Baby Removed at Birth Support

[Mumtobe799]

Hello

This is extremely controversial and I feel embarrassed posting but I’m looking for a bit of help. I am due to give birth within the next few weeks and after Social Services involvement throughout my pregnancy, I have been told they will be removing my baby at birth. Baby will be placed with their Dad under an interim court order whilst assessments are ongoing.

Does anybody know what removal at birth actually means? My baby and I will need to stay in hospital for a few days, is it likely I will be able to stay with them or will they likely split us up? These are questions I have asked Social Services but they will not give me an answer.

I would like to breast feed; is this something Social Services have to support as it is in the best interest of baby. My baby is being removed due to mental health concerns, no issues around substance or alcohol abuse so that being in breast milk isn’t a worry.

If anyone with any legal experience or people who may have gone through or know someone who has gone through something similar can help I would really appreciate it. Thank you.

Does the birth plan have to come from legal? Is it right that when I ask for social worker directly she declines?

I’m confused as she often rings me up asking me to do x y z yet when I ask her questions she mostly tells me to ‘ask legal’ which is really difficult.

@Mumtobe799 the assessment will be carried out as part of the care proceedings.

before the court hearing you will be shown a copy of the local authority evidence and asked to provide a response. Depending on how well you are, you may do your own statement or your legal will file a position statement on your behalf.

part of the LA application will be around their plan to assess you which will likely be by an independent social worker if they have ruled out a mum and baby unit.

the child’s guardian will also provide a view so it would be worth trying to trust them and have a dialogue with them early on so they understand your wishes for your baby and what you would like to happen.

I think with the first response statement I will be ‘leaving it’ as I’ll have just given birth after a c section and be trying to not get post partum psychosis again. Hopefully I can then submit a statement at a later date.

I will 100% be asking for an independent social worker as I feel the services in my area were against me from the start after previous involvement with my older child. Thank you so much for your great advice.

In that period in between, we’re there any plans for custody of your first child to be returned to you? If so I imagine this would bode well for the future, and hopefully means there aren’t additional risks.

As others have said I think SW isn’t being very exact about what will happen as it may depend massively on your health, and making promises they can’t keep would be more upsetting. Are you able to discuss with your solicitor, who either may be able to explain it better than the SW you don’t get on with, or advocate for you to get the decisions made?

@Mumtobe799 My mum had PPP and repeatedly hurt me very badly when I was growing up. I was born in the 70’s and of course there wasn’t the care available then. I know she herself didn’t have a wonderful childhood either, and I am certain that she had other MH issues as a result. While I am pleased for both your kids that this risk is removed, I feel so badly for you. The fear and grief is palpable. You are obviously lonely and feeling so helpless. It would be great if you could show yourself to be more open to engaging with conversations about contraception. Perhaps a surgical would be considered if they are doing a c-section anyway? (Tying/clamping tubes?) Have that chat if you are open to it. Engaging in a positive way about contraception would look good for your engagement with the bossy social worker.

I just wanted to pop back on, not with any advice I'm afraid, but I wanted to say how sorry I am that you've experienced such terrifying mental health issues. I can't imagine how awful it must have been for you. I hope they can facilitate you staying with your baby, or that the separation is very short lived and you get all the help and support you need for this to happen.

I was only thinking yesterday about how heartbreaking it must be for a woman experiencing post partum psychosis (in the context of those who harm their babies). Our mental health is not always within our control, no matter how hard we try to get a handle on it. I’m sorry you’re going through this and wish you and your baby all the best. I hope you can get enough support to allow you some sort of relationship with your baby x

You cannot possibly say this with any authority whatsoever! Why would you?

@Mumtobe799 Some practical advice to help with separation.

get 2 blankets and 2 comforters. Have both with you at hospital and then send one with baby and keep one with you. You can switch these during contact so you both have each others scent with you.

consider recording yourself reading some nursery rhymes or stories and ask dad to play them to baby so they can hear your voice daily.

also consider taking hand and foot prints at the hospital so you have something of baby with you.

Ignore this post, the poster is talking out of her arse. Threads like yours always attract people who have a tiny bit of experience and think that makes them experts.

This is such a sad read and I’m very sorry for you experiences. I cannot imagine the pain that you have experienced dealing with this in the past and will continue to feel.

My only thought that I wanted to share was that as you already know from your first child parenting is a marathon not a sprint. My really good friend was in mental health crisis after her child was born a flare up of her extreme BPD and had a really serious mental health breakdown. In her case family and friends were able to step in and bridge the gap while she recovered which took a long time but for various reasons it was done more informally than your situation.

