rev. Billy Graham, Pope John Paul II and numerous Orthodox Jewish rabbis have all said they believe that the coming of the Messiah is very near. Why? Because so many Bible prophecies are being fulfilled.

When Jesus' disciples asked what would signal His return, He gave them several signs to watch for. He also taught that the time immediately before His coming would be known as the "beginning of sorrows" (Matt. 24:8), which in English means the "onset of labor pains."

Jesus was saying the signs of His coming would start out as mild pangs spaced widely apart like human labor and then gradually become closer together and more intense, like the birth process, until this seven-year period of suffering and judgment would culminate in the coming of the Messiah.

The Signs
Consider the signs that Jesus said would be the prelude to His return and notice how they've begun to occur in our time:

False Christs The past few decades have witnessed a huge upsurge in charismatic leaders claiming to be Christ or the Jewish Messiah, including the Moonies' Rev. Sun Moon, the Buddhist Dalai Lama, the Hindu Krishnamurti, and the Bahais' Baha Ullah, to name a few. Collectively, their followers number in the u millions. . Jesus replied to them, "See that none misleads you; for many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will mislead many." Matt. 24:4,5
War War in the original Greek of Matthew 24 is ethnos, meaning ethnic or racial war. A recent editorial in Time magazine reported there are presently 67 wars being fought around the planet and most of them are ethnic wars, including the recent slaughter in Rwanda and Bosnia. According to the National Defense Council Foundation, conflicts around the globe have doubled since 1989. "... you shall hear of wars and rumors of wars..." Matt. 24:6,7
Famine The LA Times reported recently that more than one billion people suffer from serious malnutrition, exacerbated in the past months by worldwide drought. More than 35 million people living mostly in the southern states of Africa suffer from acute hunger and are threatened with imminent death. "There will be famines..." Matt. 24:7.
Pestilence The rate of infectious diseases has increased 58% since 1980, according to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control. Diseases once considered conquered are now reappearing, sometimes in drug-resistant forms. AIDS has become a worldwide scourge, and viral diseases such as Ebola pose an international threat because of transcontinental flight. "There will be pestilences." Matt. 24:7.
Earthquakes The number of dangerous earthquakes measuring 6.0 or greater on the Richter scale has been steadily increasing since the 1950s when there were nine. In the 1960s, there were 13. In the 1970s, 51. In the 1980s, 86. In the 1990s more than100 such serious earthquakes have already been recorded, according to the LA Herald Examiner. "There will be...earthquakes in various places." Matt. 24:7.
The Seas and Waves Roaring The Associated Press reports that the most recently completed Atlantic hurricane season produced 11 hurricanes, 8 tropical storms, and $7.7 billion in damage. Serious flooding has also occurred recently in the U.S., Russia, Japan, Mexico, China, Europe, Korea, and the United Kingdom, according to Barron's. "There will be bewilderment at the roaring of the sea and waves." Luke 21:25.
Great Signs in the Heavens The 1994 comet Shoemaker-Levy 9, a string of 21 space rocks that slammed into Jupiter with the power of thousands of nuclear explosions, could be a heavenly sign. Jupiter is the mythological king of the planets and in Christian symbolism it is a representation of Christ. The 21 explosions are reminiscent of the 21 judgments that will befall Earth during the seven-year period that ushers in the coming of the Messiah, according to the Book of Revelation. The comet Hyakutake has recently lit up the night sky, and what promises to be the spectacular comet Hale-Bopp, first sighted in 1995, is scheduled to come nearest to our sun in the spring of 1997. "Great signs shall there be from heaven." Luke 21:11.
Violence Since 1960 violent crime has increased in the U.S. by 560%, according to FBI statistics, and the number of reported cases of child abuse in the U.S. has risen from 670,000 in 1976 to nearly 3 million in the 1990s. Other nations are experiencing similar dramatic increases in violent crime, reports the San Francisco Chronicle. "...as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be." Mt. 24:37. ("And God said unto Noah, '...the earth is filled with violence...'" Gen. 6:13.)
Gospel Preached to the Whole World Pope John Paul II has traveled to 70-plus nations during his pontificate, preaching the gospel to millions. The Rev. Billy Graham recently conducted a week-long crusade from Costa Rica translated into every language on the planet and broadcast via satellite around the globe. With Communism's collapse, Christian radio and TV are now reaching into almost every nook and cranny of planet Earth. "...and this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached to the whole world and then the end shall come." Mt. 24:14.
All of the signs that Jesus said would precede His return seem to be occurring in our time.

