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Childs mother has refused contact due to covid-19 - help?

76 replies

JugglingaBoxofFrogs · 22/03/2020 18:55

My son has a four year old child and since he split with his ex over 2 years ago, they have had shared care (1 week on, 1 week off). This has worked well and has ensured stability and routine for the child.

Last year they had to go to mediation because she decided that she should have their child more often (read - when it suited her) because she "could not cope with not seeing her child". This resulted in a joint signed agreement at mediation that the 50/50 arrangement would stand and they were both happy with this.

My son has a very good bond with his child and, in fact, he is often told that when the child is with their mother, the child is constantly asking to see their father. I will say that when the child is with the father the child never asks to see their mother and often refuses to speak to her when she asks to facetime. My son always encourages his child to maintain this contact even when the child appears not to want it.

The mother is quite self centred and everything appears to revolve around what she wants, not necessarily what is best for the child. The opposite can be said for the Father - he is devoted and his week "on" revolves around what is best for the child.

That's a bit of background.

My son was expecting to collect his child tomorrow as usual, for the week. Yesterday the mother informed him that she doesn't want the child out of her sight because of the virus and because of this, contact has been denied. She has since decided that the child has been showing symptoms since thursday so she is self isolating for two weeks and will decide at the end of the two weeks what she wants to do. My son has spoken to his child this evening, at the childs request. The child said "I'm allowed to go out for a walk but I'm not allowed to be with people because it's too dangerous". This child is 4 years old and has been told by their mother that being around people is too dangerous. I am gobsmacked and, quite frankly, extremely concerned.

I have checked NHS guidelines and apparently if you are showing symptoms you should self isolate for 7 days (not two weeks). If you have been in contact with an affected person, it's two weeks.

I have also checked Cafcass guidelines for contact, and they clearly state that contact should be maintained as normal unless there is a very good reason to change it.

I don't believe for one moment that the child is ill. I believe it is a manipulation to prevent the child from leaving her care. My son is an extremely capable parent and he has always been more hands on than the mother.

My son feels that because he is only the father, there is nothing he can do, that the mother has all the rights, and he's scared that he will be prevented from seeing his child for months. I fully expect the mother to say in two weeks time that she was wrong and that the child is showing symptoms again - sorry if I'm not explaining this very well. Basically, we feel that this will be a permanent cycle until September when, hopefully, the schools will re-start.

Will they have to re-start mediation given that they've already been and have a signed agreement. Will the signed agreement hold any sway with a court? Can the mother basically withhold contact for months, using the coronavirus as an excuse?

Is there anything he can do to resolve this in a timely manner?

Thank you to anyone who can give good advice.

OP posts:
HeyMac · 22/03/2020 18:56

But she's right - being around people is dangerous for the child, her and anyone else they come in to contact with. Why would you be "gobsmacked"?

LaurieFairyCake · 22/03/2020 18:58

It's 14 days because she lives with him

He didn't he'd BEEN for a walk, for all we know she was explaining social distancing to him to apply AFTER the isolation period

He should NOT be going to your sons for 2 weeks.

JugglingaBoxofFrogs · 22/03/2020 18:59

It may be seen as dangerous, my issue is that she's actually told a 4 year old this. In my view it's imprinting on an impressionable young child that being around people is dangerous. There are other ways of dealing with this, rather than scaring a young child.

OP posts:
Queenfreak · 22/03/2020 19:01

I actually completely agree that he should stay in one place. Less people, less risk. Its utterly awful for his dad- and mum should absolutely facilitate as much contact as she can via facetime, emails, calls etc.
And my 2 year old knows there are nasty germs at the moment, and therefore we need to stay home as mu h as possible and we cant see her friends are grandparents.

OhNoNoNoNotThatOne · 22/03/2020 19:01

I know it's not what you want to be told and I know it is hard, and I'm a big fan of maintaining contact, agreed by parents or in court. But I think the mother is right, the less people the child has contact with the better. The way thag things are at the moment I also think the child being told its dangerous is a good thing, they should understand how unsafe things are at present.

I know it's at a detriment to your son, but could they make a daily call /facetime as part of the child's new routine until this is over?

slipperywhensparticus · 22/03/2020 19:01

This says more about you than the mother

The child isnt a toy

JugglingaBoxofFrogs · 22/03/2020 19:01

@LaurieFairyCake that's fair enough.

The only thing is, before she decided the child had symptoms since Thursday (not communicated to the father until this morning) she said that he would not be allowed to see the child until "this is all over". She has changed her story three times in 24 hours. :(

OP posts:
LaurieFairyCake · 22/03/2020 19:01

Well that's not YOUR call Hmm

RoseDog · 22/03/2020 19:02

I think telling the child in a child friendly way is a good thing, the child's whole routine is going to change and they need to know why, I would like to think the mother told the child a child friendly version not just that people are dangerous!

