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Welcome to the Seventh Heaven Tea Room (BYOB. Biscuits, crisps and cake provided)

978 replies

Catitainahatita · 22/04/2009 04:07

Hello and welcome to the seventh incarnation of the tearoom.

If you have found us by chance and/or curiousity you must know that the tearoom is a virtual safe haven for all those seeking a friendly word, a good cuppa and plenty to snack on. By virtue of its magic nature, no food can cause any physical damage, so chocolate, alcohol, transfat and all such can be consumed guilt- (and magically calorie-) free.

We have a wide range of soft-furnishing to relax on; a lovely garden with a swing and a ha ha; a variety of animals; a spa and (for some unknown reason) an apidistra.

Everyone is welcome, if you have one child, ten or none at all. We are a tolerant and fisticuffs-free zone. Instead we employ our energies swooning at Mellors the Gardner cum handiman thinking a silly things to get up to.

Please come in and say hello. You never know, you may end up joining us ...

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
Jacksmama · 11/05/2009 07:02

The Bison likes potatoes?? Really?

Huh.

amber32002 · 11/05/2009 07:19

ooo, now my explanations are always a bit of a worry in case I mis-explain, but...

On the SN board there's a) mums who are hopping mad at life and how it is for them thanks to child's disability
b) mums who want to have a general debate and want to look at controversial material as part of that debate
c) mums who need advice on general things
d) mums who need a really quiet safe place because they're not able to handle the Big Debates - often people with ASDs. I think there's about 8 mums so far on there with ASDs. Some can handle debates, some can't. Depends on the brain wiring we end up with.

So I asked if anyone had ideas from mumsnet on how we might be able to keep the people with a disability safe enough that they can join in ok. Any ideas at all. Free ideas, quick ideas, anything. Mumsnet suggested separate SN boards in several months time, but that's not a very good solution for me right now, because I need my friends and support right now and it just seems sad that I'd have to wait months to use the service safely enough for me because I have a disability.

I've even offered to help pay for any redesign that people felt would work - e.g. a board for hefty debate and a space for quiet reflection or ordinary questions. So far, nothing. I've offered free training in autism from specialists. Nothing. I've offered free help with the disability policy work if that needs doing. Nothing. Well, not so far anyway.

It would make sense as a strategy if mumsnet didn't want ASD people on here, but I'm sure they do? Is it that we're only allowed on here if we can handle everything that everyone else does? But that's actually impossible for many of us, so by default we end up having to leave, or not joining in. We can't stop being on the autism spectrum and start behaving in totally NT ways, alas. Wheelchair users can't just stand up and walk up a flight of stairs because everyone else can, either.

And there's only so much adapting I can do myself. So I've had to invent my own rather weird system, to see if it works.

The difficult thing for me is that as an employer and school Governor I've had to read every single line of disability law, and I know that if I set up a service, I have to ensure that there's reasonable* access on demand, and that people are safe, and that I don't make the service users pay for the adjustment. Otherwise 'tis against the law.

But what use are laws? It's not as if people with a disability like this have any way to go to a court - we wouldn't cope with the stress. And neither am I saying I'd wish to - it's just a general point about how utterly pointless government laws are in nearly all service provider situations for us.

More tea needed.

  • The House of Lords spent several days debating the precise meaning of the word 'reasonable', without conclusion. There is no case law to help in the case of disability law, because in the last 15 years no person with a disability has the resources or ability to bring a case, espite the legislation being there. Utterly, utterly unfit for purpose. Sigh.
amber32002 · 11/05/2009 07:23

correction - "no person with this disability" rather than "no person with a disability"

Jacksmama · 11/05/2009 07:24

Oh dear.

Thank you for explaining. I hope it wasn't too difficult for you to revisit the whole issue, and I wasn't asking out of mere curiosity. It all sounded very concerning. And it still is for you.

Milk? Sugar? Lemon?

I'm glad we're a combat-free zone here in The Tea Room.

mistlethrush · 11/05/2009 09:22

You would have thought that it should be relatively straight forward to divide the SN section into two - with a non-controvertial support section and a free for all section. Surely that wouldn't take too much to organise. It could be policed by Mellors.

