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Lone parents

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Original poster

ex refusing take DS swimming lessons and football on his weekends

114 replies

Happylander · 24/02/2012 15:46

My ex wanted contact every other weekend and I agreed with this and he agreed to take him to his swimming lessons and football lessons that I pay for. DS was going to both of these prior to split and really enjoys them. Ex is now saying he won't take him and is going for a contact order to get everything official. This is despite him not turning up on more than 2 occasions to see him and going on holiday over christmas with OW rather than spend any of his annual leave with DS!! I have now said that he won't see DS if he won't take him to these activities and as he has continually threatened me with court he can now wait until court order is in place. Getting very very tired of his constant threats now.

Solicitor has said a judge would rule that DS carries on going to both activities as they were already on place before ex left for OW. Does anyone else have any experience of this?

OP posts:

DollyTwat · 24/02/2012 20:53

Happy it takes monumental self control not to rise to the bait
But if you can always have a backup plan sorted, never ever tell him you're going anywhere, it's fine and you won't be angry

My ex used to love taking me to court every 6 months or so, he'd be really nasty to the kids, they'd refuse to see him, he'd do the court thing and the cycle would begin again. I'm expecting it to do just that quite soon!

As soon as I self represented it wasn't so much fun for him. He knew it was costing me loads (him on legal aid) so he stopped that game for a bit

PigletUnrepentant · 24/02/2012 20:54

Happylander, IME a NRP can disappear from the life of the children for years, but if he claims in court he is repentant and wants to have regular contact again, the court will see to accommodate his wishes. You will need more than a tone of evidence to get sympathy for wanting to block contact: clear and well defined emotional abuse or neglect, and always have enough expert witnesses wishing to support your case.

Blocking contact because he doesn't want to get the children to the classes will get you both a slap on the hand. (and lots of bitterness as well)

Yes, the activities are important, I agree, but believe me, your child is going to have a much better life with two parents who are able to co-parent in peace than with two parents that are always frustrated with each other but take him to swimming classes on saturdays. SO my position would be for you two to sit down and agree to a middle ground solution that doesn't disturb the peace and your ability to co parent together.

zipzap · 24/02/2012 21:02

In case things do go to court, keep a log of all contact from your ex, good or bad; texts, emails, phone calls, face to face, messages passed on by in laws etc.

And keep a note of every time he us supposed to have contact, whether or not he turns up, what time he turns up/returns ds when he does have him, then what ds says they do; whether or not they go to the activities and what they do if they don't go. If your ex lives a long way away and takes him back to his house then it's kind of understandable he would want to do this some of the time and difficult to argue against. If he is staying locally and can't be bothered as he wants to go to the pub /lie in / Etc then it's very different.

But if you keep a real time record of how your ex behaves as the nrp then it will help to give the judge an insigt into what your ex is really like.

Original poster

Happylander · 24/02/2012 21:06

He doesn't have his own house as he lives in Army barracks 2.5 hours away. I have just sent him a text to say he can him after his football on Sunday. I expect he will ignore it though.

OP posts:

Namechangerjustincase · 24/02/2012 21:10

Be careful Happylander!

Don't get me wrong - I completely share your frustration and totally understand where you are coming from as I am in the same position in fact. :(

After a pretty nauseating performance from the ex in our single attempt at mediation he put in an application to court. I have to say I am still recovering from the first hearing and my solicitor is increasingly telling me that there is a good chance I may not get what I, and more importantly, my DCs want. :(

I can't tell you how much it annoys me that this selfish man is willing to swan in with his demands and not think about the impact on his 2 innocent children. However, my solicitor says that the court may judge HIS weekend plans and HIS contact time more important than my DCs plans. There might be differences in our situations though. In our case it is to with the fact he lives nearly 2 hours away and do with their ages - 5 and 10. The 10 year olds views may have some weight but my barrister was even more blunt than my solicitor and told me not to pin my hopes on even that. She said that the courts would start to feel extra-curricular activities and social life carry greater weight the older the child gets but that 10 is likely to be too young for this to be a deciding factor. They have to be more like 14-15ish she thought. It annoys me as my DD won't be in a position to have those sort of opportunities at 14 if she can't take them up now.

