Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Multicultural families

Here's where to share your experience of raising a child or growing up in a multicultural family.

Original poster

Not in the nativity play

226 replies

PrettyHannukahndles · 15/12/2004 16:58

As ds is being brought up Jewish, I chose not to have him perform in his nursery's nativity play next week, but to let him perform in the rest of the nursery's concert. I've learned today that he is now the only child who will not be in the nativity, as all the other non-performing children will not be at nursery that day.

Suddenly he feels left out. I had a talk with the nursery staff, who told me that he needn't come in uniform that day, as all the others would be wearing their costumes. I suggested that he might like to wear a costume as well, so that he will feel more involved. But what sort of costume could he wear? He wants to wear a red-and-white Santa hat with flashing stars (at least, that's what I think he meant by his rather garbled and excited description ). I'm not sure whether that's appropriate - could anyone suggest something?

OP posts:
spacedonkey · 16/12/2004 22:51

I think all religious celebrations should be kept out of schools. If people want to send their kids to a catholic/jewish/lizard men from mars school, it's up to them. By all means teach kids about different faiths, that's fine.

Cinderellascarrieg · 16/12/2004 22:51

AND the Winter Solstice too of course, so as to keep the pagans happy...

aloha · 16/12/2004 22:52

Gosh, arrogant for thinking David Icke is quite, quite mad! That will be me and the rest of the population then!

aloha · 16/12/2004 22:53

Or maybe I should also respect his belief that there is a giant Jewish conspiracy involving aliens from space??

spacedonkey · 16/12/2004 22:53

Disingenuous? aloha? Surely not!

TheHollyAndTheTwiglett · 16/12/2004 22:54

Foudn this, thought it interesting:

The Egyptians were part of a long line of cultures that treasured and worshipped evergreens. When the winter solstice arrive, they brought green date palm leaves into their homes to symbolize life's triumph over death.

The Romans celebrated the winter solstice with a fest called Saturnalia in honor of Saturnus, the god of agriculture. They decorated their houses with greens and lights and exchanged gifts. They gave coins for prosperity, pastries for happiness, and lamps to light one's journey through life.

Centuries ago in Great Britain, woods priests called Druids used evergreens during mysterious winter solstice rituals. The Druids used holly and mistletoe as symbols of eternal life, and place evergreen branches over doors to keep away evil spirits.

Late in the Middle Ages, Germans and Scandinavians placed evergreen trees inside their homes or just outside their doors to show their hope in the forthcoming spring. Our modern Christmas tree evolved from these early traditions.

moondog · 16/12/2004 22:55

Well the Muslim girls whom I went to the mosque with had ALL attended Catholic schools at home in Kenya and used to love singing hymns! They saw no irony in that-as far as their parents were concerned the discipline of a religious school appealed.
They were pretty conservative too. When I went to the mosque, they told me off for being 'bold' and looking into men's eyes!

Tinker · 16/12/2004 22:56

Our nuns used to call us 'bold' as well. What is it with that word?

TheHollyAndTheTwiglett · 16/12/2004 22:56

I think that's because muslims (devout) find that disrespectful though moondog

TheHollyAndTheTwiglett · 16/12/2004 22:57

were your nuns irish sd? cos DH uses that word to mean naughty to DS

TheHollyAndTheTwiglett · 16/12/2004 22:57

oops meant Tinker .. sorry tink

spacedonkey · 16/12/2004 22:57

I didn't have any nuns!

Tinker · 16/12/2004 22:59

They were Irish. Used be said whilst prodding you in the chest with a key.

moondog · 16/12/2004 23:03

Well I know THAT Twiglett!
(Seem to have accidentally started a new thread in my fervour too..)

wordsmith · 16/12/2004 23:06

Interesting what you say about Christenings, Tinker. Being a wishy-washy christian, I wanted a ceremony of sorts for DS1 -something which acknowledged God and allowed us to introduce him to him, IYSWIM, but didn't require us or godparents to 'renounce the devil' 'turn to God' 'repent our sins' and vow to bring DS up as a Christian. I strongly believe that if you stand up and say something in a church it should be something you actually believe, and I couldn't expect DS's godparents - our best friends who really DO want to play a big role in his life, not just remembering his birthday - who dont go to church and for all I know don't believe in God, to have to say something so fundamental. The church I grew up with is the United Reformed Church which has introduced a service of blessing for parents who feel as we do, which I think has helped a lot of parents feel they can introduce their child to the world and acknowledge God without being totally hypocritical.

Or perhaps I am the biggest hypocrite of all for being so (sorry to use this phrase again) 'wishy washy'?

aloha · 16/12/2004 23:06

The thing is, and I repeat, I wouldn't say this to religious friends (because we probably wouldn't have a discussion like this!) but I think all religion is utterly untrue and often a very bad thing. It's my personal belief, just as Lisalisa thinks Jesus is a heretic. I can be polite to people who are religious, I can admire Hindu temples and beautiful cathedrals etc but if I'm absolutely honest I think religion is about as profound as astrology and crystal ball reading etc. I'm not rude about astrology to astrologers but I personally think it's rubbish and will say that to a lot of anonymous strangers and to my dh!

aloha · 16/12/2004 23:08

One of my best friends is a Catholic who also does astrology. I don't know quite how she squares that! We are very good friends though.

aloha · 16/12/2004 23:09

I had a humanist wedding and a humanist christening. The wedding was more successful, I think. Lots of people had no idea it was a specifically humanist ceremony. I like celebrations and rituals, despite being an anti-theist.

spacedonkey · 16/12/2004 23:12

I suppose the point I'm trying to make is that your belief that all religion is utterly untrue is just that - a belief. Just like PHK's belief that Jesus is a heretic. Just like David Icke's belief in lizard men from mars. I grant you David Icke is on the more - ahem - unlikely end of the spectrum.

moondog · 16/12/2004 23:12

Aloha, I think people NEED rituals,some sort of formal acknowledgement of important events.
Maybe this deep need is quite simply the reasons that religion/s exist/s??

PaRumPumPumScum · 16/12/2004 23:13

David Icke! There's a guy who goes all out with his beliefs, eh? Fascinating.

aloha · 16/12/2004 23:14

Well, yes, in the same way that saying that fairies don't exist, or that Zeus doesn't exist is also just a belief...
But my point is that while I wouldn't be rude enough to start a RL fight with fairy believers, I can't say that, deep down, and in the privacy of my own mind, I treat their belief with a great deal of reverence...

spacedonkey · 16/12/2004 23:15
Grin
wordsmith · 16/12/2004 23:15

Does David Icke still believe in the little green (turquoise) men from Mars? Didn't he move onto something else?

spacedonkey · 16/12/2004 23:16

David Icke