Other Prophecies Fulfilled
Other prophecies relating to this seven-year period of judgment, coming from many parts of the Bible, have also begun to be fulfilled:

Israel reborn as a nation in 1948 (Ezek. 4:3-6, Lev. 26:18)
Israel surrounded by hostile Arab countries (Psalm 83:4-8)
Jerusalem inhabited by the Jews (Luke 21:24)
Israel negotiates a peace treaty with her enemies (Daniel 9:27)
Doomsday weapons threaten earth (Joel 2:3)
Ecological devastation occurs (Rev. 11:18)
The Roman Empire revives as the European Union (Daniel 2:40-44)
Heresies become widespread (II Thess. 2:3)
Russia rises as a military power (Ezek. 38:1-12)
A hole in the ozone layer develops (Rev. 16:8.9)
TV communications are global (Revelation 11:9,10)
Satanic and cultic activity arises (I Tim. 4:1)
Sub-dermal microchips for identification purposes proposed by the U.S. military (Rev. 13:16,17)
Massive increases in wealth occur (Jas. 5:3)
GATT and World Trade Organization become possible forerunners of a world government (Rev. 13:7)
Asia possesses resources for a 200-million-man army (Rev. 9:14-16)
The Euphrates River can be dried up (Rev. 16:12-v 14) and a military highway linking Asia to the Middle East is being completed (Rev. 9:14)
Knowledge vastly increases (Dan. 12:4)
Russian and Ethiopian Jews return to Israel (Jer. 23:7,8; Zeph. 3:10)
The Hebrew language is recovered (Zeph. 3:9)
Jerusalem is rebuilt in nine specific directions (Jer. 31:38-40)
Levites and priests train for Temple service (Ezek. 43:14,15)
Israel's rainfall increases dramatically (Joel 2:23) and the country becomes fertile and blossoms (Isa. 27:6)
Men become more selfish, arrogant, abusive, ungrateful, fierce and treacherous (II Tim. 3:2,3)
Where We Fit In
Referring to these signs, Jesus said, "When these things begin to come to pass, then look up and lift up your heads, for your redemption draws near." (Luke 21:24-28).

If we are approaching that seven-year period that precedes the second coming of Christ - and all the signs indicate we are - the Bible tells us those years of judgment upon the earth will be accompanied by untold human suffering.

But believers in Christ who have sincerely placed their trust in Him can be certain of the redemption to which Jesus referred, for He promised His followers that "God has not destined us for wrath but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ" (1 Thess. 5:9).

So where does that leave you? Are you one of God's children who's been called to believe in His Son but has rejected each invitation? Where are you going to spend the seven years of God's wrath? And the rest of eternity?

Jesus told us that "God so loved the world that He gave His only Son, so that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life" (John. 3:16). But He went on to say that "...he who does not believe is already condemned because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God" (John. 3:18).

Is it too late for you to find salvation?
Not yet. God designed an "escape hatch" for us by offering His only Son to die a miserable death on a cross so that our sins could be blotted out in our Creator's sight and we could be reconciled to Him.

All we have to do is accept His Son as the perfect sacrifice for our sins. By doing this our loving Father promised that, "Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, nor heart imagined the wonderful things God has prepared for those who love Him" (1 Cor. 2:9).