Tea - dogs - believe me, you don't want to have a long-haired dog. Went out for a walk with a collie at the weekend - yuk! Yes my short-haired dog moults and we get short hair everywhere, but at least all the wet and mud just towels off and she doesn't bring lots of dirt into the house.

Hi JM - how's it going?

Did I hear the offer of tea?

amber32002 · 11/05/2009 09:29

It's really easy to make it possible, MT, yes. And free to mumsnet! They'll be racing to take up the offer any moment, I expect.

Mrs A, the Bernese Mountain Dog, shed hair every moment of every day of her life. No matter how much she was groomed, no matter how often we hoovered, we'd turn round to find the floors awash with hair. We could have stuffed pillows with what was shed per week. Short haired dogs are infinitely easier.

Milk with mine, please. I hadn't learned the fine art of lemon in tea until a few years ago, and was really puzzled why people put lemon in a cup with the tea and milk. Well, it turned out they didn't but I'm sure ds's Very Proper Godparents have got over the shock by now...

Racingsnake · 11/05/2009 09:45

Morning all. Back on friend's computer becuase the two hours' work I did yesterday trying to buy train tickets for France in July failed at the very last moment when I pressed the 'pay' button and it wouldn't. We spent the afternoon toying with the idea of driving down to the Mediterannean coast with a two-year old at the height of the holiday season before sanity re-established itself and I'm back on the train tickets. At the moment I am very stresed with the whole thing and feel sick so I am using all possbible delaying tactics.

Tea - can't allow a disparaging word about collies of any kind to go by, having a border collie cross myself. Not as ahiry as some and a wonderful, sensitive, affectionate, needy, whiney dog. Hmm, maybe not for you. Also they need to run and run. But I can be absolutely sure that she would never hurt RAcingPig (although he does get tired of the licking) and she is veyr good at finding him when Wriggle has thrown him into the flowers again. Wriggle's latest trick. Quite gently, but even so, pigs aren't built for flying.

Amber - the only reasons I can think of why MN don't bit your arm off (only metaphorically, no need for body armour) is that a) they don't undertsand asd and don't really know what you are talking about or b) they don't want an outsider offering improving ideas for their MN. Neither of which are very worthy. Shall we get up a petition?

Off to look at scarey (and crap slightly difficient) RailEurope site now. Back soon.

Racingsnake · 11/05/2009 09:47

The typos are obviously a sign of my inner turmoil.

mistlethrush · 11/05/2009 10:15

RS - I agree, journey to S of Frace with 2 yo very scary thought. Good luck with the tickets this time.

MiL has suggested that we Eurostar to Zurich with MJ. I have agreed that it would be possible, but have said that I would fly or go on a different train to the one she's going on with MJ and meet here there . If she thinks that she is up to 8hrs in train with MJ good luck to her is all I can say . We've not had it suggested ever since I said that...

Collies - yes, we had collie crosses and I loved them to bits - both were short haired though - one fairly and one properly - and it really makes a big difference, although there is lots of hair unless you get something like a poodle. It was the long-hairedness that made me go yuk re this other dog!

daisy99divine · 11/05/2009 11:42

Morning all!

tea don't get a bulldog, the slobber! hair is nothing compared to that....

racing I spend my life veering off the raileurope train site - it is so ruddy complicated! hence we end up driving at the last minute. Last year it took us 3 days and two breakdowns to make it. DaisyBoy loved every minute

Algo, Racing truly is a hero amongst pigs isn't he?

amber I am so sorry it is not getting easier, feel a bit at a loss what to suggest other than lurking in the tea room and shoving you into the priest hole when ti gets too much

mistle good idea re HC, going to take it with me for nursery collection - get him when he's tired and defences are low!

daisy99divine · 11/05/2009 11:44

Coffee anyone?

mistlethrush · 11/05/2009 12:11

Are we at soup and a lewd roll time - I think so! Pea and lovage today as in season - at least in terms of the lovage.

Daisy I think that you should leave that roll alone though - certainly when GC is that close!

