Moving in to look after parents

[Moneypitminefield]

Feeling a little lost working out the best thing to do and where to go for advice.

Do to my own previous health conditions and circumstances I live in a HA secure tenancy flat as a single parent with 1 DS living with me. DS is in year 10. I now work full time from home.

My parents still live in my childhood home some distance away, which is in need of repairs (upstairs is inefficiently heated off a coal fire back boiler, no double glazing!). The whole house needs re-wiring, part of the roof needs work and it will likely need bathroom adaptations in the near future if they stay. They both now have health conditions and are only just coping. Neither of them want to move and want to stay where they are until it becomes impossible. We are also in agreement that they are beyond the point of moving now as they would likely quickly deteriorate. They want me to look at moving in with them to provide care, and so that when one of them dies the other is not alone and between me and the remaining parent we could afford to run the house between us, which neither of them would be able to do on their own. Without me there, the death of either one looks to be really quite traumatic for the remaining one as neither would cope on their own. There is an amount of equity left in the property (approx £70,000) which could be released to make improvements.

This isn't a huge budget for the total amount of work needed to the whole property, but I do think we could look at converting their double garage and another room into a self contained annexe that would be suitable and safe for them for the remainder of their time. I could make do in the old part of the house, in the same way they have been doing for the past couple of decades.

Obviously this would likely be the best decision for them, but I am worried about me and DS and the upheaval to our lives and whether I'm sleepwalking into disaster. Primarily as he will be in his exam year from September, so a move of school would not be great timing. The benefit to him would be that with no care costs through me providing care, means he and I would likely inherit at some stage. I worry about his future as it is, as I have nothing to pass on to him and neither does his father. Is this grabby? Or a situation that works fairly for everyone?

Is it awful of me to consider him moving in with his dad (who is a good dad and has him 50:50 anyway) and I just see him at weekends until he finishes school and can decide what he wants to do next? I'm running myself ragged as it is with keep going up and down to my parents and trying to work full time as it is, so I'm not sure I'd be any less available to him than I am now tbh.

I've no clue either about home ownership, inheritance, care costs etc if either of my parents need nursing care. I need help thinking this all through and proper advice, but not sure where to go - I'm assuming a financial adviser wouldn't be interested in helping as there is no money to invest in anything right now, other than back into the house?

Any thoughts/suggestions greatly appreciated. Just want to find the right thing to do for everyone.

AgeUK have a very good website and helpline. They also have caseworkers who the helpline will pass you on to if you need more help. Be careful about giving up your HA tenancy unless AgeUK can tell you that you would not be at risk of being turned out of your parents house if they both went into carehomes.

Are you working now? Can you afford to give that up to care for your parents if they need round-the-clock care? Even if you do want to help, they may end up needing more care than you can give. So, again, finding out whether the local authority would want care fees paid back from your parents estate is a must. Again AgeUK are the people to ask.

No don't do this. Will post at greater length but don't risk your secure home and your son's.

No way. They are being hugely selfish. Say no and stick to it they can move to somewhere more manageable near you or sort their own care.

This is the kind of request a number of elderly parents make, but is not reasonable. It's even less reasonable for you and your son, to the point of unacceptable. You've said
I could make do in the old part of the house, in the same way they have been doing for the past couple of decades

Even if this was ok for you, and I don't think it is, would that be ok for your son in his exam year? And the option of living full time with his dad - it's good that that's possible, but I don't think that should happen so that his mum can prioritise the, frankly, selfish wishes of his grandparents. He should have the benefit of living in the stable set up shared between mum and dad that he has now, not some 'make do' arrangement in a badly maintained money pit.

You've also said
I'm running myself ragged as it is with keep going up and down to my parents and trying to work full time as it is
I do get that you don't want to let your parents down, I really do. But instead you're letting yourself and your son down. If you try to take on full time care, life will get even more difficult. It'll be really hard to keep up full time work, and that risks your own financial stability. The work that needs doing on the house wouldn't cost much, you think, but that's because it's a 'make do' solution not one to actually live in comfortably. What happens after both your parents die? You'll be stuck with the money pit. Will you be able to maintain it then? Is it where you'd want to live?

Older people are often very resistant to moving and making changes and will suggest whatever allows them to avoid that. This isn't a good move for you or your son. Inheriting isn't worth it. You can't count on these things anyway: you've said they're only just managing. If either or both deteriorated and simply couldn't stay living at home, then you're into paying for care which would most likely have to come from agreeing to pay social services back later on when the house is sold. I actually think it would be better for them to be properly cared for earlier on when they need it and to use the money for that. If they don't have savings in the bank, they can get a financial and care assessment and carers can come in, without that affecting you inheriting and without you moving and risking your own home and independence.

Sorry, really long - but I feel strongly that people get majorly guilt tripped over doing their best for their elderly parents, when this makes life much worse for them and their kids. Put yourself and your son first.