Would you like to receive those "wonderful things" in the everlasting life Christ promised His followers? Do you want to know how to accept God's Son? It's simple. All you have to do is sincerely pray this prayer: "Lord Jesus, I know I'm a sinner and need Your forgiveness. I believe that you died for my sins and I want to turn away from my wrongdoing. Right now I'm inviting you to come into my heart and life. I want to trust and follow You, making You my Lord and Savior. Amen."

What Next?
If you prayed this and meant it, you need to start talking to God through prayer, reading the Scriptures daily to get to know God better, and find a church where Christians like you worship Christ and where the good news of the Bible is being preached.

Remember, you are now Christ's representative to a needy world that appears to be embarking upon the period of unimaginable suffering that precedes Christ's second coming. You can help lead others to the Truth you've discovered and enable them to avoid the agony to come. Don't put this off. Today is the day of salvation. Tomorrow may be too late. God bless you on your journey.

If you would like to pursue a more in-depth study of Bible prophecy, books by Hal Lindsey, Grant Jeffrey, Jack Van Impe, Peter LaLonde, and John Walvoord among others are available at most Christian bookstores.

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Other Christian Information Sites on the WWW:
ICL Net: Christian Literature on the Net
Bible Gateway
Christian Coalition Home Page
Jewish and Christian Links
Lions Den
Jack Van Impe Home Page
Zola Levitt Presents

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Email Duncan Long
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Well - It does look like I am the minority on mumsnet. I have already thought this in the past. I think I should probally just retire from mumsnet.

I do want to say thank you to all of you who have helped me in the past and I sure did need it. Many of you were great and I so do appreciate it. Wish I could continue but I truely don't feel comfortable at this point. But thanks again

Threeangels it would be a shame if you did that. You are as entitled to your views as anyone else. And I'm sure that at your current stage you could get something useful out of Mumsnet. Wouldn't you like to have something to contribute to the birth announcement thread in a few months?

Threeangels - please don't withdraw from Mumsnet entirely even if you feel unable to contribute on this thread. Religion and politics are subjects which they always say that you should avoid talking about - doubly difficult to discuss on the net without offending.

Although some of us do not agree with your beliefs we do respect your right to have them. We hope that you respect our right to disagree.

Just remember that Mumsnet is primarily about trying to being a mum and doing the best by our kids.

Threeangels, please don't go. Personally, I think Christianity has grown of late, especially since Alpha.
It may seem as if God has been thrown out like the garbage, but I think people are just a mixture of: embarrassed to admit they believe in him, and mindful of joining a faith with such narrow 'rules'. I know lots of people who believe there may well be a God, and accept that Jesus Christ lived, but who can't accept that some will be saved and others not, purely on the basis of belief. The kindly muslim granny who has helped people all her life but may not be saved because she was brought up muslim, versus the unkind waster who finds Christ at the 11th hour. I can't buy into the unfairness of that and if those are the rules of entry, I don't want to join. Yet I believe in God!
I just think we've all got hold of the wrong end of the stick and we shouldn't always take the bible literally. Christianity shows us a good way to live - I agree there.

Bossykate, were there really racist threads? I've only been on mumsnet since last June, so haven't yet seen any. (What shall I search under?!)

threeangels, your post crossed with mine. Please don't leave altogether. There are lots of Christians on mumsnet, you are certainly not the odd one out. There was once a thread on religion where the christian was really badgered and almost ridiculed, but she stuck it out and fought her corner admirably. I think you would feel better if you did the same. Nobody here is being disrespectful of Jesus - we are just arguing about interpretation, that's all.
I've always valued your posts. I don't retract what I said though - I spoke honestly and I'm willing to be challenged and corrected.
Best wishes.

Droile - I think they were individual racist posts on other threads - ie the discussions moved in that direction. No point in searching because I think anything deemed racist is removed by Tech.

Droile, they were generally deleted as soon as Mumsnet was made aware of their existence. They tended to consist of one offensive remark followed by a string of angry responses!
Threeangels, as the others have said, don't go on account of this thread. You have started a very important and thought-provoking discussion. You may be interested to know that the Church of England and other Christian churches in the UK are more openly critical of our national policy on this war than churches in the USA seem to be. The emphasis here in my experience (CofE) is on praying for peace and the welfare of all individuals caught up in conflict.

threeangels NO, don't go.

