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Low-carb bootcamp

Join discussions about low-carb bootcamp plans, meals and progress. Consider speaking to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The next Low Carb Bootcamp starts on 24 October

346 replies

BIWI · 01/10/2016 20:55

... come and sign up here!

It's only an 8 week one this time, as I'm away sunning myself beforehand.

So it will be an extra strict one - you have been warned!

OP posts:
PaulineFowlersGrowler · 22/10/2016 15:46

Can I join please? I've never done a boot camp before so I'm not entirely sure what I'm getting myself into Confused

wombattoo · 22/10/2016 16:39

BIWI
TheForeignOffice
Inaclearing
Wombattoo
Achangeisgonnacome
Piscivorous (no spreadsheet)
Pippilottaviktualia
StuntNun
Flisspaps
habibihabibi
MyShinyThing
Sheepysheep
Kitkat6
nekobus
TwoflowersLuggageR
WilfSell
boldlygoingsomewhere
Keeponkeepinon
Veryflummoxed
Primitivio
imustbepatient
Polkadotties
bettyblueeyes83
DoctorBeat
MaryThorne
Lisbapalea
Chopsticks
GuyMartinsSideburns
Peachypips
Paddypants13 (no spreadsheet)
Notsoold
RainbowJack
Peaceloveandbiscuits
fandancelil
ariana1
Xocaraic
Hadmeathello
Originalusenamefail
Raisingirls
Cisforcat
BoredOfItAll
tanker dale
AnneElliott
Badhairday1001
TwirlyFoo
ThingInTheAttic
Thecontentedcat
Lovelycuppateas
momofgirls
FinallyHere (no spreadsheet)
Conflictedoncemore
GinThief
Spotty rainbow
Bettybiggestballs
clare8allthepies
Visaste
Plumstone
CassandraKumquat
SoulMateDestiny
granjinx
cousinsandra
FarelyKnuts
Feekerry smile
Whistle73
MamaLuluLump
whateveryousay
SweetBabyJebus
Eva50
Readyforno2
Poppiesway
zobalina77
Pengweng
CaptainBraandPants
Daftaboutthecat
Ndotto
PopGoesTheFuckingWeasel
43andcounting
BradleyPooper
SestraClone
LexLoofah
Lenska999
galaxygirl45
Notso
TolpuddleFarterOATB
GoldenGumballs
dillite
Femp2012
regularbutpanickingabit
stegosauruslady
Walkingtowork
Fufulina
Billionnairewannabe
worldsworstchildren
amistillsexy
ASISAYNOTASIDO
Willow33
AmyC86
insertcoolusernamehere
Whathaveilost
concretejungle
TotalBlamBlam
Misssss
Needabiscuit
KeiD
SingingTunelessly
becs1973
Girlrunningoncheese
toolatetobackoutnow
Wandastartup
FrameyMcFrame
todgerthedodger
SunshineInMySprocket
StopMeProcrastinating
MyVisionsComefromSoup
PaulineFowlersGrowler

wombattoo · 22/10/2016 16:41

Welcome Pauline
BIWI has posted some rules upthread

SeasideRock · 22/10/2016 18:04

Can I join in too? Have been LCing for a few weeks now and the weight is starting to shift now. Would welcome the focus in the run up to Christmas ...