I posted on the legal thread around Christmas time (under this name as I thought ex-SIL might recognise my usual name) and although I didn't like their advice it is starting to seem like they might be right... perhaps try posting there also? I really hope your situation is more hopeful than mine but you need to know the legal correct position as well as the morally correct one :(

PinkCarBlueCar · 24/02/2012 21:12

And what purple says too.

He is right - it's his contact time, and you can't tell him what he will or won't do with it. And you shouldn't be surprised that when you try to tell him, he decides to dig his heels in, just the same as you're doing...

I get what you're saying and I agree with you (to an extent), but it doesn't stop it being his contact time, and not actually up to you what he does with it.

Stopping his contact will put you in the wrong. If he then takes it to court, you will have some way to go to convince the judge that you're not blocking contact, especially since you've done his work for him by essentially saying do what I tell you with your contact, or you don't get any.

Original poster

Happylander · 24/02/2012 21:27

well I just had a reply from him saying he doesn't want to see DS until contact order is in place.

OP posts:

PigletUnrepentant · 24/02/2012 21:32

:-( Sorry for that.

It may be a while before he gets a date in court.

Original poster

Happylander · 24/02/2012 21:34

how long do you think it will be? he will be self representing too

OP posts:

DollyTwat · 24/02/2012 21:36

Keep that then Happy as its evidence in court that you're not blocking contact

Email him with your very reasonable suggestions as to how the activities could be achieved. Show that you're being as reasonable as possible
If you can get someone from football to write a quick email saying how good he is etc that may help as well.

As long as you are doing your very best to make it work you can't do any more. Court is fine, don't worry if you know you've done all you can to be reasonable and tried to make it work

purpleroses · 24/02/2012 21:36

:( That's a shame for DS. On the plus side he'll get to do his activities for the time being I guess

ChippingInNeedsCoffee · 24/02/2012 21:40

Well, that's not a bad thing (legally speaking, but probably a bit upsetting for DS??) it will show up his true colours. He probably also thinks that (hopefully incorrectly) that this will make you back down. Don't. Let him play this drama out by himself.

DollyTwat · 24/02/2012 21:41

Happy don't feel bad that your ds won't see his dad as he wants to do his football. You didn't make that decision. Your ds didn't make that choice.

If it wasn't this it would be something else

edam · 24/02/2012 21:42

What a selfish git. Second the advice to keep records so you can show he is being unreliable and unreasonable.

Friend of ds's had similar problems - she wanted to go to music lessons on Saturday mornings (with ds and some other friends from school) but her rotten father wouldn't let her go on 'his' weekends. (Shouldn't be 'his', should be 'her weekends with her Dad' as in, the child comes first.) She tried going every other Saturday for two terms but was falling behind everyone else. Now they are in a different year at school she does recorder lessons at school - but I can't help thinking her Father was being an oaf.

Namechangerjustincase · 24/02/2012 21:54

He will need to go to at least one mediation session before he can make an application to court. If you refuse then that means he can apply immediately.

I hadn't fully appreciated this before I went to our session and rather wish I'd delayed it a bit to try to have a think what to do (bearing in mind I still don't know what the outcome of our case will be and accepting that I am anticipating the worst).

There are a couple of things I would have done differently:

Firstly, if you get an invite to mediate you don't have much of a choice but to go (unless there are abuse issues). Having read your thread again it sounds like you have spoken to someone legal which is good and hopefully means things are different in your case. I wish I'd seen a solicitor before the mediation session as it was all too much to take in and I might have played it differently there had I been more prepared for what might happen later at court. Talk to your solicitor about mediation and get some information on it. It might even look good if you are the one to suggest it.

Also, as much as it annoys me, I wish I had kept to the previous contact pattern for a bit longer. The barrister thought the fact I was previously proposing we reduced contact so the DCs could concentrate on their activities might go against me.

