New Secondary Schools for Richmond 2

[BayJay]

I'm starting this new thread because the other one of the same name has filled up.

Let us not overdo the delight until the deal is done. A feasibility study is just that - nothing may come of it. However the news is as welcome as it is unexpected. Here is a link to the press release: [[home/councilgovernmentanddemocracy/council/civic-offices/departments/communications/pressoffice/pressreleases/march2012pressreleases/anothernewsecondaryschoolconsideredforborough.htm
Another new secondary school considered for borough]].

I don't think the debate about inclusive admissions will go away, especially because the law has moved on. But it is nice to have some positive news :)

Vince Cable suggested the college as a school site some time ago (see his letter to Michael Gove 26th Aug 2011). Given the debate over whether sixth forms will reduce the size of the college its an obvious way of tackling two problems at once, if its feasible, and if they can get the capital to do it.

I agree with muminlondon that the inclusive admissions issue will only go away if the council take note of the new Education Act and call for a Catholic Academy proposal to replace the VA proposal.

I think though BayJay, as you have said already, there are such a wide range of views in the risc camp that a good number will feel happy with this news.
The hard core 'no VA school' camp will continue to protest, but many others will be delighted.

I think that this news will be considered by the council alongside the outcome of the consultation - it must think that this is a win-win and the answer to keep the biggest number of it's voters happy.

Hang on all before we get excited my school got news that this school is targetted for 2017 . So this is same as what council earlier said and is an attempt to take minds away from issue on clifden .

People will see through this sham and the council cannot get away with this to justify the use of clifden road for a catholic va school

Seenbutnotheard maybe if the council decides to give clifden road to a community school your group could make a bid for a catholic academy at richmond college . That would be a win win and welcomed by all

Not quite - 70 Catholic places is a drop in the ocean in terms of the children leaving the borough each and every year.
What would you think about 2 Catholic Academies to boost the numbers?

2 Catholic academies is better than 1 exclusive Catholic VA school, if there is support and demand from everyone in the community. The law of the land allows but will be subject to competition from other bidders

Given that the two sites are within less than half a mile of each other, surely this can be seen as nothing other than a win-win. 2 Cathoilc adademies would mean less choice for local residents, not more wouldn't it?
Let's wait to see what the consultation says. If the community have demonstrated they want a Catholic VA school, and there is another community site available practically on it's door step - I think that the council may well see it as a no-brainer.

The interesting thing is, from Risc's perspective I think they may lose some of their core support - I have had three friends who signed the Risc petition text/email me already to say 'what good news' or similar.

Another twist in the soap opera, but this is stale news. The core issue will still remain giving priority to a exclusive Catholic school in 2013, with a faint hope of a community school in 2017? Does not pass the muster.
The Tories need to grow up and stop behaving and treating us like like 9 yr olds.

akhan: please share with us exactly what your school has been told about this, at this moment, merely possible new school. You imply that it is more than 'possible'.

I think you will find that many do not agree with you Jeev - even the Lib Dems have said that if Clifden Road is a community school it should be shelved until 2016.

Chris - Apologies you are right, school has been told that merely a possibility that the site could be used for a secondary in 2017. I was not trying to spin this like the Council is !

Jeev your joke on 9 yr old aside, Councils continued failure to recognise the need for a school by 2014 is upsetting a lot of our school parents.

sorry i meant 2013

I did not interpret the Lib Dems statement to say no school should be opened till 2016 at Clifden Road. In fact on the contrary the overwhelming demand for the free school has proven that there is a strong case to open the school in 2013.

Jeev - taken from the document link that is on the risc website and ChrisSqire linked to previously...
"We therefore propose that the Clifden Road site should be reserved for a new 5 form entry community school to be opened in 2016"

twickenhamlibdems.co.uk/en/article/2012/571200/what-to-do-with-the-clifden-road-site-the-lib-dem-view

Jeev/Seenbutnotheard, you are both right. However, neither the council nor the lib dems have any control over the Free School process so they can't assume there will be any schools ready to open in 2013. In the absence of an approved Free School they would need to invite academy bids. Prossibly 2016 is a reflection of how long they think it would take them to go through that process (presumably after the feasibility study).

It would be interesting to know more about both sites. One will be available sooner. Perhaps the other has better access to facilities and sports grounds.