I, for one, always look forward to seeing your name on threads. You are one of the people I think I would like to be friends with in real life (atlantic crossing, no object!) Please don't go.

threeangels, I completely disagree with you about Bush, but please don't go! I always enjoy reading your contributions on mumsnet. I think there are lots of Christians around here too.

Threeangels - I would be very upset if soemthing I said made you feel yuo wnte to leave. You have posted something which has caused a good debate - always welcome. But then, I kind of enjoy the rows I know my posts can appear curt but that it because I reading and posting furtively at work so can't alwasy elaborate - poor excuse, I know, but hope you'll stick around.

Droile - I realy don't think that Bloss (who I presemu you mean) was ridiculed at all. I found that debate the most invigorating there has been on mumsnet - doubt it changed anyone's minds, but very respectful.

Debates about strongly held view will always be heated because if you believe something to be right, by definition, you believe someone else's view to be wrong. So, I vow to never believe that I am right (difficult for me, because I am ) I shall live by the words of Albert Camus:
"The evil that is in the world comes from ignorance, and the greatest ignorance of all is that which believes it knows everything". And that includes me!!!

Urgh! My spelling mistakes!

Was it bloss? Perhaps ridicule was a poor choice of word. I think some rudeness went on - not directed at bloss, but about her beliefs. Anyway, she stood up to it well, is all I meant.

threeangels - haven't had time to read all the thread, but as a fully paid up born again charismatic member of the church of England (!!) I would say not only do you have a duty to witness, but also to get into scuffles, of a verbal nature, obviously. I wont comment now about your position, because I haven't read all the thread, but will say if you have conviction you should stand your corner, everyone here is very respectful of individuals beliefs, and that having an informed debate from a position of faith will never damage your faith, but may help to widen your world view and comprehension of how many non christians and christian of other denominations think - this can only be a good thing. WWJD? I don't think you'd see Him walking out of the temple courts, would you?

kaz33, boy, you really have a downer on catholics don't you? the one religion it's totally acceptable to slate in public...

Three angels
As a comitted anti-Christian (I was brought up in the Catholic church and got turned off by the utter hypocricsy I saw there) I completely disagree with the views you have expressed on this thread.But I completely respect your right to have them, and I really really don't want you to leave - you are a very valued member of Mumsnet. I think one of your other issues may have resolved itself now, so please please come back and stand your ground.

Oops - sorry bk - posts crossed

I'm a christian too, and have to agree that the church here is mostly being outspoken against war. Ours certainly is! What worries me about George W is that all CHristians will be tarred with the same brush, and especially Arab christians in the Middle East will become soft targets, as has already happened in Pakistan.
I think we do have a responsibility to stand up for what we beleive in. I think that most people have more respect for someone of any faith who isn't easily swayed, who is prepared to stand up for the faith they have.
There are quite a lot of Christians on Mumsnet. I dont often contribute to faith threads as I find it fairly difficult to put things into words that won't offend. I probably have some beleifs that the majority here wouldn't like, but they are mien and important to me!

Sorry Bossykate - its all organised religion I dislike. I suppose I just have a little more experience of Catholicism.

Anyway I will now retire.

threeangels- I think some of this comes down to cultural differences. I belong to email lists based in the UK and the US, and I have noticed that the US lists mention God a lot. The UK ones never! So for members in the UK strong religious views can be novel and I guess almost offensive. Definitely a cultural difference.

Japan is the most unreligious (areligious??) place I have lived. Shinto is seen as tradition, and buddhist beliefs are accepted (reincarnation etc) but not really followed. People make offerings at their family shrine, but it doesn't really exist as organised religion. However I would say the Japansese as a nation have a stronger sense of morality than the UK. Maybe a stronger sense of group morality. Hmmmmm

Always interesting to compare differences.

