Both work and we claim UC but still can't afford to live.

[Mocha1]

We have 3 kids, 2 who aren't at school yet, my husband and I both work 30 hours a week for charities so not highly paid. We also have childcare for part of the week and then juggle the kids between us the rest of the time (We don't want to work more as we dont want the kids in fulltime childcare). We rent and down't own. We claim UC but we are still really struggling to make ends meet. We really try to live to a tight budget but I have no idea how to lower our expenses any more.

Am I missing something? Is this normal? does anyone have any tips for saving money/ making more income somehow? I feel a bit at a loss as we keep dipping into our savings for just day to day expenses and we're nearly at the end of those.

Our income at the moment (I'm on MAT leave) - £3980
Outgoings- £4250

Do these outgoings seem like a lot for a family of 5 living in the south west? I've been going over our budget and I have no idea how to save any more unless we literally never bought another birthday present or went to a soft play ever again.

Where on earth did you get the idea that we need people having more kids in the UK? Schools are already extremely overfull. Stop talking absolute nonsense

Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait.....
I NEED TO GET MY HEAD AROUND THIS!
Because I need to understand this properly.
So DH and I are on our knees with exhaustion, both working FT with 2 DC.
Cost of living crisis is killing us.
We are both utterly worn out and stressed, working FT and juggling that with raising our 2 DC, whom we adore being with just as much as the OP adores being with her DC.
We are really struggling for money since our mortgage interest rate shot up and our food bill started costing more than double what it did 3 years ago. Plus the increase in utility bills. So I increased my hours from PT to FT and we're still struggling.
Am I understanding correctly that I did not in fact need to increase my hours at work, and that I could instead drop back down to PT hours and then claim UC instead??
Could DH, who is looking burnt out with exhaustion recently, drop his full time hours to PT hours and claim UC instead?
This is something I never knew was an option! I did not know people could choose to work part time, as a lifestyle choice, meaning their income is lower, and then claim UC to top it up!!!!!!!
What have DH and I been doing!
Genuine question
Can we drop our hours, earn less as a result, and then claim UC?!
And then take advantage of all the benefits that people who claim UC get, like FSM (we pay a bloody fortune for secondary school meals!) and all the days out that cost a fortune but I always noticed it's free or reduced entry fee for UC claimants, free school trips .....so much stuff I see saying free or subsidised if in receipt of UC... stuff we struggle to pay for.....and all along I've thought the only answer is to work more hours and end up exhausted and stressed......are we saying that all DH and I need to do is drop to PT hours and we'll get topped up with UC?
I am genuinely asking this because honestly I'm about to burst into tears if this is correct and I've been living under a rock not knowing this......

Of course having any number of children if you can’t afford them is a luxury- how can you think otherwise?

Well as usual the viper replies are out in force, because apparently it’s ok to be negative m, have a go and go on and on instead of actually provide advice to the op under the guise of the mumsnet vipers…. This is a money advice thread not AIBU.

i don’t think they are coming back.

This is such an awful thread.
She came here for support regarding finances and all anyone can do is pick at her for having 3 children.
3 children really isn't that unusual!
OP if you are still reading try MSE for finance help.

There are good ways and bad ways of encouraging this though.

Doing something to bring house prices and market rents back into line with salaries would help enormously. (No idea how you actually do this though.) In the 1950s or even in the 1980s it wasn't unrealistic to have one parent as the sole breadwinner in a normal job who could afford to buy or rent a house big enough for three children and for their spouse to be a stay at home parent. Now couples frequently can't afford to buy even on two full time salaries.

Having more and better subsidised childcare would also be a huge help. I live in France where childcare is heavily subsidised. I pay 700€ per month for full time childcare for one child in a public crèche. This is the maximum price because I am a high earner. People on low incomes pay much, much less. And you get a discount for additional children. Two years ago I had two children in crèche full time and paid about 1200€ per month. But this also wouldn't help people like the OP and her husband, who choose not to work full time because they don't want their children in childcare.