Now she is better and an ever present constant in her child’s life. Her child is a teenager now and is doing really well. This period will not be forever in your life and hopefully out the other end of it you will be able to be a constant in your children’s lives.

The next bit I say without judgement but the level of trauma that pregnancy puts you through was similar to my friend. The level of worry and trauma you are experiencing with this whole situation only further destabilises your mental health and impacts the involvement you can have with your children. Even though my friend would have loved more children the impact pregnancy and particularly birth hormones had on her mental health meant that her OH refused to countenance any further pregnancies even though my friend would have given anything to have more children, he was not willing to take that risk with her health again. I think you need to seriously consider this as a part of getting to a point of having the best possible relationship with your children for the future. You sound lovely and both you and your children deserve the love you have to give.

I hope that over time your involvement with your children will increase to the level that meets yours and their needs.

I do believe that you will be allowed to name the baby. Babies removed from birth and go into the system (not your situation I know) are given a name by birth mothers and anyone caring for the child is encouraged to keep the name unless for safety and security reasons.

Your solicitor can make ah application for a specialist ISW to assess you when you go to court.

I am so sorry, mental health can be so cruel. It doesn't define you are or how much you love them

But I think you need expert advice not well meaning but potentially ill informed advice on a forum

It's impossible to answer this really but you definitely should be asking your legal to obtain any documents you need that you aren't getting. If there is a good reason not to share them with you you will have it in writing and can challenge it if necessary in court

I am so sad and sorry for you @Mumtobe799 - and I wish you so much luck.

I hope you can trust everyone around you to look after your baby whilst you do everything you can to get yourself better. Getting yourself better and concentrating on that will give you the greatest chance of being able to care for your baby in the future. Xxx

Oh mumtobe, having a mental health condition is not your choice or fault. As you said above, it is a very cruel illness. I'm so sorry you're going through this, and hope you receive good care and support to help you deal with this. ❤🌷

OP I have no helpful advice but just wanted to wish you all the very best for you and your baby. I’m wishing you a fast recovery and good health. It’s obvious how much you care for your children. I really hope you get all the help you need and this will be become a distant memory xx

This is a great post, really helpful to the op thank you

OP your posts are very eloquent IMO and read like you have a lot of insight into your MH issues.

The best thing you can do for your baby and yourself is to keep yourself as healthy as you can - and that means eating healthily and sleeping well. You say you don't want to sleep as you don't want to miss a moment but you say lack of sleep can be a trigger for you, Poor sleep can also affect baby so please, please try to get enough sleep. It's really important for both of you!

Keeping my fingers crossed for you that you're one of the around 50% that doesn't get PPP a second time.

@TheSilkWorm I was wondering, is it normal for a child not to be returned to a mother’s care following post-partum psychosis?

I can see the OP says she had previous PPP which took nearly a year to settle but the child wasn’t returned. Prior to this pregnancy OP was seeing her child once a week (unsupervised).

The reason I ask is because if that’s unusual, I wondered if it might indicate that the OP’s mental health difficulties extend beyond PPP, or whether other factors might be relevant. And that’s significant because it might have a bearing on some of the practicalities that OP is asking about or the advice she’s being given here.

Absolutely no judgement, just in case that seems to be implied. My heart is honestly breaking for OP, I can’t imagine having to contemplate this and I think she’s being incredibly brave. It just might be useful to get an idea of the likely wider picture,

I have no advice but just wanted to send you lots of love and well wishes for your upcoming new arrival. I hope everything works out for you xx

Haven’t RTFT but wanted to add the experience of someone close to me who was in a similar situation.

After birth mum got a cuddle with baby, she was then admitted to the NICU for monitoring of withdrawal and “safe keeping”. Mum could visit, hold baby and breastfeed.

Obviously everyone’s situation is wildly different but just wanted to share one (of many) potential outcomes

I didn’t have mental health issues before my first pregnancy. I was under the standard midwife with no additional support or medication.

I believe I got a particularly bad case of Post Partum Psychosis and my symptoms were quite extreme and focused around some difficult themes.

It took me a year to get better, at times I didn’t even understand I had given birth a baby, I thought they were someone else’s.

My child’s Dad was given custody as they needed permenance which at the time I could not offer. Social Services closed the case with me seeing my child unsupervised a minimum of once per week, but quite often I would see them a lot more.

I probably would have had 50/50 custody by now if I wouldn’t have got pregnant again and that’s something I have to deal with. Stupidly, I didn’t think it would happen again. I think the difficulty professionals have is my psychotic symptoms have had themes that were not nice at all and due to them I have attempted to harmed myself which is seen as harming baby due to pregnancy.

I absolutely adore both of my children and they be never come to any form of harm in my care but I understand due to my symptoms that professionals are cautious.