wombattoo · 22/10/2016 18:06

BIWI
TheForeignOffice
Inaclearing
Wombattoo
Achangeisgonnacome
Piscivorous (no spreadsheet)
Pippilottaviktualia
StuntNun
Flisspaps
habibihabibi
MyShinyThing
Sheepysheep
Kitkat6
nekobus
TwoflowersLuggageR
WilfSell
boldlygoingsomewhere
Keeponkeepinon
Veryflummoxed
Primitivio
imustbepatient
Polkadotties
bettyblueeyes83
DoctorBeat
MaryThorne
Lisbapalea
Chopsticks
GuyMartinsSideburns
Peachypips
Paddypants13 (no spreadsheet)
Notsoold
RainbowJack
Peaceloveandbiscuits
fandancelil
ariana1
Xocaraic
Hadmeathello
Originalusenamefail
Raisingirls
Cisforcat
BoredOfItAll
tanker dale
AnneElliott
Badhairday1001
TwirlyFoo
ThingInTheAttic
Thecontentedcat
Lovelycuppateas
momofgirls
FinallyHere (no spreadsheet)
Conflictedoncemore
GinThief
Spotty rainbow
Bettybiggestballs
clare8allthepies
Visaste
Plumstone
CassandraKumquat
SoulMateDestiny
granjinx
cousinsandra
FarelyKnuts
Feekerry smile
Whistle73
MamaLuluLump
whateveryousay
SweetBabyJebus
Eva50
Readyforno2
Poppiesway
zobalina77
Pengweng
CaptainBraandPants
Daftaboutthecat
Ndotto
PopGoesTheFuckingWeasel
43andcounting
BradleyPooper
SestraClone
LexLoofah
Lenska999
galaxygirl45
Notso
TolpuddleFarterOATB
GoldenGumballs
dillite
Femp2012
regularbutpanickingabit
stegosauruslady
Walkingtowork
Fufulina
Billionnairewannabe
worldsworstchildren
amistillsexy
ASISAYNOTASIDO
Willow33
AmyC86
insertcoolusernamehere
Whathaveilost
concretejungle
TotalBlamBlam
Misssss
Needabiscuit
KeiD
SingingTunelessly
becs1973
Girlrunningoncheese
toolatetobackoutnow
Wandastartup
FrameyMcFrame
todgerthedodger
SunshineInMySprocket
StopMeProcrastinating
MyVisionsComefromSoup
PaulineFowlersGrowler
SeasideRock

TheProf · 22/10/2016 18:17

I'd like to join this boot camp too - I was low carbing prior to oct hols but fell off the wagon Confused

Could someone add my name to the list? Thank you

RJnomore1 · 22/10/2016 18:21

BIWI I am about to start high protein - going to fully commit to my training/bodybuilding (more fat stripping right now tbh) as of Monday. Would the bootcamp be suitable for me? I do need to drop the carbs down as I do it.

Im not looking for weight loss so I won't join the spreadsheet, I am wanting to reduce fat and increase muscle mass so that doesn't necessarily mean weight loss, if you think its not appropriate for what I am trying to do just say. Good luck to all of you anyway.

BIWI · 22/10/2016 19:00

I think it would be fine, RJ - just be careful what you post about food if it's 'off piste' as it might confuse others though!

OP posts:
RJnomore1 · 22/10/2016 19:36

I will do - it would be nice to have the moral support along the way though! Where is it that I read about the plan you are doing? Will follow it as much as I can. thank you!

Julie0210 · 22/10/2016 19:45

Can i join in please? New to this so not sure how to join, just click watching or something? Thanks Smile

runningtogetskinny · 22/10/2016 19:50

Sorry just changed my username to something more 'Mumsnet' was jules0210. Can I join in please? New to the Mumsnet stuff Smile

BIWI · 22/10/2016 20:18

If you want to join, you're all very welcome! Just copy the list of names, paste it into the message box and add your name to the bottom

RJnomore - if you read up the thread, you'll see where I've started to talk about what Bootcamp involves.

OP posts:
BIWI · 22/10/2016 20:19

But here's a reminder:

This is how it works, in a nutshell:

Normally Bootcamp lasts for 10 weeks, but this one is starting a bit later than I would usually, so it will last for 8 weeks, so it will finish just before Christmas.

The first two weeks are the strictest, and then after that you can either:

  • move on to Bootcamp Light, which is a little more relaxed
  • choose to stay on Bootcamp if it suits you
  • choose a hybrid, i.e. Bootcamp during the week and Bootcamp Light at the weekend

We don't eat any of the following, during the whole 8 weeks:

  • potatoes
  • pasta/noodles
  • rice
  • bread or any bread products
  • pastry, or anything made with flour
  • sugar (which also includes honey, agave syrup, maple syrup)

And in the first two weeks, we also don't have any fruit, nuts, seeds or alcohol.

Each Monday I will start a new chat thread, and the OP will link to our spreadsheet, which the lovely wombattoo has agreed to oversee this time. You will (if you want to - it's not compulsory) add your weight each week, so that you can track your losses. On the spreadsheet, at the bottom, are lots of tabs which show you:

  • the rules of Bootcamp and Bootcamp Light
  • a list of carb counts for various vegetables (including a carb counter, so you can work out the carb count of the veg you're eating, if you want to)
  • a whole load of really helpful resources - books, blogs and links to videos - about low carbing, which will help you to get your head around low carbing
OP posts:
BIWI · 22/10/2016 20:23

And here are the rules of Bootcamp. Just ten!