I don’t think that’s a good idea all round but definitely do not move your son at such a vital stage of his education.

No way. Don't let go of your HA property. They are being very selfish.

If they can no longer live independently then they'll need a care assessment to see if home visits can be provided.

Gosh thanks for the thoughts and replies. I will contact age UK, that's a good suggestion. I can see how it seems they are being selfish, but I think they are thinking it would help me in the long term to inherit, rather than to pay care costs. Clearly we are both unaware care costs could be reclaimed from an estate. That really would leave ds and I in the proverbial.

They should probably have moved before now and got plans in place, however they were caring for another vulnerable family member who died recently, so this wasn't an option. We've just been lurching from one health related crisis to another in the family and trying to make the best decisions at any one time.

Pay heed to the other respondents warnings here.

re your comment
"They want me to look at moving in with them to provide care, and so that when one of them dies the other is not alone and between me and the remaining parent we could afford to run the house between us, which neither of them would be able to do on their own"

It's a hard no because it is a disaster for you as well as being selfish on their part. HA accommodation is as rare as hens teeth and you would be foolish to give that up.

What they are proposing is not a solution at all and with all due respect you need to put you and your son first now. They have not and will not. He will be affected too by all this and potentially to his emotional detriment. You and he need to remain in the property you currently reside in and to involve Adult Social Care in their council areas re their ongoing needs. NO moving into their badly maintained money pit.

How are you going to provide care?. How are you going to hold down your full time job whilst managing the,?. Short answer is that you will not and the wheels will come off very quickly.

What do they expect of you going forward?. Your relationship dynamic will change completely with you becoming the parent to they being the children. Being a carer is a thankless task at the best of times and with no time off. What happens too when you are not well enough to look after them?.

I would not necessarily count on any inheritance either particularly in the event both parents had to be in a care home.

Do not set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.

No, no, no.

For the next 4 years, GCSE and A level, your priority needs to be creating maximum support and stability for your Ds.

How old are your parents? I am thinking not over 80 if you have a 10 yo.

I would offer / persuade them to move to a smaller, manageable, well insulated home close to where you live.

I am not sure what you mean by £70,000 equity, but £70,000 is nowhere near enough to refurb and future proof the house, and convert the garage.

If they can adjust to living in a converted garage annex they can adjust to living in a new, more suitable home.

Is the £70k equity to do with their mortgage being interest only?

I honestly cannot understand why you would contemplate surrendering a gold-dust secure HA home for a risky, unaffordable venture which turns yours and your Ds’s lives upside down, to answer the pressure of home owners who have failed to plan for themselves, and in pursuit of future circumstances which are completely unknown!

All the things that @AttilaTheMeerkat says. Everyone says 'don't move in' and they are right.

Be aware that inheriting a house that needs work is not the blessing one might hope. My dad left his house to my brother and me and now we have a beautiful old bungalow on a superb plot, falling down and costing us money we can't afford. Added to which, it's our childhood home and we are emotionally attached to it!

Try to get your parents into a council/ha older person's property near you. Get GPs to support you - you all need such a move for health reasons. If they are staying put, they need to buy in care and the costs are merciless.

Simply no don't do it !

1. You put yourself at risk of being homeless if they both need to go into care.

2. You won't necessarily get protection from putting your name on the deeds. LA will go over finances if a parent needs to go into care and you and your parents could be accused of sheltering assets to avoid care costs ( an awful tangle to get into - sadly I've seen it happen to several people )

3. If you give up your HA tenancy you will really struggle to get something in the future with them based on the current housing situation

4. Why should your DS have their world turned upside down ? It will cause all sorts of issues which could last a lifetime - think "my mum thought her parents were more important than me ? "

5. In reality the necessary home repairs / improvements will never happen - the equity you mention will get swallowed very quickly and if you go down this route the inheritance for you / your DS will diminish anyway.

6. While in the short term being on site will feel like it makes it easier - it won't be - you will be on call 24 x7 and your world will shrink to them - no down time - no time to see your DS as they will always "need something" and the "could you just...." and you will feel as ragged and frazzled - just the pressures will be different.

My siblings and I had a similar situation with elderly parents - still in family home / couldn't cope / no money to sort out the big list of repairs / couldn't afford the bills and didn't want to move - even though they knew they couldn't cope - was tough but we got them to sell up and go into assisted living accommodation - shared ownership for over 55s. It was hard work and we had to organise everything and clear out the home - But we know they are safe, their health has significantly improved since moving out of the damp & dusty house and they can cope. We can be involved to support but aren't tied 24 x 7. Since moving they have admitted it was the right thing to do and feel much better for doing it and their health has actually improved. They were 89 & 86 when they moved.

Have you had their needs assessed by social services - depending on their savings they may be eligible for some help at home ?