In France you also get longer maternity leave and pay less tax from your third child onwards. This means that, although low earning families get cheaper childcare, high earning families probably have the biggest financial incentive to have a third child, which results in more third (or fourth) children being born into stable home environments rather than precarious ones. This is in direct contrast to the UK, where a high earning family who earn above the threshold to be entitled to any help really can't afford to have more than two children, because what with paying for everyone else through their high taxes and not being entitled to claim anything back, and the eye watering cost of housing and childcare, they'll see hardly any of that huge salary actually in their bank account at the end of the month.

So there are of course many ways the UK could be encouraging people to have more children to increase the birth rate. But I don't think supporting people in a precarious position to have yet more children they clearly can't afford whilst forcing high earners to pick up the increasingly colossal bill is the right way.

Schools are not full in the earlier years. Closures are coming in lots of areas.

You'll be shocked when you learn that many families work FT and still claim UC.

A third of UC claimants are in work. Wages are not high enough.

shouldn't have to suggest this, and working should always pay more.

Go into a benefits calculator and play about with figures to see if it work for you.

https://www.entitledto.co.uk

I have a feeling you can’t claim UC as a home owner or if you have more than 16k savings. Otherwise the rest of it is correct.

Having 3 DC is a luxury as is working part time
Fine but no way should you be getting state financial aid to fund this
No wonder the benefits bill is so high
If I would you I would try and get a better paid career as 3 teens /YAs are not going to be cheap
I worked (pt until mine went to school but no state aid ) so kept my career
Mine now in early 20s appreciate all the great
holidays,support at Uni ,driving lessons,cars etc
No ill effects from childcare.

Unfortunately that is part of life at the moment. You can’t choose the working for a charity, both working part time and multiple kids - finances must be dictate some of your decisions

I’ve recently left a charity role as I could increase my pay by 50%, did I want to - no but sometimes needs must. I have one child and I work full time to afford life. Would I like to work part time? Totally.

That’s not the thing that shocking the poster. It’s the fact people can choose to work part time and claim a top up that gives them a full time wage. Not that a full time wage isn’t paying enough to survive and so UC tops up that family’s income to survive. Absolutely no one minds the latter and the exhausted full time workers who are paying through the nose for everything at full whack REALLY mind the former.

I’m assuming that income includes the uc.

Some ideas to cutback (may or may not be relevant)-
Have freeview and pay for internet rather than sky/virgin etc
if you feel you need a tv package pick one (Netflix, prime etc) and swap to another when you feel you have exhausted it.
shop at Aldi or Lidl, buy own/cheaper brands. Try to limit expensive items like meat. Use lentils/ rice etc to bulk meals out. Make slightly larger portions to have lunch the next day rather than buying lunch items. Plan your food to reduce waste.
Dont get food/coffee out. Take from home.
When your phone contracts end go to sim only contracts and keep phone.
Walk where possible over driving.
Buy toys/clothes on Vinted or facebook market place
Use your local library
Go to free/lo cost playgroups in libraries/children’s centres over expensive ones
Go to parks/museum/library on a weekend over costly soft play etc

Yep. I’m no expert but I think as a couple with children you have to work 16hrs a week BETWEEN YOU, so 8 hours each to receive UC. No idea what that would be in comparison to your salaries but you would receive it.
Stats show that only about 34% of people on UC actually work at all. I’d be interested to know how many of that 34% are doing FT hours and how many are part time, by choice.

You need to either earn more or spend less. It's as simple as that.

You are currently making lifestyle choices that you can't afford. You are entitled to feel that you'd rather not use full time childcare, but if that's impacting your ability to earn enough money to live then you can't afford to make that lifestyle choice unfortunately.

Similarly I'm sure you love your charity jobs but unfortunately they don't cover your living expenses, so if you can't cut costs then you need to find jobs that actually pay you enough to live on. The obvious compromise would be to keep the charity jobs but increase your hours to cover the deficit in your budget. You are going to have to compromise on something because eventually your savings will run out and you'll really be in trouble.