1. Eat three proper meals a day.
"You must eat breakfast. It doesn’t have to be a lot, and it doesn’t have to be absolutely first thing, but you must have something. For the rest of the day, if you’re eating enough food and you are in ketosis then you shouldn’t be hungry between meals. But if you are hungry, eat something. (Hard boiled eggs make a great snack).

After the first two weeks of Bootcamp we will relax this, but these two weeks are critical in terms of helping you switch easily to a low carb way of eating - and if you start to feel hungry, it makes things much harder! Eating this way will ensure that your blood sugar levels are kept stable, which will mean that you are much less likely to experience hunger.

A typical high carbohydrate diet can mean that snacking is a routine part of your day. Once your blood sugar levels are stable, by eating low carb, you should find that you no longer want to snack. But the rule of thumb here is ‘if you are hungry, eat!’. (Just make sure you are only choosing low carb snacks, of course!)"

2. Avoid processed foods.
Focus on pure, natural protein as the basis for your meals - meat/fish/eggs. Things like sausages, ham, bacon, pre-prepared burgers etc should be avoided as much as possible. You can have them, but just not every day. Avoid foods marketed as low carb, eg. Atkins Daybreak bars.

3. Eat lots of fat.
Eating fat will not make you fat. Honestly! But it will keep your appetite satisfied, and it sustains your body’s energy requirements perfectly. Fat does not provoke an insulin spike, unlike carbs which do (a lot) and protein (a little). Fry in butter, add butter to vegetables, eat salad with a home-made vinaigrette dressing (not made with balsamic vinegar though, as this is too sweet), add mayonnaise where you can (just check the carb count on your mayo first). Eat fattier cuts of meat – e.g. pork belly, roast chicken with the skin on and/or eat the fat off your lamb chops. Absolutely no low fat/light foods of any kind!

4. Make sure you are eating vegetables and salads with your food.
This is where your carbs should come from, and this is non-negotiable. But choose only those vegetables that are on the allowed list. Make sure that you focus on eating those vegetables that are 3g carb per 100g or less, and this will ensure that your carb counts are kept low. You don’t have to weigh/count carbs – this is one of the great joys of this WOE (way of eating), but if you’re new to low carbing it can be helpful to weigh your portions of veg in the early days, just so that you know how many carbs are in the sort of portions that you like to eat.

5. Be careful about dairy (apart from butter, which is unlimited).
Dairy can impede weight loss for some people. If you are still drinking tea/coffee with milk or cream, try to restrict yourself to max 2 cups per day. There are a lot of carbs in milk, so if you are having several cups of tea/coffee per day, you will quickly rack up your daily carb count (e.g. 1 medium latte contains more than 12g carbs!) You may eat cheese but again, don't overdo it. Full fat yoghurt is the best way to include dairy in your diet - but beware, it does contain carbs. Total Full Fat is the best

6. You must drink a minimum of 2 litres of water per day.
"The more weight you have to lose, the more water you should drink. This is from www.low-carbdiet.co.uk/. Water is essential to weight loss for those who eat low-carb. The minimum consumed in a day should be:
Your Weight----Litres
140lbs-----2.5
160lbs-----3.0
180lbs-----3.0
200lbs-----3.5
220lbs-----3.5
240lbs-----4.0
260lbs-----4.5
280lbs-----4.5
300lbs-----5.0
320lbs-----5.5
340lbs-----5.5
360lbs-----6.0
380lbs-----6.5
400lbs-----6.5

High levels of ketones in the blood stream can lead to a reduction in ketone production, therefore being well hydrated could aid in keeping the levels low and ketone production ongoing. Consuming enough water can have many other positive side effects: aids your kidneys with the processing of protein, reduces the retention of water, helps with preventing constipation, and reduces the levels of ketones released by your breath, which in-turn will reduce breath odour. However, drinking a lot of water can mean that you also need to keep an eye on your electrolyte balance. You need to make sure that you are consuming sufficient sodium and potassium. On a low carb diet we can eat more salt, so make sure that you are cooking with salt and adding salt to food, if you like it. Good, low carb, sources of potassium are spinach (raw), avocado, mushrooms, courgettes and asparagus, as well as salmon and yoghurt."

