MLM BOT WATCH 8 - Lighthearted chat and posts by Eyes about Forever Living, Ariix, It Works is a church, NuSkin, Younique, as scambralambascambaralamlas

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GO!

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Vegodoll is attempting to use classic cult tactics in these exchanges. This indicates that we are not engaging with an isolated young woman who has only been involved with 'NuSkin' for just a few months.

The following is a summary of one of Professor Magaret Singer's 'conditions' for gaining control over how individuals think and behave in cults, as published in 'Cults in our Midst.'

The 'Vegodoll' character is attempting to treat us in the same way that 'NuSkin' adherents are treated by the leadership.

Put forth a closed system of logic and an authoritarian structure that permits no feedback and refuses to be modified except by leadership approval or executive order.

The group has a top-down, pyramid structure. The leaders must have verbal ways of never losing.

Members are not allowed to question, criticize or complain. If they do, the leaders allege the member is defective, not the organization or the beliefs.

The targeted individual is treated as always intellectually incorrect or unjust, while conversely the system, its leaders and its beliefs are always automatically, and by default, considered as absolutely just.

Whilst engaging with Vegodoll MN Members should bear in mind that 'NuSkin' is a global criminal racket which was instigated by 'Mormons' and has been giving fortunes to the 'Mormon Church.'

Despite the organization's reputation as an absurd scam, in 1996, 'NuSkin Enterprises' was allowed to be launched on the New York Stock Exchange, and the criminal enterprise was exported around the globe. In 1997, the 'NuSkin' mob paid a derisory $1.5 million to the FTC to settle ongoing allegations of 'making unsubstantiated claims about its products.' At the same time, the Attorney general of Pennsylvania sued 'NuSkin,' again alleging that the company operated a pyramid scheme through a subsidiary corporate structure, 'QIQ Connections.' The Attorney General's office discovered that that 'QIQ' participants had paid for the right to market something which did not exist. 'NuSkin's' attorneys halted the suit by dissolving the subsidiary, obliging victims who had paid money to 'QIQ' to transfer to 'Big Planet' (a newly-created blind alley in the mystifying 'NuSkin' labyrinth) offering 'Internet technology.' Classically, the head of 'Big Planet' then dismissed the pyramid-scheme charge as 'a few distributors who, in their enthusiasm, have been overzealous in some of their marketing activities.'

By the summer of 2010, 63 millions 'NuSkin shares' had been sold and these were illegally-trading at $27 a piece, making the counterfeit 'Direct Selling' company theoretically worth approximately $1.7 billions. At this time, 4.46 millions effectively-valueless 'NuSkin shares' owned by Blake Roney, Sandie Tillotson, Steve Lund and the 'Mormon Church' were unloaded for $114.3 millions.

www.deseretnews.com/article/700039356/446-million-shares-of-Nu-Skin-sold-for-114-million.html

On a completely different note, just found a FL bot posting about feeding her toddler one of the Forever Diet shakes!!! FFS!!!

Vegodoll, sounds good about the cake shop. Do your upline know about your plans to leave? Have you set goals for this (and the cake shop), like you would have done in the mlm?

throwingpebbles no! I wouldn't consider trying one of those shakes, let alone give them to one of my kids!

I know. Awful

Anything for a like on Fb though!

24x7 stuff! Impressed! Vegodoll; hope you get some sleep! A couple of comments:

#1 "Your boss earns more and makes money off you" Certainly when I was working the CEO of my employer made much more than me - and I made more than, say, new or more junior employees. However both I and indeed all employees were PAID by the company. We did not work 100% commission-only, nor did we have to pay for team days, product samples etc. Your downline - as you well know - pay to be in the MLM. You make money off them, rather than "3rd-party" sales.

#2 You state uour downline IBOs only purchase against cleared customer orders. I can believe that UK MLMs don't channel-stuff; that's illegal. However IBOs have to purchase demo tools and samples, and are encouraged to purchase for own use. The end result is much the same - a garage full of stock. (The 10-customer rule is never enforced.)

