Concerned about ex H arranging contraception appointment for our vulnerable (just) 15-year-old daughter.

[IhateSPSS]

For context, my daughter has been struggling with her mental health for the last couple of months. It's really escalated in the last couple of weeks. She's been self harming, and she's been referred to the Mental Health Support Team at school and on the waiting list for counselling (12 months wait) I have just been dosing her in love as an approach but have felt confused about where this escalation has come from.

There was an incident last night where she got upset so I sat her down and had a decent, open talk. Turns out her dad spoke to her a few weeks ago and said 'I think it's looking like you are reaching the point with X (her boyfriend) where it's looking likely you are going to have sex so I think you should go on the pill. I'll make you a doctor's appointment'. This doctors appointment is on Tuesday and he's going to ask for her to go on the pill for her painful periods, but she says it's so she's on contraception. I have had endo & a hysterectomy for gynae issues, and said I think I should take her with my experience and he has refused. She only turned 15 a week ago and her boyfriend is 14. I don't think they are ready and told her this and I think she needs to be stronger emotionally for a huge life event. She said it's not my choice and has the green light from her dad to go ahead.

I emailed him voicing my concerns (we split up in 2015, he was physically, sexually and financially abusive, came out as high risk at MARAC, we only have email contact for my safety) - he replied saying he 'wanted to fully understand where they were up to in terms of sleeping together. I suggested that going on the pill might be an option and basically you don't wait until you've had sex before you start...things start to happen at their age.'

I can't tell you why but something feels off in my gut. Ex was very coercively controlling of me and the DC and I feel like he's managing DD's entry into sexual activity and I think it's weird. I'm a realist and I know teenagers do this but less than three weeks ago she was saying she wasn't ready...now she's seeing a health professional about contraception. It feels a vital step is missing in that she hasn't considered if she's emotionally ready and also whether it's a good idea to 1. Become sexually active with serious emotional difficulties going on 2. Start to mess with your hormones on top of this.

Ex is ignoring me now. I'm planning on contacting the GP tomorrow but know they can't break patient confidentiality and don't need parental permission to issue contraception. I know some of you will say he's being responsible etc but he didn't do this with our oldest child (DS), he's going to lie to the GP about the period issue and he's displaying alienating behaviours by not involving me on something so important. But most of all I'm worried about the impact this is having on DD, she seems confused, her dignity & private life is being 'managed' and her distress seems to have escalated since that conversation. Anyone got any advice or similar experience?

@AliceMcK If the 15 yo daughter is happy to go to dad's and wants to go to dad's, nobody can stop her from doing so. Likewise, if she doesn't want to go, then nobody can make her at that age.

Is there anything to stop you showing up at the appointment too?

This screams sexual abuse.

Have you considered this op?

This kind of hyperbole is so unhelpful. Firstly it's her ex, obviously, not her DP. And for what? I appreciate that people are getting bad vibes from the father but what exactly are you reporting? A parent wants their daughter to go on the pill at age 15? This is not a safeguarding issue, in the absence of other evidence!

I’m stunned anyone here is treating this like it’s ambiguous or possibly OK.

OP only has email contact with this man for her own safety and he has a history of being sexually abusive to her.

His daughter has sudden unexplained severe mental health issues including self harm, and he is insisting she go on contraception and that HE must be the one who makes this happen, which he will do so via lying to the doctor. He is refusing to let her mother take her to her own gynaecologist even though that’s what makes most medical sense.

Hello??? Nothing about this is normal.

If there is even the smallest chance your daughter is going to have sex, she needs to be prepared with two forms of birth control at least one of which protects her from disease transmission.

You can either take action and help her make a just in case plan or you can leave it to your XH. If it were my daughter, I would be jumping ahead and taking charge myself.

being prepared with a plan does not preclude having recurring conversations that emphasize not having sex until you are completely ready is the best choice.

Huge red flags here OP, deep down you know this, even if you don’t want to be thinking the unthinkable. NSPCC helpline can be really useful to talk things through with.

‘My issue is it feels like her Dad is inducing her into becoming sexually active. He wants on her the pill. I'm questioning why all of a sudden thre was a covered up rush to book her into the GP after 1 day off school after a bad period.’

You say she has had time off school with a bad period. Is there any chance he doesn’t want this to escalate into a monthly occurrence? His reason to the GP (bad periods) is correct if she is taking time off school. Was this when she was with you or him?

I actually think her going on the pill is sensible if her relationship could be heading towards having sex in the next few months.

Could it be she asked him to take her?

Or are you concerned he could be sexually abusing her?

Another one here saying I would be concerned her dad is grooming her. If he was a single dad or she had no responsible female relative to talk to about her sexual health then it would be appropriate for him to take the lead on this. But that's not the case here.
Also, the pill messed with my mental health so much that I was diagnosed with EUPD by a psychiatrist (who never thought to ask if I was on any hormonal contraception 🙄). When I came off the pill years later to TTC - and for the 8 years since then - my "personality disorder" completely vanished.

I mean step in and stop it if you like but would you rather she come home pregnant? 14/15 relatively normal.

What does she actually want? Will she want you to stick your oar in and cause problems?

Sexual abuse by the father.

1. He has a history of being abusive
2. He is asking his daughter to say that she has painful periods.
3. What father encourages sex with teen daughter?