OhNoNoNoNotThatOne · 22/03/2020 19:02

By this I mean the isolation period

AlunWynsKnee · 22/03/2020 19:02

If you live alone it is 7 days. If you have more than one person in the household it is 14 days.

n00bMaster69 · 22/03/2020 19:04

Op you need to have a think about what is best for the child, not what you and his father want.

Set up Skype, maintain communication with him that way.

Isadora2007 · 22/03/2020 19:04

"I'm allowed to go out for a walk but I'm not allowed to be with people because it's too dangerous"
That’s correct- are you gobsmacked because a 4 year old understands the guidance more than you or most of the UK population???

BubblesBuddy · 22/03/2020 19:05

Many parents are making this call right now. Others just keep to the arrangements. I would Skype and ensure the agreement is enforced when safe to do so.

SpeedofaSloth · 22/03/2020 19:05

You don't like her very much, I think.

Wishforsnow · 22/03/2020 19:06

Why would you want the child to be passed back and forth increasing the number of people in contact with. This is in the child's bests interests, how can you not see this?

drspouse · 22/03/2020 19:06

My 5 year old understands that we're doing school at home tomorrow because it's dangerous to have large groups of people. Your son will have to accept this.

Wannabangbang · 22/03/2020 19:07

At the momeny any mixing outside of households isn't safe. Not worth the risk and you and your son will be pleased when all this is over and he remains healthy.

Im doing the same with my children. Harsh though it is anyone visiting that doesn't live here could have coronavirus. Same with an open space visit, the streets are too busy. I want me and my children to remain healthy and when it's all over then things can resume

DaisyintheCloud · 22/03/2020 19:07

I agree with all PP the child should be with as few people as possible as should we all and move between homes doesn’t assist with this. Further, re the self isolating, 14 days is accurate if the mother is showing symptoms and he has been with her. I think your judgement about this public health emergency might have become a little clouded by your desire to see your son and his child spend time together and your obvious dislike of the child’s mother.

Also, I have kids myself. Whilst I haven’t used the word ‘dangerous’ I have had to discuss the situation with them. They can’t go to nursery/school, see grandparents, do classes, have play dates. You think a 4 year old doesn’t need an explanation in those circumstances?!

Marieo · 22/03/2020 19:08

The mother is being sensible. Yes it's sad for your son, but this is a global pandemic, the guidelines are there for a reason. Can he set up a daily facetime session or something?

Spacerader · 22/03/2020 19:08

Me and my partner along with our childrens other parents (we have two children each with other people) have all collectively agreed that for the safety of the children and ourselves we will stop visits at the moment. So my children will stay with us and not visit thier dad, and his children will stay at thier mums and not come to visit. It's hard, but we do lots of facetime and phone calls and the children understand that it's for the safety of everyone and that people moving back and fore between houses is not being responsible.

So whilst your son may be a great dad he needs to put his own feelings and desires to the side for now and accept it. If when this blows over she is still being unreasonable then he has the right to kick off.

JugglingaBoxofFrogs · 22/03/2020 19:17

@RoseDog

Sadly not. The child repeated that being around people is too dangerous. Nothing child friendly about that in my view. If the child had told his father that there's lots of nasty germs around at the moment so it's best to not be with people, that would have been different.

I have to say that I'm a little overwhelmed by the responses. I accept that if the child is showing symptoms, there should be isolation. My son facetimed his child and the child is not coughing, is not presenting any symptoms at all. I accept that there's a difference between being there in person and a facetime call. The child does not have a new cough, a temperature.. nothing. This has all happened on the say so of the childs mother.

Irrespective of whether the child is presenting or not, my initial question still stands. It is our belief that contact will be withheld for months. The mother has stated that my son is very welcome to visit the child at her house at any time and to stay for as long as he wants. That's all fine and could be achieved, but if she genuinely believes the child is ill, surely this would be stupid. It just doesnt add up. :(

OP posts:
floatygoat · 22/03/2020 19:20

Unprecedented times and all that. You will just have to lump it and don't get involved.

Lougle · 22/03/2020 19:21

"The mother has stated that my son is very welcome to visit the child at her house at any time and to stay for as long as he wants."

I think she's right.

SleepyNightOwl · 22/03/2020 19:22

But she's right - being around people is dangerous for the child, her and anyone else they come in to contact with. Why would you be "gobsmacked"?

Exactly. Surely he wants his kid to be safe right? So why is carting him back and forth a good idea at all? I’m self isolating me and mine and none of us are unwell or showing symptoms, I’m just not taking the chances. Even agreed with my Nan that we won’t see each other until it’s over so we can keep each other safe.

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