7. No alcohol.
Alcohol is the easiest source of fuel for the body to burn, so it will always use this first before it starts to burn any fat - which is why you need to restrict it, especially in the first two weeks of Bootcamp, when we are encouraging the body to stop using carbs for its source of fuel and turn to fat-burning instead. If you really can't do this - at least try and restrict it to the weekend. Vodka with soda is the best thing to drink. Or Champagne, red wine or dry white wine.

8. No fruit.
Really. Seriously. Honestly. None at all. Zilch. Nada. After the first two weeks of Bootcamp you will be able to introduce certain fruits, but at this stage fruit is simply too carby. We are also trying to break the addiction to sweet things, so cutting fruit out is part of this process. If you are getting all your carbs from vegetables and salad, you will be getting all the nutrients and fibre that you need.

9. No nuts/seeds.
You can introduce these in moderation when you move on to Bootcamp Light, but it's very easy to eat lots of these, which means you can quickly be consuming a lot of carbs

10. No sugar or artificial sweeteners.
Sugar is an obvious ‘no no’, but artificial sweeteners are also an issue. One of the aims of this way of eating is to eat pure and natural foods, so including sweeteners is not recommended. Some people find that artificial sweeteners can impede their weight loss, and there is some suggestion that your body can respond to sweeteners as if they were sugar, by releasing more insulin - and therefore laying down fat. Given that the aim of Bootcamp is to help us lose our sweet tooth and addiction to sweet things, then it is a good idea to avoid sweeteners altogether in this first two weeks.

OP posts:
RJnomore1 · 22/10/2016 20:48

Sorry I read down a bit then got lost in lists so I skipped to the end. Most of that will fit in with what I need to do. Lots of water and boiled eggs and salad and veg is PERFECT.

BIWI · 22/10/2016 21:10
Grin
OP posts:
BiskettiBollockNose · 22/10/2016 21:50

Can I join? I'm brands planking new here

BiskettiBollockNose · 22/10/2016 21:51

Or brand-spanking!

Lucylocket13 · 22/10/2016 22:05

Can I join please?

SingingTunelessly · 22/10/2016 22:15

BIWI, thank you for refresher list. A well timed reminder and guideline. Bisketti and Lucy welcome! This is such a great way of eating and BIWI is a brilliant guide and arse kicker when necessary - trust me I know 😩 It's not easy at times but it really works honestly.

MothershipG · 22/10/2016 22:26

Please could I be added to the spreadsheet.

I have lost 25lbs since the start of the last BC but have utterly stalled in the last few weeks so I'm hoping a couple of weeks of strict BC will help.

I have allowed myself to fall off the wagon and into a pile of carbs this weekend, today I ate chips for the first time since the last BC started. But I'm ready to climb back aboard on Monday.

BiskettiBollockNose · 22/10/2016 23:08

BIWI
TheForeignOffice
Inaclearing
Wombattoo
Achangeisgonnacome
Piscivorous (no spreadsheet)
Pippilottaviktualia
StuntNun
Flisspaps
habibihabibi
MyShinyThing
Sheepysheep
Kitkat6
nekobus
TwoflowersLuggageR
WilfSell
boldlygoingsomewhere
Keeponkeepinon
Veryflummoxed
Primitivio
imustbepatient
Polkadotties
bettyblueeyes83
DoctorBeat
MaryThorne
Lisbapalea
Chopsticks
GuyMartinsSideburns
Peachypips
Paddypants13 (no spreadsheet)
Notsoold
RainbowJack
Peaceloveandbiscuits
fandancelil
ariana1
Xocaraic
Hadmeathello
Originalusenamefail
Raisingirls
Cisforcat
BoredOfItAll
tanker dale
AnneElliott
Badhairday1001
TwirlyFoo
ThingInTheAttic
Thecontentedcat
Lovelycuppateas
momofgirls
FinallyHere (no spreadsheet)
Conflictedoncemore
GinThief
Spotty rainbow
Bettybiggestballs
clare8allthepies
Visaste
Plumstone
CassandraKumquat
SoulMateDestiny
granjinx
cousinsandra
FarelyKnuts
Feekerry smile
Whistle73
MamaLuluLump
whateveryousay
SweetBabyJebus
Eva50
Readyforno2
Poppiesway
zobalina77
Pengweng
CaptainBraandPants
Daftaboutthecat
Ndotto
PopGoesTheFuckingWeasel
43andcounting
BradleyPooper
SestraClone
LexLoofah
Lenska999
galaxygirl45
Notso
TolpuddleFarterOATB
GoldenGumballs
dillite
Femp2012
regularbutpanickingabit
stegosauruslady
Walkingtowork
Fufulina
Billionnairewannabe
worldsworstchildren
amistillsexy
ASISAYNOTASIDO
Willow33
AmyC86
insertcoolusernamehere
Whathaveilost
concretejungle
TotalBlamBlam
Misssss
Needabiscuit
KeiD
SingingTunelessly
becs1973
Girlrunningoncheese
toolatetobackoutnow
Wandastartup
FrameyMcFrame
todgerthedodger
SunshineInMySprocket
StopMeProcrastinating
MyVisionsComefromSoup
PaulineFowlersGrowler
SeasideRock
BiskettiBollockNose