It's confusing with new legislation in place but a VA proposal that doesn't appear to follow it. Who would give final approval to the VA bid - the council or the Secretary of State?

I find the justification for not having a Catholic academy, because of no of Catholic students very disturbing. Our local Hampton Church proposal could have also said that there are more CoE students than available spaces and stuck to the 50-50 free school legislation. However the CoE decided to go for 100% inclusivity in the interest of serving the entire community in which we live.

Just using the nos only and the fact that lot of students go out of borough or private, or the fact that 9 CoE primary students need continuity of CoE education at secondary, can we justify 1 or 2 new CoE secondaries ? I hope if and when that happens, it is for an inclusive CoE academy. Catholic students are fortunate that if they do not want to go for our local secondaries they can get into out of borough Catholic secondaries. All other do not have that option and either go private or move homes.

A lot of Catholic parents have understandably been encouraged by the hardline stance taken by people like Lord True and Kevin Cloakey. I am praying that in the consultation they opened their hearts and minds and indicated preference for a Catholic academy instead of the current proposal. We shall have to wait and see the results!

The Lib Dem paper What to do with the Clifden Road site should be read as their answer to the question that the Cabinet must decide in May; it assumes that Clifden road is the only site to be had. If the Egerton road site is also available a new study of the options is needed.

The 2016 date requires both a free school and a N Kingston school, neither of which may happen. If they don?t the new school will be needed in 2015.

The paper says nothing about what may happen in Hounslow, where the birth rate has shot up ahead of the provision of new schools. It points out that the council??s assumption that the out of borough rate will fall from 32 % to 12 % is 'extremely optimistic', which I think we may interpret as 'completely unrealistic' or even 'completely daft' (given the likely influx of Kingston pupils into Teddington Schools once it?s delinked).

The truth is that we can?t forecast what will happen to the ?out of borough rate?. However, the map shows that the Egerton road site lies 340m north of the Clifden road site, and so closer to the Ivybridge estate (the borough boundary, for those who don?t know, runs along the east side of Rugby Road and then along the bit of the River Crane that runs behind Marlow Crescent and Burnside Close). As the catchment area may be no more than 1.5 km round the school, this is a significant difference.

Hi all, Teddington School has just confirmed they are converting to academy status and that from Sep 13 admissions will be by distance and the link system no longer applies. Assume this will apply to all local schools so all will be equally accessible by borough children depending on proximity to school. I guess this will impact most on West Twickenham and North Teddington residents as Kingston and Ham pupils could get priority at Teddington, although presumably Orleans will draw from Richmond and Twickenham rather than Isleworth. I expect not much change in need for new places at Clifden, but most local schools make up likely to change over next few years.

The possibility of a new site is potentially very good news for everyone. However, I do think it highlights that the Council has rushed into trying to set up a Catholic VA school.

I support the provision of a Catholic secondary if its admissions are non-selective. The academy/free school 50% inclusive rulings would be acceptable to me. If a quality new community school could be set up on its doorstep, I doubt that there would be a significant number of non-Catholics who would choose the Catholic Secondary - there would be every reason to assume that all the in-Borough Catholics that wanted them would still get places.

What is of concern to me is that if a new secondary on the Richmond College site is feasible then it's the right site for a community school. Chris has already highlighted its closer proximity to the Hounslow boundary than Clifden. It's also marginally closer to Twickenham Academy. Also would this school have a separate sixth form and how would this work being on the same site as Richmond College? Maybe it would make a better location for the Catholic Secondary? I don't know, but I do think it should be properly investigated. There's no sudden urgent need for a Catholic secondary afterall. Better to delay it by a year or two than make a mistake we're then stuck with for 150 years.

Whatever happens, I don't think the call for inclusive admissions on a new Catholic school is going to go away. The law changed and it did so for a reason. It's far from looking like win/win just yet.

The Catholic VA proposal envisages a sixth form of 300. That's bigger than any of the other schools in the borough - are they hoping for a 100% success rate in their GCSEs?

Parrich - perhaps you are not aware, but Christ's school is undersubscribed for it's faith places!

Christs is oversubscribed. Its foundation places have recently been undersubscribed but there have been more than enough applicants in the open category to compensate. It will be increasing its proportion of open places to 50% soon.