Thanks all. I have formulated an email to the GP and school. I also spent until gone 1am talking to DD on the phone - at first I got limited one word answers but I eventually got to speak to her properly. I pushed her more on what the appointment was for - it's definitely been put through e-consult for her period pain but her & her Dad think 'kill two birds, one stone' & ask about contraception. I advised her to ask to talk to the GP alone about that.

She also agreed to come to the GP with me, to talk about her mental health. I'll make an appointment to go with her this week. She said she 'doesn't know' why her MH has declined and I asked if she'd like to spend more time here and she said she likes both houses. I asked her if there was anything she can think of that I need to know to keep her safe and she said no, she doesn't know why she suddenly feels like this.

Thanks all.

I'd be worried too OP.

Working with children, I have come across abusive fathers speaking for their teenage daughters in GP appointments before, in order to strongly control the narrative/ prevent the child telling the GP anything.

Agree to report to GP and school. The posters saying "report what?", remember safeguarding works by people reporting suspicions and allowing a picture to be built. It's very different from reporting to the police. Like a PP said, if I knew OP, I'd feel a duty to report this myself.

Obviously sexual abuse from the father is the worst case scenario here, but regardless, he's also not taking into consideration the potential for negative psychological effects of the pill, when his DD is already self harming.

Why are you talking to her at 1 in the morning??? It sounds like she is being pulled in different directions by both of her parents here. You need to be very careful - you’re sounding as controlling as you say her father is.

1. not to his DD, and let’s be clear here, if he were that bad, how come his DD is allowed to stay over with him, and wants to do so?
2. The OP has said that DD has painful periods, so that’s not a lie.
3. Taking contraception at 15 is a sensible approach as a precaution. It is not a green light to go ahead and have sex with the next boy who comes along. Would you prefer she sneaker around behind her parent’s back and came home pregnant?

Okay… I guess I may have met more abusers than you.

Because she wanted me to stay on the phone with me and was talking to me about how she's feeling and I'm worried about her?

I'm leaving this thread now because there is obviously lots of back story, including police & social care & courts, which spans years, is very identifiable and actually I didn't want to share that. I just wanted specific advice on him seeking two strands of healthcare for her (gynae and contraception) and blocking me out of that process. Thanks to those who have been helpful and told me where I stand on that.

I think there are enough red flags for you to alert professionals.

I would contact the doctors surgery for starters. Patient confidentiality may prevent them telling you stuff but it doesn't prevent you telling the surgery things.

A teenage child with recent significant decline in mental health who spends time alone with a man who has previously been accused of sexual abuse and that man is insisting on attending a contraceptive appointment so he can lie to the GP all while cutting an otherwise present and attentive mother out, to the point that the child isn’t saying who she wants to go with - just that the decision has been made for her and dad wants to take her doesn’t have any massive red flags?

it may well be a responsible parent - but there are definitely red flags.

No professional could act on a suspicion. This isn't evidence of anything.

Everything points at the fact that he's been SAing her throughout childhood (most likely the reason for her poor mental health) and fully intends to continue after arranging contraception.

You need to face some very hard facts. This is much deeper and darker than him trying to prepare her for adult life with her boyfriend behind your back.

I'm not saying he's not a dangerous man, clearly from what OP said he is. But she also said it's been through the courts so contact must have been ordered by a judge. His abusive history is already known and documented. Spending time with him full stop is probably impacting her mental health, as well as whatever she experienced when the parents were together. But there is nothing in his current behaviour that is evidence that he is or plans to sexually abuse her, and absolutely nothing that social services could do.
OP needs to use her relationship with her DD to get her to open up about what's happening with her at her dad's and if anything comes from that, there may be something to report. But dad takes his 15 year old to the GP to get contraception isn't a concern anyone could act on.

You feel uncomfortable that a sexually abusive man is involving himself in your daughter's sex life. Completely absolutely understandable.

But to play devil's advocate. A father is seeing his vulnerable teenage daughter with a boyfriend and thinking, she's not strong enough to arrange this by herself, potentially not strong enough to refuse advances from her boyfriend. Certainly not strong enough for a teen pregnancy. As her parent I am responsible for protecting her from something that could ruin her.

A teenage girl with a boyfriend should be on the pill. Quite frankly, any teenage girl should be on the pill as they're not known for their sensibility and you might not know they have a boyfriend or they might not need them to be a boyfriend to have sex with them. Teenagers tend to not make choices considering how it may affect the next 20 years of their life.

OP please also think about whether you want to make an application to the court for the court to determine whether she should take the pill or not. The GP can’t prescribe it if you’ve made an application and this is within the court’s remit (I’m assuming you are England or wales - if not then ignore me). She’s still 15 so the court can still make decisions in relation to her. Find a trauma informed solicitor that specialises in children matters. If you want a recommendation PM and I’ll give you a name (someone I know through work because I’m a divorce lawyer but I rarely deal with children matters and I don’t have extensive DA training). You will need to do this urgently I.e. today if it’s something you want to do.

You’ve said you’ve put together an email to the GP surgery and I would also suggest you send them the email trail with your ex because that highlights his refusal to respond to you and the lie he says he wants to tell. Tell them in the email that in light of your concerns, they must be absolutely sure that they listen to your daughter and follow her wishes and not your ex’s.

Also send it to your daughter’s school and to the local authority. But really you need to decide if you want to take action via an application to court or not, that’s going to be the only way to stop this unless your daughter agrees she doesn’t want the pill. The local authority won’t have the power to prevent this.

I’d be very concerned for her and highly suggest that her appalling mental health is largely down to her Dad but unfortunately I don’t think there is much you can do on the pill issue with him.