Daisy - HC seat - definitely. 'Mummy, carry me' - 'Of course dear, just come here, no problem' DB: but better than walking - hey presto!

mistlethrush · 11/05/2009 12:30

I've just seen a message on another thread that says 'Amber has left MN' - I do hope not. Please Amber, if you're still reading bits, stay here with us - it won't be the same without you!

MaryBS · 11/05/2009 13:53

Its true Mistlethrush. I've been exchanging emails with Amber for much of the morning. She specifically requested I let you guys know:

" there was no appetite from the users to change it even a bit to help me until separate boards are set up at some unspecified point in the future (which doesn't help me really - it isolates me from the others) and combined with today's news about the friends dying it's more than I can handle. "

Its no longer a place of support for her.

justaboutspringtime · 11/05/2009 14:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

MaryBS · 11/05/2009 14:39

Amber just wants to say it's not her that thinks "there was no appetite from the users", but that is the message she was getting as to why no help is forthcoming for her.

Sorry, I quoted her out of context...

MadBadandDangerousToKnow · 11/05/2009 14:53

Oh no. I feel really distressed that we have lost Amber over this. I will miss her.

MaryBS and Justa - When next you speak to Amber, please send her my best wishes in whichever format she feels comfortable with - a hug, pat on the shoulder or cheery wave. We will keep the priest hole neat and tidy for her and she'll be welcome to come back if ever she feels able.

Catitainahatita · 11/05/2009 15:26

This is awful, upsetting news. Amber is a valued and much loved member of our little community. We do not want to see her go at all.

Please Justabout and MaryBS tell Amber how much we love her and that we will all miss her terribly. We fervently hope that things change and she might feel able to return to us soon.

In the meantime, what can we do to pressure the powersthatbe here to do something and not let one of their most valuable posters disappear???

This is all too horrible.

OP posts:
CMOTdibbler · 11/05/2009 15:36

I'm really sorry that Amber feels she has to leave MN altogether. Mary/Justa, could you pass on that I'll miss hearing about the dogs/horses and cars. We'll keep the Jeremy Clarkson cutout in case she returns, with a tempting pile of car magazines int he priest hole

Catitainahatita · 11/05/2009 15:39

Also, having now read the other threads, I wanted to add:

My condolences and thoughts to Amber for the loss of her friends.
And, just to say that I hope her DH's tests went well today.

OP posts:
Jacksmama · 11/05/2009 15:58

No no no no no!!!! Don't let Amber leave us!! She can't!

Amber, please come back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dammit, I have in mind starting a thread that says "Jacksmama is flouncing until MN gets off their arse and gives Amber what she needs". Would anyone join me?

Of course I'm not planning on flouncing but we need to do something, we can't just let this happen, this is so unfair!!!!!

daisy99divine · 11/05/2009 16:00

Oh poor AMber, please yes, Justa let her know that we care and will do what we can to provide a priest hole of supplication as and when she needs it

I hope her DH is ok, her son continues to be marvellous and Mr B a joy. Sorry to hear about a friend's death, one more sorry blow

Catitainahatita · 11/05/2009 16:17

I am with you JM. I just think we should consult a bit over the best action to take.

For the most important reason of all: we have to do something that responds to what Amber needs and we must take in to account how our behaviour may affect her.

I have read some of the other threads and am acutely aware that more than this being a problem of Amber not understanding us(which is how she -selflessly, it seems to me- paints it)it is more a problem of us not understanding Amber.

I suspect also that the powersthatbe are also in this situation.

I think that we have a duty as her friends to be aware of this and to educate the powersthatbe in this sense, because otherwise I think a protest will not work very well as they may not understand fully the situation which requires action.

OP posts:
Jacksmama · 11/05/2009 16:28

Catita, yes, you're right.

So what can we do that is realistic and effective*?

Please let's not just let this quietly fade away.

Racingsnake · 11/05/2009 16:29

Anyone who is e-mailing Amber, please tell her that she doesnt have to leave the tea room. Many of us scarcely dare go out onto MN (or are too bored with the pointless controversies because we have lives of our own). Amber is wanted and needed here - she must come back to us!

JM, yes to any action!

My tickets bought and my e-mail back on!