Oestrogel: new packaging (yet again)? - Thread 2

[ConfusedEasily]

Carrying on from a previous thread by Cosmetichamster which can be found here:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/menopause/4696464-oestrogel-new-packaging-yet-again

I have engineering background and know from professional experience that it is permissible to change parts of a product without re-certification if manufacturer can demonstrate that form-fit-function is the same between the original part and the replacement part. Assume the same principle applies to pharmaceuticals especially if it's not an active ingredient that is being changed such as hormone in this case. However everything needs to be properly documented for traceability. ISO certification demands that. Surely then it's not a rocket science for Besins to work out what they've changed (there are only a handful of ingredients in this blessed gel) and trace it back to the source of the problem. Especially given how many yellow cards they must have had by now. It's affecting so many of us in such profound ways! I have a challenging technical job, teenage children and extended family to navigate and it's difficult enough as is without constant brain fog and crashing tiredness. I no longer know whether my decisions are adequate or simply driven by hormonal disbalance. Sandrena is all very well but I'm still not back to normal because it doesn't work in the same way as Oestrogel and I went through shocking few months before I worked out the Oestrogel was not working. Why is it we are first supposed to work out it's the gel that's faulty and not us going potty, then work out what exactly is wrong with the gel, find an alternative, work out the correct dose and then pray that the preparation is not going into a terminal shortage nationwide. Sorry for the rant but I really do despair sometimes.

@Lollipopsnet you summed up exactly how I feel! I still don't feel back to what I was after 5 weeks on sandrena.

Do Besins care? I rather think that is the question. A pertinent question in international women's day, week.

I was allergic to the one on the left!

Echoing what others have said - I’m over two months in in sandrena and while I’m definitely better than I was on new style oestrogel I don’t feel as amazing as I did on the old oestrogel .. 😞

My GP said Lenzetto spray is another good alternative but it’s not available due to shortages(!) or so she says. Has anybody tried that? I’ve upped my Sandrena to 2 mg again because started feeling a bit jittery on 1.5g. A bit nervous to up it anymore as it’s above recommended dose in Sandrena leaflet. Running out of options really. Will Oestrogel ever go back to normal and how would we know if it did?

I got an old style conical bottle oestrodose this prescription round, I’ve had to play with my dose as immediately I got hot flushes and joint pain and couldn’t sleep. I am finding that I need more at the start of a new bottle and can reduce as I go - I’ve found this on the last three I’ve opened so I wonder if somehow the active ingredients settle to the bottom. I simply haven’t time to visit my GP at the moment so will have to keep playing around for a month or so.
Interestingly my pharmacist said they’ve had all sorts of problems and complaints over the new bottles, leaking and the pumps not working.

A colleague in the office has always been on Sandrena and has been saying that HRT is just to take the edge off your symptoms and you still feel rubbish some of the time. I felt ‘25 again’ on Oestrogel and never needed to vary the dose between the start and the end of the bottle. It might be that Sandrena does indeed only take the edge off.

That’s a depressing thought 😩

Im still not sure how I feel in sandrena .. I definitely don’t feel amazing , I’m going to chat to my menopause consultant again I think

Level 3 Govt recall of two batches of oestrogel due to faulty pumps

Batch No Expiry Date Pack Size First Distributed
74800 31/07/2026 1 06/11/2023
74830 31/08/2026 1 08/11/2023

think it’ll turn out to be much more than faulty pumps!

Finally some acceptance of the fact we were not imagining it!

Interesting what you said about Sandrena as I just feel meh it’s just about taking the edge off but I felt so so much better last year on decent oestrogel.im also really struggling the last two weeks with boobs size of water melons so sore too. Not had that for a year+

Thanks for sharing this! Finally doing something about it!
interestingly I’m finding on the new that I get a residue that slimes up (Sorry can’t think of a better word!) when I bathe or shower - even after rubbing until dry when I apply. So I need to make sure I scrub it off or it builds up and stops new applications absorbing.

@LeafDancing I went to the gynaecologist yesterday and he said that it takes at least 3 months to settle on a new dose or a change of HRT so I shouldn’t expect quick fixes. He also said that when you up the dose or change HRT you might get a quick high and then it pewters out. Definitely not recommended to vary the dose frequently. He also said that sore breasts may be an indication of too high a dose. I had sore breasts on Oestrogel but not on Sandrena. I’d give it a few weeks if I were you, mine eventually stopped hurting. He also said to apply gel onto thighs not arms because of proximity to breasts. I am now on 2 mg Sandrena, he said it’s high but not over the top. I’m actually much better so it seems to be gradually settling, not just taking the edge off. I’ve been on Sandrena now for 2.5 months. Having said that I was all calm and in a good mood yesterday and then suddenly completely lost it and had a screaming match with my teenager. I think I overreacted. So clearly still not fully settled. Doubt I will be going back to Oestrogel even if they fix the bottles and/or the recipe. Too much risk and uncertainty.

It's been really interesting to discover this thread because I was starting to think the gel wasn't working as well as when I was first prescribed it a year ago, and a lot of my increased anxiety was to do with challenges in a new job, and feeling generally low and unmotivated was down to the long wet winter. But now I'm wondering. I have a review appt with the menopause specialist at my surgery in April and I will ask her if she's had complaints from others. I was thinking I needed to increase my dose because I was becoming 'resistant' to the hormone rather than the gel allegedly having less active ingredient. I switched bottles in Nov/Dec last year.

Hi,
Can I just clarify? I’ve just received another change of packaging (see attached)
Is this one ok?

@Cozytoesandtoast00 I’m on this at the moment - the first few pumps were rubbish on me but then seems fine as long as I remember to scrub off any residue in the shower or it creates a sort of barrier layer (it goes a bit slimey in the bath or shower the morning after application the night before).

That was the bottle shape that used to work ok I had it for years and years no problem until the last 4-5mths sadly

I’m using this one now and for me it seems to be the same as the older, English label bottles of this shape. It’s the conical ones that didn’t work well for me.

Thanks for your responses ladies!
I’m not sure if it’s a coincidence but since using this 3rd style new one I’ve had the jitters and insomnia. So could be stronger than the canister style one I was using previously.
i’ll keep an eye on it and reduce the amount if so.

I’ve just opened a new cylindrical one and the amount of gel coming out seems much more? I am also sleeping better and slightly sore boobs, so feel it’s giving me a higher dose…

Im very late to this, but wanted to post as Ive been on oestrogel 9 years and generally very happy with menopause symptom control. However I started the new bottle shape 3 weeks ago and have since been having night sweats, achy joints, and feeling anxious and poor sleep generally.

I thought I was imagining it till I found this thread!!.

So much of what Ive read resonates. Im switching back to the old bottles ( i have a few months spares)

Watching with interest. Ill check my batch numbers too.

@omega4ever please report it via the yellow card scheme and email besins. Glad you have found the post dor reassurance. I was in the same boat, but sadly I didn't have any of the old style bottles left.

A fellow sufferer here. I had a month of symptoms returning in January but then last month I was waking up with raging sweats at 3am.
My latest prescription has on old style bottle with French labelling. Hoping to get back to normal

I've just been given this too! English label pasted over the French one. Seems pretty good so far, been using for a week.