#3 You mention some harsh criticism on this forum. I'm male and aware of MLM scams (Amway). But MN community have really been energised and angered by Forever Living and others because they target new mums (see pic, grrr). That has spurred MLM investigation and criticism and I for one am impressed - esp, with Timeless VIE, a brilliant parody and started by MNers (not me, though I contribute and really admire it)

I just want to respond to the criticism that we are attacking people on the internet and wouldn't do it in person. A criticism also levelled at Bot Watch and Timeless Vie. The thing is, we are responding to internet posts with internet posts, which I think is fair. If a bot were to meet me at the school gates and show me a picture of a holiday home and say she is there right now, I would tell her that she is lying. If a bot handed me a drink from their MLM and told me it could cure diseases I would tell them it wouldn't.

I don't understand what we are supposed to do? Should we see a dodgy claim, should we find out the address of the person , drive to them, tell them why they are wrong and then drive home again? Meanwhile the bots keep on lying and selling their brand online.

I'm still intrigued by how some people manage to acquire - without apparent penalty - seemingly direct MLM product franchises such as UK internet ' shops' in various places. One might almost surmise that these were 'goodies' which were handed out to various people who had reached a certain position and were doing too much on the PR front to put in the daily 19 or so hours that others have to. (Shurely not - Ed.)

The FL social media policy is on FB Botwatch page on 7th Feb.

Toobusytowee- The average 'MLM' evangelist has little, or no idea, what he/she really represents. Yet if any UK citizen becomes involved with a group like 'FLP', 'NuSkin', 'Younique', etc., he/she is not only funding the 'Mormon Church', he/she is also wasting his/her own time and money looking for others to do the same.

All 'Mormons,' including 'MLM' racketeers, are obliged to hand over a significant percentage of their pre-tax income to their 'Church' in the form of 'tythes.'

When shiny-faced, uniformed 'Mormon Missionaries' knock on your door peddling salvation and looking for lost souls to recruit, the average UK citizen politely shuts the door in their face. 'MLM' rackets are merely the same phenomenon, but re-written in a 'commercial' language in order to deceive a much wider range of lost souls.

Blimey, it all kicks off when I have a night off and sleep in . It is frustrating how we seem to be going in circles with vego. She doesn't appear to see that we are not personally attacking her, just the MLM business model she is using to gain financial success. We know from evidence available that the vast majority of MLM adherents will not break even trying to make a living from an MLM company. We know from hearing first hand accounts that the business model damages friendships, relationships, families, health (mental and physical) and can lead to terrible misery for many who have become involved. We also know that recruiters are driven to lie and deceive (we have screenshots and downloaded the videos) in order to sign up downlines. These are all FACTS, verifiable.

It us all there, out in the open, for vego to read and digest. She protests too much that her company is honourable with good practices. We know from evidence that is out there in the public arena, that that is not so. She turns a blind eye to the facts that support our claims. We cannot do anything to change her mind about this.

We will carry on doing what we do, shining a very bright and unforgiving light upon the lies and deceit that we see, taking screenshots, downloading questionable videos, challenging and questioning and ultimately helping others to see the unpalatable truth; the MLM business model DOES NOT PROVIDE A VIABLE INCOME FOR VIRTUALLY 100% OF ADHERENTS.

Right, that's me off to the spa for a long hot soak. See ya later guys .

We all have the morals that we can afford, but this shill saying that MLM was the only option to get her and her child out of the gutter is plainly false. We all know and respect people who work hard in jobs paying min. wage and work up to something more rewarding. What is this shill's reasoning for not doing such a job, preferring to bypass or refusing to examine any sense of wrongdoing to con others? Just because?

And what is with the attempt at finger pointing? TV's sense of integrity is intact - what we are doing is shining a light to raise awareness of these cons, AND IT IS WORKING. Satire is a quick and effective way to get people to examine their behaviour and that of others. We are helping people see that there are so many things wrong with MLM (we have the testimonials) and we will keep providing our free and helpful service because there is a genuine market for this. No hypocrisy or conflict of interest here, I can assure you. Better that people feel uncomfortable with a TV post than getting entrenched in MLM and losing friends, family, money and self-worth.