"What do they know of England, who only England know"

ThreeAngels - your decision to quit Mumsnet is rather dramatic, no-one here has been rude to you that I can see. Rather people have said what an interesting discussion you have provoked. I am a fellow Christian too and have agreed with you lots of times, so tell me now, are you just looking for an excuse to quit Mumsnet? Leave on a high note rather than fade into the distance? I don't believe your reasons you see. Why do you not feel comfortable?

I am a Catholic and we do get a lot of bad press. People judge religion sometimes by the bad examples set by others. I like organised religion as I like sharing my views with others, praying with others and being in a community environment. But I understand why many don't.

As for extremists, well yes they do give religion a bad name, but as most accounts of the Bible are to do with mercy, peace and love - (second commandment being Love Thy Neighbour) I doubt they are as religious as they confess. They are so consumed by hatred they are blinded as to the truth. Jesus also predicted this, he said there would be many claiming to work in his name, which were nothing to do with him. Course I guess a lot of it is to do with whether or not you believe in the devil, which I do.

Lets not go there, rhubarb.
Well, others may if they like, but I don't care to.

I love the English reserve about their religion. Please continue to lead by example, not prosthesizing (horribly mispelled, sorry).

we have had religeos discussions before and very interesting they are too.
i think they always come downt o the same thing for me as the same points are nearly always raised. war and religeon - we all know that wars fought int he name of religeon are rarly really to do with religeon.
there is a distinction which is nearly always missed in these discussions and that is the remarkable difference between FAITH and RELIGEON. i chose to express my faith through the catholic religeon, i have come to see the hypocrisy as pru said int he catholic religeon ( and the pope really does my head in) i cannot argue for the catholic religeon becuase although it continues to do magnificent work in poor areas of the world it has had a bloody history and one which i cannot defend. howeveri still chose to practise my faith through catholicism. recognising this fact allows me to be non judgemental of other religeons, becuase other people excersise their faiths through other religeons. basicallymost decent people aim to be good as a person and lead a good life whether they are religeos or not. so i object to the christians knocking on my door handing me a video and asking "if i fooooooound jjjjjjjjesus christ, for without jjjjjjeesus chhhhhrist, i will not be allowed to enter the gates of heaven" well actually yes i found him - i blieve in him and i think to myself how lucky i am to have him in my life - however my husband doesnt believe in him and i refuse to believe that because of this he will not be allowed to enter the gates of heaven - as he is more decent and less judgemental than most christians i know!

on another note - people walking out of mumsnet and slamming the preverbial door - cant you just leave without saying "am leaving" just dont post anymore. sorry to sound harst but it does smakc of a 3 year old having a tantrum and slamming the door to get your attention " oh please dont go"!! oh please - go if you want o for goodness sake! - so if your annoyed either fight your corner, say your view or dont log on any more.
right i am leaving mumsnet as i am so upset...... i might log on later to see how many people have begged me to stay though!!purrrrrlllease!!!!!
sorry you cant get rid of me - hubby tried rat poison and that didnt work.

ks- I used to live in a village with quite an evangelical church (CofE). They still have regular times when they try to go out and convert. In fact I love going to that church (and I'm pretty much a non-believer). It's a very warm and caring place and there is a great sense of peace in that (very ancient) building. . My dad was invited to a church "discussion group" during one of their conversion drives. It started with someone saying "Jesus lives" and everyone said -yes- except my dad - who said "well no- he lived certainly- but no longer". Someone then said "name me someone who has had as many followers as Jesus Chrsit", so my dad said "mohammed" I think the meeting began to go downhill at that stage and discussion groups were changed to prayer meetings.

So whilst I grew up surrounded by a very active (and lovely it has to be said) church. I chose to get married in that Church - it is a special place- and no I don't wnat to get into a discussion about hypocrisy! I still find it strange and I feel slightly uncomfortable when I come across strong religious views from strangers when I'm minding my own business. I suspect many in the UK feel the same. For American's though I think expressing Christian religion to all and sundry is fairly normal.