I'm generally sympathetic on COL threads because life is bloody hard nowadays and there are plenty of families who are making all the right choices and still can't make ends meet. I'm afraid you are just making poor financial decisions. Of course two adults in low paid part-time work can't support a family of 5. I don't think there's been a time in history where that would have been possible.

I'm not, there are plenty of sources pointing out that schools are closing due to the falling fertility rate, if you care to look.

We bring in 7480, our mortgage is 1900, we manage to save 2780 per month. That leaves us 2800 for the month. Of that we have 200 allocated for eating out/takeaways and 400 for personal fun money. So 2200 we spend on living as such. We are a family of 4 and my DP eats for 2 most dinner times 🫣.

you say you bring in 3980, taking away your rent that leaves 2580 to spend on living! That should be ample even with three dc at those ages!

although I appreciate you didn’t say what your nursery bill is? I assume as you are on Mat leave there is no nursery bill right now.

That’s quite different to the op. They have made s choice to work less and claim. I am well aware someone people work full time and still claim but that is not a lifestyle choice

Poor woman, the OP that is. Came here for help and been verbally battered as so many here think 3 kids are a luxury. No. That’s the government propaganda machine engineering you all to think like this, just like with women working. In my opinion, a mother should be at home to bring her children up, not palm them off for someone else to be paid to look after them! Logic? No. But hey, this is the world now, women are badgered and belittled if they don’t work themselves to a frazzle working full time, cook amazing food, bonk like bunnies to keep their husbands happy, all whilst having hobbies and going to the gym. Get real.

i don’t have a job by the way, I also don’t have children and have been a full-time housewife for 30+ years. I do have 3 big powerful dogs and 2 cats and they cost as much as children (mine do, they get the best of everything) and take a lot of looking after and nurturing. However I work my socks off - baking all our own bread & sourdough, all home-cooked/baked food, look after all the finances, home related stuff (repairs, maintenance) I do everything! Husband earns the income, that’s it. How he wanted it when we got married. It works for us and has done for so many. It used to be the norm. How sad that women HAVE TO go out to work to survive nowadays, it’s wrong. Women should be able to stay home and bring up their kids and look after their husbands. Before you attack me for that last sentence … how many of you are divorced? Marriage is a joke to many nowadays and everyone seems to think working yourself into an early grave (men and women) is the answer.

No, getting rid of a govt. that has engineered the destruction of family, work/life balance and the ability for a man to support his own family is the answer. Engineered spiralling food prices, engineered out of control house prices & rents that are frankly quite ridiculous!! We are all being robbed blind and living through the biggest transfer of wealth in history and it won’t end well, mark my words. If we don’t do anything to stop attacking each other and realise the problem isn’t us, it’s them, we are doomed as a species and no, it’s not because of climate change (biggest con in history) leave the poor woman alone, she came here for help and as usual the MN hounds are ripping her to bits.

It's 2025, update your priors. The birth rate has tanked over the last few years and we're going to see more school closures as the much smaller 2020s cohort are now starting in education.

People are free to think this is either a good or bad thing, but it appears you didn't even know it was happening at all.

So basically you’re eschewing free childcare and scrounging off the tax payer for your principles - great!

But you know the saying - principles don’t pay the rent…

Your income is 3980
rent 1400
Utilities/insurance roughly £800
food/tolietries/cleaning products aim for £500
That leaves £1300 for petrol/living expenses and childcare
I guess it depends on how much your childcare is.

So who do you think should pay for women who didn't marry a rich man like you did to stay at home and not work?

At least one of you probably needs to work actual full time hours, because neither of you are currently.
It's pointless adding that '3 children is a luxury nowadays', because while it's true, they're here now!
Post an imcome and expenditure, if you're feeling brave, and maybe some of us can offer some suggestions.