Namechangerjustincase · 24/02/2012 21:57

Forgot to say - timescale was alarmingly quick. He got annoyed about things in November/December, we had mediation in early January swiftly followed by court papers arriving on my doormat and 5 weeks later we were in court. :(

There is now some delay before the next court date.

Original poster

Happylander · 24/02/2012 21:58

I have text him again saying how much DS loves his football class etc but he is saying it is not fair on him and not practical because what is he supposed to do with him for the rest of the day?!?!

He is flatly refusing to see DS on Sunday saying he needs an order in place. This is a man that has refused to have him, not bothered turning up and gone on holiday instead of seeing DS over the christmas period. I asked him to be here on Christmas morning to watch him open his presents and also assumed he would have him during his week off during that period but he chose to go on holiday instead. Now he is the one saying he needs something in writing??

Well I have tried and I even apologised for saying he can't have him and that I was wrong to say that. On a plus at least I have it all in a text that he is refusing to see him.

I hate all this. Really hate it.

OP posts:

Original poster

Happylander · 24/02/2012 22:08

Oh and Ex states he can put contact order in where he likes but I thought it had to go in where child resides. Anyone know about that?

OP posts:

DollyTwat · 24/02/2012 22:09

Happy you're not seeing things in the same way as him though

You are trying to do your best by your ds and are upset he isn't

He seems to be stalling for a contact order. To put you in your place. The crux here is that whatever the court order says only YOU are bound by it. He isn't. You can't make him have contact. There are no penalties for him.

DollyTwat · 24/02/2012 22:16

I don't know about the where he puts the court papers into sorry, you may be better pousting in legal for that

Keep strong Happy. These are not choices you are making

piellabakewell · 25/02/2012 08:47

My DP lives over 200 miles away from his DD and when he reluctantly had to go to court for contact to be formally agreed, it was the court near where his DD lives. That is the rule.

Original poster

Happylander · 25/02/2012 08:57

Thank you. I thought that was the case. It is all such a shame as I agreed to him having him every other weekend like he wanted and in fact I asked why he wouldn't be seeing him at least once every weekend if not the whole weekend. He says he can't do that. I even have emails with him saying that of course he will carry on taking DS to activities as he did before he left. That he would have him during his annual leave however, his DD has said she doesn't want our DS for the whole 2 weeks he has her and so he will only be having DS for 1 week in summer!

Now with him flatly refusing to see DS until contact order is in is horrible. I apologised for saying he can't see DS said I was angry at him putting in a contact order when as far as I was concerned all contact had been agreed. Just said that unless I agree to everything he states then he doesn't want to hear from me. He had all this with his DD and he got less contact than he was after as a judge set out the contact in the end. Why would a dad not want to take their DS to football?? I always thought parenting was about taking an interest in your child and encouraging them in activities that benefit them. That you have to put yourself out for your kids. I am very sad about all of this.

OP posts:

Original poster

Happylander · 25/02/2012 09:34

Well have sent him two texts this morning asking that he sees DS after football tomorrow and stated that just because we don't agree on DS doing these activities that it is unfair for DS to miss out on contact. I stated that it is unfair to refuse to see him until a contact order is in place as DS needs to see his dad. I have been ignored.

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ChippingInNeedsCoffee · 25/02/2012 09:48

Happylander - how upset is DS? Unless he is absolutely gutted I would leave it. He is showing his true colours, let him do all of that before you go to court. You will be in a much stronger position. A few weeks of not seeing his Dad will not damage DS in anyway & it may mean he gets to continue to do his football etc if the judge insists that his dad does that.

You have to play the long game my love.

Original poster

Happylander · 25/02/2012 10:36

He is not upset as not aware that his dad is not coming now. I stopped telling him after the last time he failed to turn up. He has now said it is not fair on him to travel all that way for a day with DS. Funny he has done it before. Says it is not right for a few hours...erm 10am until 18:00 is more than a few hours.

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