As an ex carer please don't get drawn in. The situation could go on for years, it will be thankless as the elderly generally become more demanding / childlike and unappreciative and can't see the problems and issues. You will become more isolated and your world will shrink to them and the house. Seriously it needs to be what I know will be a tough situation but you need to give some tough love, say it isn't possible for you to move and they need to look at other options.

They want me to look at moving in with them to provide care, and so that when one of them dies the other is not alone

So for the sake of some unknown circumstance at an unknown time in the future, they want you to leave your Ds ‘alone’, at least from you?

Sounds monumentally selfish / unreasonable to me.

By the time one dies, the other might have dementia. They could both live another 20 years.

They are nearer 90 now, so I'm not sure it would be for a huge amount of time. One has early stage dementia now. I need to get a social care assessment done next, though the parent with dementia has done a great job of saying everything is fine when it's not, to the point the psychiatric team has discharged care back to the GP saying no current care needs.

This is a spectacularly bad idea - first of all, you run the risk of making yourself homeless if at some point one or both of your parents need to go into a care home (if they develop dementia, at some point they may require 24/7 care). The value of their home may need to be used to pay for care through what is called a "deferred charge". This means that if both of them die, the house would need to be sold for the care fees. Have a good read of Age UK guidance Do I Have to Sell my Home to Pay For Care? | Age UK, especially this part:

Moving into a care home permanently
If you move into a care home permanently, your home won't be counted in the financial assessment if any of the following people still live there:

• your partner, spouse or civil partner
• your estranged or divorced partner if they're also a lone parent
• a relative who is 60 or over
• a relative who is under 60 who has a disability
• a child of yours aged under 18.

Please also have a good read of this forum Caring For Elderly Parents Forum UK | Mumsnet | Mumsnet to look at realities of what you are proposing to do.

The fact that it's likely a short amount of time is all the more reason not to do it - as a single parent things are harder for you as it is, I wouldn't consider even for a moment giving up a secure tenancy

And sorry to be harsh but I am actually a bit shocked that you would even consider sending your son away to live with his dad full time to do this.

He is your child, your parents are adults, he needs you far more than they do.

Hard no.

You mentioned there is £70K equity in the property. Is there a mortgage or some other charge on it?

If so, would you even inherit anything or would the house have to be sold to pay off a debt?

I won’t move my child in the middle of GCSEs. It would mean he would have to do his GCSE having only covered half the course. You would be setting him up for failure.

There is no way I would do this.

At the moment you have a secure housing situation. You would be swapping that for insecurity (for you and for your son).

You say that there is about £70K of equity left in the property - does this mean that there is still/already a mortgage on it? And that in order to access that £70K to make the house livable, then you would have to take out a further mortgage? Once that is done, then surely there would be no value left in the prerty for you to inherit anyway (and interest to pay)?

Even leaving this aside, it's a terrible idea. There is a high possibility that one or both parents will need more 24/7 help than one person (however willing) can physically provide. At that point then any value in the house gets eaten up by carer or care home fees, leaving you with nothing. Your parents may have the best intentions in terms of leaving you their property, but it would no longer be theirs to leave.

Plus you would have appalling stress and probably have to leave your career. This plan would drain you dry and almost certainly leave you with nothing. Sorry to be so melodramatic. But it's true.

Definitely not, you need to guarantee the roof over your head.
They should move into a practical accommodation very close to you so you can, if you wish, provide care more easily. If there is an inheritance from that property in the future then that's fine but accept it may be spent on care which is fine too, as it is currently your dps money to be used for their benefit.

I'd rather they were looked after professionally than inherit a wreck. It seems the focus is on what you can inherit if you come to look after them. NO, it's not worth it.

In fact I think they are supremely selfish, as many of their age can be. Me, me, me.

I was that daughter, and the happiest day of my life so far was the day my mother went into a (fabulous in the end) nursing home. I didn't live with her, but honestly I could have driven that road from mine to hers in my sleep. It wrecked me quite honestly, and when she died bless her (we did have a good relationship), I got very ill and barely survived that trauma myself. I put it down to the accumulation of stress and worry and exhaustion and not looking after ME for many years, the dam burst so to speak.

So my advice is do NOT do this. Find an alternative and money isn't everything by any stretch. You can pay a very high price for it in the end.

It's not harsh, none of these posts are. I'm very grateful for the reality check. Leaving DS with his dad is the key aspect that's preventing me from feeling okay about any of it, although many parents work away or see very little of one parent during the week and just at weekends. If it meant I could secure a better future for him, and he was okay with it, I could just about entertain the idea, but the timing is awful.

That was to @kiraric!

How are you calculating 70k equity in the property. What does that actually mean? Is that taking into account a property that needs a complete refurb? Or are you calculating the value once it's done?