I agree lazy - there are plenty of excellent factual blogs and websites, such as the one by our lovely eyes which plainly lay out the facts of MLMs. Lots of excellent research and explanation. But TV is touching a nerve and getting people talking and sharing and thereby doing a wonderful job of highlighting these issues in a way that gets attention. Using satire and humour to make an important point is working!

cozie online "shops". Had been thinking the same thing myself. How else would these high up bots get rid of all the "product" they have to buy.

Well said all! And in particular lazycoo!

vego you seem incredibly defensive and taking TV, Bot watch, mumsnet threads all very personally? that leads me to suspect you have a much greater vested interest here than that which you wish to portray? Your circular reasoning and slavish insistence on branding us all negheads and haters (a favourite law of attraction staple in botworld) smacks of desperation to prove an unprovable point. You accuse these good people of mocking and "taking the piss" yet you were given a warm welcome and asked some genuine questions by those on these threads, heck, you have even been offered support and advice should you require it, despite your agressive approach. My feeling now, is you have said everything that you are able to say, so If you cannot answer basic questions and provide facts to back up your claims then frankly jog on to make way for those who genuinely need help and support from these threads (who knows, potentially even from your own downline 😬) Because you are now just flaming (imho) and derailing this important thread, something which I suspect is deliberate to prevent others seeking help. Just MHO though.

Oh and last hey teamie!!! Missed ya! 🙌🙌🙌

Did you get up and drag yourself to work this morning? Get dressed in clothes that you buy for work, get stuck in traffic in a car that you're still paying for, in order to get to a job that you need so that you can pay for the clothes, car & the house that you leave empty all day in order to afford to live in?

I don't get these recruitment arguments. I want an amendment at the bottom that offers the tiny chance of earning six figures, but possibly nothing, or the guaranteed chance of earning 5 figures in paid employment.

1gorge that statement would seem to apply more to the topbots themselves! Especially considering all these success days they have to attend, out of their own pockets!! 😱😱

Just had 'a moment' in the shower (no, not that kind of moment ).

You know we chat about PUPP boxes that bots lend out to people so they can use products. The problem is that the lotions and potions end up being used by potentially a number of different people. This is not hygienic.

In the (apparently) 30 odd years fl has been going, you'd have thought they would have developed sample bottles for bots to give out ( like I was using in the hotel shower when I had my moment). Or sachets? Why do you think this has never happened?

If you were cynical (like what I am) you might think that it is more profitable for the company to persuade downlines to purchase full bottles to lend out, thus wasting most of the bottle (due to hygiene issues) and them having to then purchase more full sized bottles. seems a very obvious oversight to me.

Loving this thread, it has a particularly rich seam of interesting conversation, information, knowledge, and good sense. Any outsider poking their nose in will learn a lot. Lurking? Got a question? Dive in and chat .

I know!

Did you get up and drag yourself to a success day that you had to pay for this morning? Get dressed in clothes that you buy for success days, training sessions and business meetings, get stuck in traffic in a car that you're still paying for, in order to get to a training that you need so that you can pay for the clothes, car & the house that you sit in all day constantly recruiting in order to afford to live in and pay for your success days and trainings?

Change your life. Join an MLM.

stop they do have sample sachets. My bot came into my work with them. Not sure why they don't favour using the sachets over the full sized products for these flipping daft pupp boxes. Ah, of course, the large bottles are expensive and therefore must be better.

stop

"My" bot was trying to persuade me to sign up to Forever without me ever having tried any of the products!! But she did bring her teenage son along and explain how forever had "cured" his "terrible" acne. He just sat there looking awkward. I had met him lots of times before she got involved in forever and never noticed any acne.

Ooooh that would make an awesome meme thingy 1gorgeous