runningtogetskinny · 22/10/2016 23:42

BIWI
TheForeignOffice
Inaclearing
Wombattoo
Achangeisgonnacome
Piscivorous (no spreadsheet)
Pippilottaviktualia
StuntNun
Flisspaps
habibihabibi
MyShinyThing
Sheepysheep
Kitkat6
nekobus
TwoflowersLuggageR
WilfSell
boldlygoingsomewhere
Keeponkeepinon
Veryflummoxed
Primitivio
imustbepatient
Polkadotties
bettyblueeyes83
DoctorBeat
MaryThorne
Lisbapalea
Chopsticks
GuyMartinsSideburns
Peachypips
Paddypants13 (no spreadsheet)
Notsoold
RainbowJack
Peaceloveandbiscuits
fandancelil
ariana1
Xocaraic
Hadmeathello
Originalusenamefail
Raisingirls
Cisforcat
BoredOfItAll
tanker dale
AnneElliott
Badhairday1001
TwirlyFoo
ThingInTheAttic
Thecontentedcat
Lovelycuppateas
momofgirls
FinallyHere (no spreadsheet)
Conflictedoncemore
GinThief
Spotty rainbow
Bettybiggestballs
clare8allthepies
Visaste
Plumstone
CassandraKumquat
SoulMateDestiny
granjinx
cousinsandra
FarelyKnuts
Feekerry smile
Whistle73
MamaLuluLump
whateveryousay
SweetBabyJebus
Eva50
Readyforno2
Poppiesway
zobalina77
Pengweng
CaptainBraandPants
Daftaboutthecat
Ndotto
PopGoesTheFuckingWeasel
43andcounting
BradleyPooper
SestraClone
LexLoofah
Lenska999
galaxygirl45
Notso
TolpuddleFarterOATB
GoldenGumballs
dillite
Femp2012
regularbutpanickingabit
stegosauruslady
Walkingtowork
Fufulina
Billionnairewannabe
worldsworstchildren
amistillsexy
ASISAYNOTASIDO
Willow33
AmyC86
insertcoolusernamehere
Whathaveilost
concretejungle
TotalBlamBlam
Misssss
Needabiscuit
KeiD
SingingTunelessly
becs1973
Girlrunningoncheese
toolatetobackoutnow
Wandastartup
FrameyMcFrame
todgerthedodger
SunshineInMySprocket
StopMeProcrastinating
MyVisionsComefromSoup
PaulineFowlersGrowler
SeasideRock
BiskettiBollockNose
Runningtogetskinny

