Bank obstructing probate application.

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A relative died recently and I am the named executor. It is a simple estate and I have done this before, so am not using a professional to do it.

The issue I am facing is that the relative's bank will not tell me the bank balance at the date of death until I have the grant of probate. I cannot apply for probate until I have details of all my relative's assets. A catch 22 situation.
I am not asking them to release the funds, only for the balance information.
Has anyone come across this before? Is there a solution?
Edited for spag.

Have you contacted the bank’s dedicated bereavement line?

Yes I completed the online reporting form. I have the reference number and went into the branch. They said they can pay the funeral expenses before probate. I asked about obtaing information regarding the balances at the date of death. They said I would receive a letter, which I now have. The letter states that they cannot release any information about the accounts until I have the death certificate, grant of probate and ID to prove my identity. Thankfully my relative had funds in NS &I so any inheritance tax can be paid direct to HMRC from there when I am actually able to apply for probate. I have a bank statement for the current account and ISA (same bank) but it is 3 years old, so is too out of date for me to use for the probate application.

You need to give them a copy of the death certificate, your ID and proof that you are the executor on the will then they will give you the information.

assuming this means the estate is taxable then? If it wasn’t then you’d be okay to use one slightly out of date and guesstimate the difference (they won’t care about a few pounds difference on a non taxable estate). Honestly you’d probably be okay to use a best guess for now anyway, you put the accurate figures on the IHT400.

Otherwise, have you tried providing the bank with just a copy of the Will which names you as exec to see if they will take that for now?

I believe from what I have found that there will most likely to be IHT to pay. I asked if they could provide the information needed for probate if I provided the will to show I am the executor. They still insisted they need to see the grant of probate and referred to the letter I received.
I could estimate the bank balance but don't want to pay IHT if the estate actually falls under the threshold.
I have now managed to make an appointment at the branch to speak to someone. Hopefully I may be able to convince them that I really need the information.

I have said I could do this(didn't have the death cert then due to hospital holding things up) but they still insist on seeing the grant of probate.

Have you provided the DC and your ID? Once they have that they will be able to provide DOD balances. I don’t think they’ve said they won’t provide it without GOP as you require these to apply for GOP

They only require on seeing sight of GOP before funds can be released.
You will have to wait the the DC before they’ll give you the balance. This makes total sense. They can’t give you the balance of someone else’s account without proof they have actually died

I agree. Hopefully at the appointment on 14th September I will be able to get them to do this. All I want is a bank statement as it would also be helpful in showing any income or expenditure I am not already aware of.

Hopefully this is what will happen. I didn't have this problem when DH died as there was no IHT to pay.

So they aren’t obstructing you applying for GOP, they just need your id and dc and they’ll be able to provide DOD balances.
Can you imagine how angry you’d be if your bank gave your account balances to someone saying you’d died without confirming you’d actually died.

I think you’ve just managed to speak to idiots so far. There’s no way a bank could still be operating a procedure for GOP before release of details as it just doesn’t make sense, as I know you’re aware.

I work for a bank and can well imagine you getting through to one of our new people (or even a more seasoned but daft advisors) and getting the wrong information.

My tactic for sorting things is usually to just keep reconnecting and hoping to eventually speak to someone with a brain cell.

It’s not ok that this is happening though. They should have a rock solid bereavement procedure, that everyone understands. They have a duty to protect vulnerable customers and the bereavement area is going to be highly vulnerable due to the nature of the need for contact.

I think that’s unfair. The bank haven’t even seen sight of a DC. There’s no way they’ll provide bank statements for someone’s account without seeing sight of these.

This was also my experience, albeit with death certificate, The standard response seems to be ‘we can’t do anything without a grant of probate’ without the person understanding the process and that account balances are required for the grant application. I got so fed up with the nonsensical replies from my DM’s bank (on their dedicated bereavement line) that I made a complaint. Bank was very apologetic and sent me a hamper, but no doubt grieving relatives are still subject to the same nonsense from completely clueless staff.
my dm has accounts with other banks eg Atom and they were so much better!

But you can just estimate for the purposes of the grant and then you’ll have the accurate figures for the IHT400. If the estate is close to taxable anyway then you should do the return either way so if you put the accurate figures on there it will be fine either way

Yes I would be angry if my bank did that.
But so far I have been told they definitely need the GOP before they can release any information, even though I have the will and death certificate. I am sure my deceased relative would find this ridiculous too.

This is what I am hoping; and that when I have the in person meeting I will get somewhere.

I agree.Rhey do need to see the death certificate. But when I asked what documentation they needed in order to be told the balances, they insisted they needed the DC, will, ID and GOP. They said until I had all of those they could not release any information.

I do not want to estimate the amount as this bank balance is possibly the largest figure in the estate; and the amount of IHT due depends on it. If he had transferred some elsewhere or spent a lot of it I would then need to apply for a refund from HMRC, or it may mean there is no IHT due at all.

I agree you will probably have to speak to lots of people before you find someone who actually understands that they are allowed to do this and you cannot wait for grant of probate, it’s ridiculous but this is the kind of staffing we have now

Which bank op?

Crazy situation. We are just going through my FIL estate. Huge with a lot of IHT to pay which you have to pay before grant of probate is given. Our solicitor just wrote out to all the institutions and they sent the balances as if date of death. They clearly don't understand how the system works if they want GOP before giving balances. But yes you do need proof you are executor and the death certificate.

Sounds like they are confusing what stage of the process they are at.

the branch staff may be able to help, but often it needs to go to a dedicated bereavement team.

I’m not sure from your posts if that is who you’ve spoken to yet? But if not, and the branch staff are not able to help, then ask them to connect you to bereavement team. Most branches will have phones you can use, so don’t be fobbed off with being told to go home and call from there!

They have an obligation under the FCA to treat bereaved customers fairly and efficiently, so if you are still not getting the information you need after speaking to the bereavement team, then next step would be a formal complaint - and don’t be afraid to tell them that you will need to raise it formally if they continue to obstruct the process.

But you’re confusing two processes here.

Step one is grant of probate, you estimate estate figures into here and it tells you to do an inheritance tax return if you are close to the threshold for IHT. Therefore even if no tax is due the inheritance tax return from may need to be completed anyway.

Step two is inheritance tax return (IHT400). This is where you need exact figures as it determines if you pay any tax or not and exactly how much is due. This is the point where you need exact figures as this is what determines the tax, and at this stage you’ll have the grant and therefore can obtain this

Just to add that you may need to to the inheritance tax return before probate is granted depending how long it takes, but it even says on the .gov site that you can use estimated figures in the initial return