Zucker · 22/10/2016 23:48

BIWI
TheForeignOffice
Inaclearing
Wombattoo
Achangeisgonnacome
Piscivorous (no spreadsheet)
Pippilottaviktualia
StuntNun
Flisspaps
habibihabibi
MyShinyThing
Sheepysheep
Kitkat6
nekobus
TwoflowersLuggageR
WilfSell
boldlygoingsomewhere
Keeponkeepinon
Veryflummoxed
Primitivio
imustbepatient
Polkadotties
bettyblueeyes83
DoctorBeat
MaryThorne
Lisbapalea
Chopsticks
GuyMartinsSideburns
Peachypips
Paddypants13 (no spreadsheet)
Notsoold
RainbowJack
Peaceloveandbiscuits
fandancelil
ariana1
Xocaraic
Hadmeathello
Originalusenamefail
Raisingirls
Cisforcat
BoredOfItAll
tanker dale
AnneElliott
Badhairday1001
TwirlyFoo
ThingInTheAttic
Thecontentedcat
Lovelycuppateas
momofgirls
FinallyHere (no spreadsheet)
Conflictedoncemore
GinThief
Spotty rainbow
Bettybiggestballs
clare8allthepies
Visaste
Plumstone
CassandraKumquat
SoulMateDestiny
granjinx
cousinsandra
FarelyKnuts
Feekerry smile
Whistle73
MamaLuluLump
whateveryousay
SweetBabyJebus
Eva50
Readyforno2
Poppiesway
zobalina77
Pengweng
CaptainBraandPants
Daftaboutthecat
Ndotto
PopGoesTheFuckingWeasel
43andcounting
BradleyPooper
SestraClone
LexLoofah
Lenska999
galaxygirl45
Notso
TolpuddleFarterOATB
GoldenGumballs
dillite
Femp2012
regularbutpanickingabit
stegosauruslady
Walkingtowork
Fufulina
Billionnairewannabe
worldsworstchildren
amistillsexy
ASISAYNOTASIDO
Willow33
AmyC86
insertcoolusernamehere
Whathaveilost
concretejungle
TotalBlamBlam
Misssss
Needabiscuit
KeiD
SingingTunelessly
becs1973
Girlrunningoncheese
toolatetobackoutnow
Wandastartup
FrameyMcFrame
todgerthedodger
SunshineInMySprocket
StopMeProcrastinating
MyVisionsComefromSoup
PaulineFowlersGrowler
SeasideRock
BiskettiBollockNose
Runningtogetskinny
Zucker

Kleptronic · 22/10/2016 23:55

BIWI
TheForeignOffice
Inaclearing
Wombattoo
Achangeisgonnacome
Piscivorous (no spreadsheet)
Pippilottaviktualia
StuntNun
Flisspaps
habibihabibi
MyShinyThing
Sheepysheep
Kitkat6
nekobus
TwoflowersLuggageR
WilfSell
boldlygoingsomewhere
Keeponkeepinon
Veryflummoxed
Primitivio
imustbepatient
Polkadotties
bettyblueeyes83
DoctorBeat
MaryThorne
Lisbapalea
Chopsticks
GuyMartinsSideburns
Peachypips
Paddypants13 (no spreadsheet)
Notsoold
RainbowJack
Peaceloveandbiscuits
fandancelil
ariana1
Xocaraic
Hadmeathello
Originalusenamefail
Raisingirls
Cisforcat
BoredOfItAll
tanker dale
AnneElliott
Badhairday1001
TwirlyFoo
ThingInTheAttic
Thecontentedcat
Lovelycuppateas
momofgirls
FinallyHere (no spreadsheet)
Conflictedoncemore
GinThief
Spotty rainbow
Bettybiggestballs
clare8allthepies
Visaste
Plumstone
CassandraKumquat
SoulMateDestiny
granjinx
cousinsandra
FarelyKnuts
Feekerry smile
Whistle73
MamaLuluLump
whateveryousay
SweetBabyJebus
Eva50
Readyforno2
Poppiesway
zobalina77
Pengweng
CaptainBraandPants
Daftaboutthecat
Ndotto
PopGoesTheFuckingWeasel
43andcounting
BradleyPooper
SestraClone
LexLoofah
Lenska999
galaxygirl45
Notso
TolpuddleFarterOATB
GoldenGumballs
dillite
Femp2012
regularbutpanickingabit
stegosauruslady
Walkingtowork
Fufulina
Billionnairewannabe
worldsworstchildren
amistillsexy
ASISAYNOTASIDO
Willow33
AmyC86
insertcoolusernamehere
Whathaveilost
concretejungle
TotalBlamBlam
Misssss
Needabiscuit
KeiD
SingingTunelessly
becs1973
Girlrunningoncheese
toolatetobackoutnow
Wandastartup
FrameyMcFrame
todgerthedodger
SunshineInMySprocket
StopMeProcrastinating
MyVisionsComefromSoup
PaulineFowlersGrowler
SeasideRock
BiskettiBollockNose
Runningtogetskinny
Zucker
Kleptronic